why the disrespect?

decides2dream · July 2006

few different thread topics, recently and not so recently got me thinking: why do so many choose to be disrespectful when expressing their opinions/thoughts? why does one feel the need to be outright rude when expressing their opinion?

sure, to me it is evident enough if you say..."i don't believe in or agree with X" and give valide reasons why you think/believe as you do, people get the general idea and thus it seems rather unnecessary to continue on to actually insult said thing, that X is a fairytale, one must be ignorant to believe, you're a fool to believe, why do you visit here, comments on the poster rather than the actual post, etc. i don't know, i have seen this with a few topics...religion obviously, abortion rights, homosexual rights, marriage, the whole 'fuck 'em' debate, etc. why does it seem some choose to be insulting rather than merely informative/clear in expressing their views? personally, i find the rudeness/negativity actually hinders and undermines many an otherwise valid opinion/arguement.

merely curious...

Nothingman54 · July 2006

It sucks but thats life, we all do it sometime or another. So many people in one room cant and wont always get along.

decides2dream · July 2006

Nothingman54 wrote:

It sucks but thats life, we all do it sometime or another. So many people in one room cant and wont always get along.

sure, i realize and agree..and hey, we're all guilty from time to time. just seems even for something innocuous, such as someone buying a new car...someone comes on and says 'you're an idiot'...and proceeds to say why, and question the thoughts/motives of the poster, etc. just as an example. i guess b/c we're typing here, i would think perhaps we could pause first. i know we all on occasion hit submit w/o thinking...but the second-guessing of why someone even says what they do, questioning there moods/motives or just generally being insulting, etc...it's sad. i mean, even merely sharing an opinion, no disrespect or emotional language within sometimes garners sarcastic comebacks meant only to be insulting, whatever....just really think it polarizes us. oh well....

tybird · July 2006

Civil discourse is on the endangered species list...............blowhards on both sides of the aisle have so dominated the public discourse for so long that being loud, vulgar and an ass is the only way that people know how to get their point across. It is sad.

brain of c · July 2006

why can't we be friends?

oh, and sorry to the guy i made angry earlier this week who let me have it big time by way of a pm.

my bad.

Boom The Cat · July 2006

People really love to get on their soapbox here, and there are a lotta people bitching, I aint trying to stir shit up, I'm just calling it how I see it.

wolfbear · July 2006

I was thinking the same thing earlier today after reading a few response posts. It seems to kind of go in cycles though, I won't read any "bad" ones for a while and then quite a few pop up. Maybe it's just the summer heat?

tybird · July 2006

brain of c wrote:

why can't we be friends?

oh, and sorry to the guy i made angry earlier this week who let me have it big time by way of a pm.

my bad.

I honestly don't believe that you, of all people, pissed any off.......:)

dotheevolution1 · July 2006

their (rude/disrespectful people's) ignorance entertains me

They can be quite funny.

angelica · July 2006

decides2dream wrote:

sure, i realize and agree..and hey, we're all guilty from time to time. just seems even for something innocuous, such as someone buying a new car...someone comes on and says 'you're an idiot'...and proceeds to say why, and question the thoughts/motives of the poster, etc. just as an example. i guess b/c we're typing here, i would think perhaps we could pause first. i know we all on occasion hit submit w/o thinking...but the second-guessing of why someone even says what they do, questioning there moods/motives or just generally being insulting, etc...it's sad. i mean, even merely sharing an opinion, no disrespect or emotional language within sometimes garners sarcastic comebacks meant only to be insulting, whatever....just really think it polarizes us. oh well....

Great observation, decides2dream.

Lizard · July 2006

People are braver behind a computer -- or maybe they are just assholes in real life too?!

Anyway--i hardly post on this forum. If I want to argue I will talk to my family

brain of c · July 2006

tybird wrote:

I honestly don't believe that you, of all people, pissed any off.......:)

it was so funny. i had just sent free pj dvd's to two members, and the pm i thought would be positive was a flame thrower. and i agree with his bitching.

jeffbr · July 2006

Lizard wrote:

People are braver behind a computer -- or maybe they are just assholes in real life too?!

A little of both, I imagine.

The interesting thing is that if we sat down in a room with some beers, I bet there'd be less disrespect, and less hostility. We may not agree on everything, but we'd still be able to chat.

Often when I'm posting in threads I've got a grin on my face knowing I'm going to stir up the shit a little. That's what Ed does, that's what many posters here do. If we were having a face-to-face conversation, you'd see the grin, and may even grin back while giving your response. Then we'd laugh a little and order another pitcher. There was a little of that at the table I was sitting at in Las Vegas at the CCFA party. Someone started a political discussion and there was a little back and forth, but everyone just smiled, the differences passed, and we went back to enjoying our time. The same conversation on the board may have caused escalation, name calling, etc...

decides2dream · July 2006

jeffbr wrote:

A little of both, I imagine.

The interesting thing is that if we sat down in a room with some beers, I bet there'd be less disrespect, and less hostility. We may not agree on everything, but we'd still be able to chat.

Often when I'm posting in threads I've got a grin on my face knowing I'm going to stir up the shit a little. That's what Ed does, that's what many posters here do. If we were having a face-to-face conversation, you'd see the grin, and may even grin back while giving your response. Then we'd laugh a little and order another pitcher. There was a little of that at the table I was sitting at in Las Vegas at the CCFA party. Someone started a political discussion and there was a little back and forth, but everyone just smiled, the differences passed, and we went back to enjoying our time. The same conversation on the board may have caused escalation, name calling, etc...

well said and i agree, probably VERY true. i guess that's it tho, i don't really see why someone would purposely be rude/disrespectful...especially for some topics such as personal choices/beliefs, i know it can be very offensive. also too, the second-guessing of 'why' someone posts..guessing at their moods/motives...addressing the poster rather than the post, to somehow deflect their opinions? dunno. just struck me a lot lately, so was/am curious what others think of this phenomena, b/c i definitely agree it is inherent to internet culture.

brain of c wrote:

it was so funny. i had just sent free pj dvd's to two members, and the pm i thought would be positive was a flame thrower. and i agree with his bitching.

and you know we love ya for it.

oh and yes...at LEAST whomever had something to say, actually utilized the PM function, instead of attacking you on the board. i think i really take issue with that. you have some friendly posting 'advice' to offer?...or a criticism?...or sure, you just want to tell someone to go and feck off, shove their opinion iup their arse...PMs seem the way to go. would REALLY do much for preserving thread discussions, and just make it a whole lot all-round more pleasant interesting if personal issues, were actually well...kept personal/private. the fact that some feel the need to belittle others publicly serves no purpose at all..and if anything, makes your points that less valid imho. the fact that you got flamed interests me - b/c beyond a few comments about jimi

...i can't even think of one post of yours even remotely offensive, but i at least give the guy/girl credit for having the class/decency to discuss such privately.

Bu2 · July 2006

Compared to another message board I belonged to, this place is extremely nice. You all know how to tolerate, and see other points of view. You might not agree with them, but you don't seem to get nasty about it. It's very refreshing, actually.

Abookamongstthemany · July 2006

jeffbr wrote:

Often when I'm posting in threads I've got a grin on my face knowing I'm going to stir up the shit a little. That's what Ed does, that's what many posters here do. If we were having a face-to-face conversation, you'd see the grin, and may even grin back while giving your response. Then we'd laugh a little and order another pitcher. There was a little of that at the table I was sitting at in Las Vegas at the CCFA party. Someone started a political discussion and there was a little back and forth, but everyone just smiled, the differences passed, and we went back to enjoying our time. The same conversation on the board may have caused escalation, name calling, etc...

I agree. I love the sarcasm and quick wits around here. This place would be terribly boring without it. I enjoy the challenge of trying to come up with a good come back to one of Cincy's quips. There are some truly entertaining masters of wit here like evenflow?, hippiemom, cincy, drew, steppenwolf and hhkc...ok, enough with the circle jerk but you know what I mean.

That being said, I can't stand the personal attacks, harassment and things of that manner. Those are pointless and take no wit at all to come up with.

El_Kabong · July 2006

decides2dream wrote:

few different thread topics, recently and not so recently got me thinking: why do so many choose to be disrespectful when expressing their opinions/thoughts? why does one feel the need to be outright rude when expressing their opinion?

sure, to me it is evident enough if you say..."i don't believe in or agree with X" and give valide reasons why you think/believe as you do, people get the general idea and thus it seems rather unnecessary to continue on to actually insult said thing, that X is a fairytale, one must be ignorant to believe, you're a fool to believe, why do you visit here, comments on the poster rather than the actual post, etc. i don't know, i have seen this with a few topics...religion obviously, abortion rights, homosexual rights, marriage, the whole 'fuck 'em' debate, etc. why does it seem some choose to be insulting rather than merely informative/clear in expressing their views? personally, i find the rudeness/negativity actually hinders and undermines many an otherwise valid opinion/arguement.

merely curious...

that's funny, just the other day i was thinking pretty much the same thing, wondering where all the old conservatives were...drew, stacey, cincy (altho he had stuff to do i think lately)...ppl who i disagreed w/ but there was still a level of respect there. if they replied it would be like you said, 'i disagree w/ you b/c....' now there's ppl who will come to your threads just to make personal attacks and refuse to even address the topic other than making lame jokes. there's even been a few threads i wasn't even in and certain ppl would bring me up and start throwing their insults. you see certain ppl's names in your thread and you just cringe at the thought of having to deal w/ their bs. like cincy, he is a MAJOR smartass, but he's usually on topic...these newer ppl just do it to attack and try to deligitimize your points w/o ever addressing any of them.

some ppl get soooo hostile, i've gotten a few nasty pm's from ppl and i think if it were in person they would be up in ppl's faces shaking their fists and whatnot...others i know i could sit and actually enjoy a conversation w/ and have no hard feelings even tho we end still disagreeing.

RockinInCanada · July 2006

El_Kabong wrote:

that's funny, just the other day i was thinking pretty much the same thing, wondering where all the old conservatives were...drew, stacey, cincy (altho he had stuff to do i think lately)...ppl who i disagreed w/ but there was still a level of respect there. if they replied it would be like you said, 'i disagree w/ you b/c....' now there's ppl who will come to your threads just to make personal attacks and refuse to even address the topic other than making lame jokes. there's even been a few threads i wasn't even in and certain ppl would bring me up and start throwing their insults. you see certain ppl's names in your thread and you just cringe at the thought of having to deal w/ their bs. like cincy, he is a MAJOR smartass, but he's usually on topic...these newer ppl just do it to attack and try to deligitimize your points w/o ever addressing any of them.

some ppl get soooo hostile, i've gotten a few nasty pm's from ppl and i think if it were in person they would be up in ppl's faces shaking their fists and whatnot...others i know i could sit and actually enjoy a conversation w/ and have no hard feelings even tho we end still disagreeing.

Call me a nut but to me IMHO this is what the "powers to be" want for America....a divided nation where politcal allegiance is now branded like a Nike logo...."you goto chuch son...damn your a good Conservative"...God forbide a Liberal could be religious....its just a shame that your country has become this...and unfortunately it is stirring in Canada but so far it is off the radar....but I honesty believe those that hold the ultimate power benefit from this more than any of us can imagine...their biggest oppostion is civilians...but there will be no opposition when the citizens are to busy hate attacking each other on issues that are put there to distract them...if we can get around this branding of political idealogies I think as a community we can get things done...like I said in other posts this message board is a small random example of America/world and you can see we are far away from that point...the only people to really blame for this is, unfortuately, ourselves...the majority ON BOTH SIDES have withered to hateful insults and jabs....where has the era of productive talking gone...are we really that different from each other...I think not...

angelica · July 2006

Rockin'InCanada wrote:

...like I said in other posts this message board is a small random example of America/world and you can see we are far away from that point...the only people to really blame for this is, unfortuately, ourselves...the majority ON BOTH SIDES have withered to hateful insults and jabs....where has the era of productive talking gone...are we really that different from each other...I think not...

I completely agree with you here. It's all of us, whether we want to acknowledge it, or not. It's easy to point at the other guy, it's much more realistic to see that we all contribute to this problem. The only person we can change is ourselves.

I even think the people on this forum are more insightful and more aware than the general population, and if we can't be responsible for civility in our own selves, then the chaos we see in the world is just a reflection of where we each are.

RockinInCanada · July 2006

angelica wrote:

I completely agree with you here. It's all of us, whether we want to acknowledge it, or not. It's easy to point at the other guy, it's much more realistic to see that we all contribute to this problem. The only person we can change is ourselves.

I even think the people on this forum are more insightful and more aware than the general population, and if we can't be responsible for civility in our own selves, then the chaos we see in the world is just a reflection of where we each are.

I though that when writing the post....that the message board was not the absolute best example because a LOT of people here are informed and intelligent and I somewhat doubt we could gather the same percentage from the general populace...but yeah the point that even here, in an area where we agree there are intelligent people...we still end up going down the road of insults...which is too bad...to me its a country rotting from the inside...

angelica · July 2006

Rockin'InCanada wrote:

I though that when writing the post....that the message board was not the absolute best example because a LOT of people here are informed and intelligent and I somewhat doubt we could gather the same percentage from the general populace...but yeah the point that even here, in an area where we agree there are intelligent people...we still end up going down the road of insults...which is too bad...to me its a country rotting from the inside...

I do agree that the "majority on both sides have withered to hateful insults" many a time.

People continue to push their own agendas and condemn and blame the other guy's agenda. It goes on for as long as we can get away with it--until things crash around our feet and we finally come to recognise why it's important that we each own what we own. We own our own part in our problems, and our problem-solving skills or lack thereof. We own and are responsible for our own flaws. It is up to us to grow and expand, rather than to judge and blame our neighbour.

onelongsong · July 2006

decides2dream wrote:

few different thread topics, recently and not so recently got me thinking: why do so many choose to be disrespectful when expressing their opinions/thoughts? why does one feel the need to be outright rude when expressing their opinion?

sure, to me it is evident enough if you say..."i don't believe in or agree with X" and give valide reasons why you think/believe as you do, people get the general idea and thus it seems rather unnecessary to continue on to actually insult said thing, that X is a fairytale, one must be ignorant to believe, you're a fool to believe, why do you visit here, comments on the poster rather than the actual post, etc. i don't know, i have seen this with a few topics...religion obviously, abortion rights, homosexual rights, marriage, the whole 'fuck 'em' debate, etc. why does it seem some choose to be insulting rather than merely informative/clear in expressing their views? personally, i find the rudeness/negativity actually hinders and undermines many an otherwise valid opinion/arguement.

merely curious...

i wonder about this all the time. i thought we were here to present our views; listen to others' views; and make a decision based on the discussion. many times my views were changed by listening to others opinions. lately; i can't post an opinion without someone (usually a canadian) mouthing off.
i guess it makes the poster feel big and strong. maybe it's a superiority complex; or the need to control. whatever the reason; i think it ruins the original purpose and integrity of the board.

decides2dream · July 2006

dotheevolution1 wrote:

their (rude/disrespectful people's) ignorance entertains me They can be quite funny.

actually, many of the rude/disrespectful i do NOT consider ignorant, although sure i imagine some may be....just merely rude/disrespectful. probably why it saddens me even moreso. that an intelligent member of society still feels the need to belittle/behave rudely...it's a purposeful choice on many occasions imho. actually, i think the MT forum manages to behave more civilly than others here, although of course this particular forum is not immune...and thus why i questioned it here. but many an innocuous thread and/or post....personal attacks reign supreme. sad that one may start a thread with the term "discuss"...when in actuality what they really want is "agree with me or feel my wrath." rather pointless and petty.

onelongsong wrote:

i wonder about this all the time. i thought we were here to present our views; listen to others' views; and make a decision based on the discussion. many times my views were changed by listening to others opinions. lately; i can't post an opinion without someone (usually a canadian) mouthing off.
i guess it makes the poster feel big and strong. maybe it's a superiority complex; or the need to control. whatever the reason; i think it ruins the original purpose and integrity of the board.

absolutely.

just goes to show, in reality or in cyberspace...bullies will be bullies. perhaps too, the anonimity and relative safety turns someone into a bully who normally would not behave as such. internet culture fascinates me, and while i think there are many who choose to be as they would in reality, or err on the side of kindness....seems such an environment as this invites others to embrace their base/crude/mean-spirited natures. interesting if nothing else.

Number 18 · July 2006

You know it's funny. I work with a guy and we are both in financial systems and controls. He is about as far right as you can get. I tend to be a conservative liberal. We get into debates all the time. But we both fundamentally respect each other because we both respect each other's opinions and don't get personal with it.

eddies grrl · July 2006

i still say that if we weren't hiding behind our computer screens, we'd be much more considerate of each other. it's alot harder to be obnoxious to someone if there's a chance they'll punch you in the nose as a result.

decides2dream · July 2006

*bump*

after seeing this:

Closed for personal attacks.

Discuss the ISSUE please...without the sniping at each other. Posting privileges are at risk.

Admin

on 4 or 5 threads in this forum alone today...and just lots of nastiness elsewhere...makes me wonder what's going on in these forums...and seemed a good question to consider again.

can't we ALL express our point of view, withOUT getting disrespectful? it's a far more effictive debate device, and your point is taken that much more seriously.

just a thought...

RockinInCanada · July 2006

I'm sorry but after awhile of trying to debate your opinion with someone and then just b/c the other person does not agree with you...I get labelled a Nazi...then the same person has the nerve to PM (after I PM'd him to challenge them to find a Nazi-like comment I never made) me back to say I obviously dont believe Israel is a country (WHAT B/C I DIAGREE WITH THEIR ACTIONS AND I GET CALLED INTOLERANT YET THEY SUPPORT KILLING???????)...its Bs and sorry sometimes you gotta hit back...Im erious there is a limit...I can discuss with many on here who do not hold my opinion just fine...then there are a few that instantly label you name...IMHO they should be banned for that type of crap....Im tired of being called intolerant because I try to stay neutral in this mess and yet I still get slandered....its become a sick place when people label you as a Nazi philospher....and Nakedeye66 I still hold you to that challenge....

farfromglorified · July 2006

decides2dream wrote:

*bump*

after seeing this:

Closed for personal attacks.

Discuss the ISSUE please...without the sniping at each other. Posting privileges are at risk.

Admin

on 4 or 5 threads in this forum alone today...and just lots of nastiness elsewhere...makes me wonder what's going on in these forums...and seemed a good question to consider again.

can't we ALL express our point of view, withOUT getting disrespectful? it's a far more effictive debate device, and your point is taken that much more seriously.

just a thought...

The effects of war reach farther than just the battlefield. Yet another reason to reject all who live by the rule of the gun. Force and violence are airborn diseases.

JaneNY · July 2006

decides2dream wrote:

actually, many of the rude/disrespectful i do NOT consider ignorant, although sure i imagine some may be....just merely rude/disrespectful. probably why it saddens me even moreso. that an intelligent member of society still feels the need to belittle/behave rudely...it's a purposeful choice on many occasions imho.

I think they do it as an attempt to intimidate the person taking the other point of view into shutting up, basically.

giveblood · July 2006

Hmmm ... I think I can agree with the basic points in this thread, but some of the posts sound a tad sanctimonious. I mean, at the risk of making excuses ... Well-intentioned, educated, intelligent people make mistakes and lose their tempers. Who is perfect? This place is very inflammatory recently, and people get goaded. I am not one of those people who thinks that provocation is a good legal defense, but damn. Sometimes you blow your lid, and then you feel REALLY stupid about it, to the point where you worry about your reputation on here being irrevocably damaged.
And people have mentioned the "old conservatives" who didn't used to get personal. Yeah, those people are awesome. But there's a "new breed" of so-called liberal too, some bigoted and provocative stuff gets posted that fuels the fire. Makes me like the people like Abuskedti and El Kabong all the more.

MCG · July 2006

decides2dream wrote:

few different thread topics, recently and not so recently got me thinking: why do so many choose to be disrespectful when expressing their opinions/thoughts? why does one feel the need to be outright rude when expressing their opinion?

sure, to me it is evident enough if you say..."i don't believe in or agree with X" and give valide reasons why you think/believe as you do, people get the general idea and thus it seems rather unnecessary to continue on to actually insult said thing, that X is a fairytale, one must be ignorant to believe, you're a fool to believe, why do you visit here, comments on the poster rather than the actual post, etc. i don't know, i have seen this with a few topics...religion obviously, abortion rights, homosexual rights, marriage, the whole 'fuck 'em' debate, etc. why does it seem some choose to be insulting rather than merely informative/clear in expressing their views? personally, i find the rudeness/negativity actually hinders and undermines many an otherwise valid opinion/arguement.

merely curious...

It always starts off small and grows. Usually somebody feels strongly about something and when someone posts the opposite they get upset and post out of emotion instead of though. Also, some people just like being right and having the last word.

why the disrespect?

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