During John McCain's speech he said..

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  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    spyguy wrote:
    such is life. I'm sure there will be inquiries galore as time goes on. in the meantime we have 2 choices for president and Iraq really wont play much of a role.

    As I said it will not be an issue because the public is distracted by the next shiny object placed in front of them.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    mammasan wrote:
    As I said it will not be an issue because the public is distracted by the next shiny object placed in front of them.

    please dont throw around your "I'm better then everyone else" attitude. Iraq will become a non issue because of improving conditions. troops will start to come home, iraq will take control of their own country, and thats that.
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    spyguy wrote:
    please dont throw around your "I'm better then everyone else" attitude. Iraq will become a non issue because of improving conditions. troops will start to come home, iraq will take control of their own country, and thats that.

    First let me just say you don't know so don't go judging me.
    Second disprove what I said. How many times has this administration, and others, done some extremely shaddy shit only to have it swept under the rug and the public just moves on to the next headline. If you can't have a discussion like an adult about then that's your fucking problem, but don't stand there judging me like some asshole. I have never once attacked you or even remotely judged you so grow the fuck up or go play somewhere else.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • Open
    Open Posts: 792
    spyguy wrote:
    the Iraq war is going to almost become a non-issue IMO. the time table is already being written out.


    Are really this naive?
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    Open wrote:
    Are really this naive?

    are you really this unable to debate?
  • digster
    digster Posts: 1,293
    spyguy wrote:
    please dont throw around your "I'm better then everyone else" attitude. Iraq will become a non issue because of improving conditions. troops will start to come home, iraq will take control of their own country, and thats that.

    You don't think someone's initial judgment to go to war even when the war was fought under false pretenses, regardless of the current state of the country, should be considered and called into question when he may become the next President of the United States? It's probably the most important decision a President could ever make.
  • Solat13
    Solat13 Posts: 6,996
    digster wrote:
    You don't think someone's initial judgment to go to war even when the war was fought under false pretenses, regardless of the current state of the country, should be considered and called into question when he may become the next President of the United States? It's probably the most important decision a President could ever make.

    Then why is Biden on the ticket?
    - Busted down the pretext
    - 8/28/98
    - 9/2/00
    - 4/28/03, 5/3/03, 7/3/03, 7/5/03, 7/6/03, 7/9/03, 7/11/03, 7/12/03, 7/14/03
    - 9/28/04, 9/29/04, 10/1/04, 10/2/04
    - 9/11/05, 9/12/05, 9/13/05, 9/30/05, 10/1/05, 10/3/05
    - 5/12/06, 5/13/06, 5/27/06, 5/28/06, 5/30/06, 6/1/06, 6/3/06, 6/23/06, 7/22/06, 7/23/06, 12/2/06, 12/9/06
    - 8/2/07, 8/5/07
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    - 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 9/21/09, 9/22/09, 10/27/09, 10/28/09, 10/30/09, 10/31/09
    - 5/15/10, 5/17/10, 5/18/10, 5/20/10, 5/21/10, 10/23/10, 10/24/10
    - 9/11/11, 9/12/11
    - 10/18/13, 10/21/13, 10/22/13, 11/30/13, 12/4/13
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    mammasan wrote:
    First let me just say you don't know so don't go judging me.
    Second disprove what I said. How many times has this administration, and others, done some extremely shaddy shit only to have it swept under the rug and the public just moves on to the next headline. If you can't have a discussion like an adult about then that's your fucking problem, but don't stand there judging me like some asshole. I have never once attacked you or even remotely judged you so grow the fuck up or go play somewhere else.

    calm the fuck down guy. dont dish out shit if you cant take it.

    I'm not judging you. I'm basing my comment on yours. there are many people around here with the holier than now attitude. calling all Americans stupid, sheep, being distracted by shiny meddles, etc.

    I'm not saying shit doesnt get swept under the rug. over time it does. but before it does there are many whos voices are heard, congressional hearings, investigations, firings, charges, consequences.
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    Solat13 wrote:
    Then why is Biden on the ticket?

    Good point. The Democrats are not innocent bystanders in this mess. They are just as responsible as the Republicans when it comes to Iraq. Unless they voted No on the war resolution they are in the same boat as Bush & Co. in my opinion.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    digster wrote:
    You don't think someone's initial judgment to go to war even when the war was fought under false pretenses, regardless of the current state of the country, should be considered and called into question when he may become the next President of the United States? It's probably the most important decision a President could ever make.

    absolutely I do. but hell, 2003 was a long time ago, false information was being tossed around as fact.. bush had the support of 99% of congress?

    I believe mccain supported the war more after the fact then before it. which is ok with me.
  • inmytree
    inmytree Posts: 4,741
    spyguy wrote:
    calm the fuck down guy. dont dish out shit if you cant take it.

    I'm not judging you. I'm basing my comment on yours. there are many people around here with the holier than now attitude. calling all Americans stupid, sheep, being distracted by shiny meddles, etc.

    I'm not saying shit doesnt get swept under the rug. over time it does. but before it does there are many whos voices are heard, congressional hearings, investigations, firings, charges, consequences.

    I guess telling it like it is is suddenly the new "holier than now attitude"...
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    inmytree wrote:
    I guess telling it like it is is suddenly the new "holier than now attitude"...

    right, you and mamma are the only ones smart enough in this country to not be distracted by shiny meddles. how dare I question that.
  • digster
    digster Posts: 1,293
    Solat13 wrote:
    Then why is Biden on the ticket?

    Good point. It's not just McCain...many of the Democratic nominees were for the war as well. And they should be held accountable as well.

    But we're not talking about Biden right now. We're talking about McCain. And as I've heard from many Republican supporters in the past week, it's not the No. 2 that counts. It's the No. 1.

    That we would elect someone who through incompetence contributed to the death of over 4,000 (mostly) young soldiers is incomprehensible to me. It's a violation of everything the Presidency is supposed to stand for. Obama may be an empty suit, but give me the empty suit over someone like that.
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    digster wrote:
    Good point. It's not just McCain...many of the Democratic nominees were for the war as well. And they should be held accountable as well.

    accountable how? meaning you wont vote for obama?

    digster wrote:
    But we're not talking about Biden right now. We're talking about McCain. And as I've heard from many Republican supporters in the past week, it's not the No. 2 that counts. It's the No. 1.

    really? LOL then is Palin's lack of experience a non-issue? ;)
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    spyguy wrote:
    calm the fuck down guy. dont dish out shit if you cant take it.

    I'm not judging you. I'm basing my comment on yours. there are many people around here with the holier than now attitude. calling all Americans stupid, sheep, being distracted by shiny meddles, etc.

    I'm not saying shit doesnt get swept under the rug. over time it does. but before it does there are many whos voices are heard, congressional hearings, investigations, firings, charges, consequences.

    I can take it, the point is I never resort to attacking people on this board. I try to be as respectful as possible and don't appreciate it when someone passes judgement on me. What I said is true, it's not pretending to be better than anyone else. You think I like saying that the majority of American voters are either too apathetic, stupid or lazy to get involved. No it's a poor reflextion on my country but unfortunetly it is an accurate depiction of the electorate. The Iraq war is a prime example. How can the greatest foreign policy diseaster in current time, the lies, cover-ups, billions of dollars wasted, contractors bilking the American public be a non-issue. Trust me it's great that we have a timeline for pulling the troops out and I would love nothing more than to see a stable peaceful free Iraq, god knows those people deserve a normal life, but that is not the end of it. Lastly if you think that Congress is going to investigate this or hold Congressional hearings you are gravely mistaken. The Democrats have had control of Congress for over a year now and there has not been one word about investigating the many dealings concerning Iraq. As I said they are chin deep in the shit as well. Also as far as speaking up about it, look what happened to Ron paul when he criticized our foreign policy, labeled a loon and publicaly mocked by Mr 9/11 himself Rudy Guilliani.

    So if my words about the electorate seem harsh to you, well too bad, because I for one am sick and fucking tired of having apathetic, lazy or stupid people, this includes Dems and Reps alike, electing worthless politicians to lead our nation. So if that makes me a god damn elitist then fuck I guess I'm an elitist. I never would have thought that there would be a day when being well informed and concerned would be frowned upon.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    mammasan wrote:
    I can take it, the point is I never resort to attacking people on this board. I try to be as respectful as possible and don't appreciate it when someone passes judgement on me. What I said is true, it's not pretending to be better than anyone else. You think I like saying that the majority of American voters are either too apathetic, stupid or lazy to get involved. No it's a poor reflextion on my country but unfortunetly it is an accurate depiction of the electorate. The Iraq war is a prime example. How can the greatest foreign policy diseaster in current time, the lies, cover-ups, billions of dollars wasted, contractors bilking the American public be a non-issue. Trust me it's great that we have a timeline for pulling the troops out and I would love nothing more than to see a stable peaceful free Iraq, god knows those people deserve a normal life, but that is not the end of it. Lastly if you think that Congress is going to investigate this or hold Congressional hearings you are gravely mistaken. The Democrats have had control of Congress for over a year now and there has not been one word about investigating the many dealings concerning Iraq. As I said they are chin deep in the shit as well. Also as far as speaking up about it, look what happened to Ron paul when he criticized our foreign policy, labeled a loon and publicaly mocked by Mr 9/11 himself Rudy Guilliani.

    So if my words about the electorate seem harsh to you, well too bad, because I for one am sick and fucking tired of having apathetic, lazy or stupid people, this includes Dems and Reps alike, electing worthless politicians to lead our nation. So if that makes me a god damn elitist then fuck I guess I'm an elitist. I never would have thought that there would be a day when being well informed and concerned would be frowned upon.

    if you took offense to my comment I apologize. I wasnt attacking you as a person, I was attacking the comment you made generalizing americans while leaving yourself out.

    when I said Iraq would be a non-issue, i meant in terms of the continuation of the war. that in itself will be a non-issue because of the reasons I stated.

    now will the lies, cover up, wasteful spending, etc be an issue? yes, and I hope it will.
  • Stone Is God
    Stone Is God Posts: 1,331
    mammasan wrote:
    So if my words about the electorate seem harsh to you, well too bad, because I for one am sick and fucking tired of having apathetic, lazy or stupid people, this includes Dems and Reps alike, electing worthless politicians to lead our nation. So if that makes me a god damn elitist then fuck I guess I'm an elitist. I never would have thought that there would be a day when being well informed and concerned would be frowned upon.

    It's frowned upon because the people that are elected want mindless sheep following them around. Independent thinking is frowned upon by both D's and R's. They don't want you to question anything, just move with the status quo of it all.

    They're just going to give us hollow promises. If McCain gets to the White House we'll be in the same stale mate that we've been in for 2 years. These assholes in Congress and the White House want to push their own agendas and not realize the greater good (America) is suffering because of it.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me.
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    spyguy wrote:
    if you took offense to my comment I apologize. I wasnt attacking you as a person, I was attacking the comment you made generalizing americans while leaving yourself out.

    when I said Iraq would be a non-issue, i meant in terms of the continuation of the war. that in itself will be a non-issue because of the reasons I stated.

    now will the lies, cover up, wasteful spending, etc be an issue? yes, and I hope it will.

    I left myself, and I should say that there are many people who do not fit the apathetic, stupid and lazy title, because I am neither of the three. I care about politics, I care about who we elect, I care about the issues and sorry if I sound holier than though but I am neither stupid (even though it seems to be a bad thing in America these days to be well educated and consider yourself an intellectual) nor lazy. So forgive me for not including myself in my description of the electorate but my super massive Northeastern elitist ego felt that the description really didn't pertain to me.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • inmytree
    inmytree Posts: 4,741
    spyguy wrote:
    right, you and mamma are the only ones smart enough in this country to not be distracted by shiny meddles. how dare I question that.

    question away...that's fine...but to simply dismiss by pulling the "holier that thou card" is just lame...
  • spyguy
    spyguy Posts: 613
    mammasan wrote:
    I left myself, and I should say that there are many people who do not fit the apathetic, stupid and lazy title, because I am neither of the three. I care about politics, I care about who we elect, I care about the issues and sorry if I sound holier than though but I am neither stupid (even though it seems to be a bad thing in America these days to be well educated and consider yourself an intellectual) nor lazy. So forgive me for not including myself in my description of the electorate but my super massive Northeastern elitist ego felt that the description really didn't pertain to me.

    right, and everyone else is just stupid and lazy. you rule

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