Do you know you're buying and eating certified Kosher food all the time?

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  • DixieN
    DixieN Posts: 351
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Some people are very specific about what they eat, and like the buying process to be straightforward. and as confusion free as possible in this regard. People with illnesses, and health conscious types tend to make it a priority of understanding what it is they are buying with minimal effort. In general, I think clarity on the label helps every consumer. The implications of allowing cryptic labellings practices to become the norm are wide, and ill advised.

    But everyone knows this already...

    I'm sensitive to dairy. I don't eat products made with cheese, milk or whey. If I do, I get sick. It's easier to see if a food is Kosher than it is to see if has dairy in it. Sometimes the list of ingredients is extensive and in small print--I have bad eyesight, so I have brought products home only to have to return them. I wish someone would put an D in a circle for me so that I could easily, even my half-blind state, see that the product contains dairy.
  • decides2dream
    decides2dream Posts: 14,977
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Thank you.. One logical comprehensive voice. I was beginning to wonder what's going here. I have a bunch of them in my cupboard knowingly. No big deal. I do take issue about the labeling, as should everyone, if they actually used logic to operate their upstairs faculties.

    This place was getting fucking scary until you showed up....lol



    why?

    as to your point in the first post about 'deceptive advertising'...i still don't see it? advertising WHAT? most people DON'T even notice, nor care. i am not religious, don't care one way or another. however, as i said, i live in an area with a HUGE jewish population and for some of them, being kosher is of utmost importance. it does not alter my food in any way, it is a small, discreet label.....so again, i have zero problem with it.
    Stay with me...
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  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    decides2dream wrote:
    why?

    as to your point in the first post about 'deceptive advertising'...i still don't see it? advertising WHAT? most people DON'T even notice, nor care. i am not religious, don't care one way or another. however, as i said, i live in an area with a HUGE jewish population and for some of them, being kosher is of utmost importance. it does not alter my food in any way, it is a small, discreet label.....so again, i have zero problem with it.

    It's all been said and done...
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

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  • decides2dream
    decides2dream Posts: 14,977
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    It's all been said and done...



    i disagree.
    i read through, and i still don't see where there is 'deceptive advertising'....? what are they advertising? how is it deceptive? if someone doesn't know what the symbol means, they can ask anyone who works in the grocery store and find out if they care to know. it really is that simple. as to advertsiing, i don't see ANYthing being 'advertised'...any more than another food being labelled fat free, organic, no trans fats, etc. it is telling you about ingredients and/or how it was packaged/processed. not advertising.
    Stay with me...
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  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    It doesn't really bother me as my girlfriend is Jewish so we eat a lot of Kosher foods anyway. Besides I don't know why it would bother anyone at all. Considering all the shit manufactorers put in foods now-a-days, it being kosher is the least of my worries.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    decides2dream wrote:
    i disagree.
    i read through, and i still don't see where there is 'deceptive advertising'....? what are they advertising? how is it deceptive? if someone doesn't know what the symbol means, they can ask anyone who works in the grocery store and find out if they care to know. it really is that simple. as to advertsiing, i don't see ANYthing being 'advertised'...any more than another food being labelled fat free, organic, no trans fats, etc. it is telling you about ingredients and/or how it was packaged/processed. not advertising.

    You're kidding right? (obviously) You couldn't understand what I'm saying from reading the thread? I guess we can all play make believe while we hash through it all again.

    I want clear concise labeling of food. I I don't want to encounter cryptic logos that I have to look up and vary from place to place to help me identify ANYTHING.

    If I have to ask buddy in the grocery store it's broken. fix it.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
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  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    You're kidding right? (obviously) You couldn't understand what I'm saying from reading the thread? I guess we can all play make believe while we hash through it all again.

    I want clear concise labeling of food. I I don't want to encounter cryptic logos that I have to look up and vary from place to place to help me identify ANYTHING.

    If I have to ask buddy in the grocery store it's broken. fix it.

    Kosher foods are labeled, like I said we have far more to be concerned about when it comes to our food besides it being Kosher or not. Half the ingredients in our food I have no idea what it even is. Maybe that should be more of a concern instead of the the Circled K or U or the PAREVE label on the box.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    mammasan wrote:
    Kosher foods are labeled, like I said we have far more to be concerned about when it comes to our food besides it being Kosher or not. Half the ingredients in our food I have no idea what it even is. Maybe that should be more of a concern instead of the the Circled K or U or the PAREVE label on the box.

    At least they are words, and I can recognize a chemical from basic ingredients like sugar, cocoa, butter, water, salt, flour, etc...quite easily.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

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  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    You're kidding right? (obviously) You couldn't understand what I'm saying from reading the thread? I guess we can all play make believe while we hash through it all again.

    I want clear concise labeling of food. I I don't want to encounter cryptic logos that I have to look up and vary from place to place to help me identify ANYTHING.

    If I have to ask buddy in the grocery store it's broken. fix it.
    You mean you want the government to step in and start writing and enforcing laws against private food manufacturers?

    The different "secret" symbols you're talking about here - which are only secret if the definition of secret is "something RolandTD20Kdrummer didn't know about" - not only designate something as "Kosher," but also the private Jewish organization that designated it. A quick internet search broke it down for me as follows:
    Circled "U" = certified by the Orthodox Union
    cRc = the Chicago Rabbinical Council
    KOF-K (the weird "K" with the flag-looking stuff around it) = KOF-K Kosher Supervision
    K in a triangle = Triangle-K and Associates, Inc.
    K in a star = Star-K Kosher Certification Agency

    There are also quite a few others. Just as with all other religious denominations and their ingrained dogmas, there are different interpretations of what constitutes "Kosher." As such, different organizations have arisen to meet the needs of the "Kosher" market. What you seem to be implying is that the government should step in and "normalize" this labeling practice - essentially taking away from Jews the right to determine for themselves which organization and method to recognize.

    And before I'm accused of "missing the point," I also want to add that none of these symbols are required. It's voluntary. If a food company doesn't want or care about Jewish customers, or they deal in pork, shellfish, or meat in cream sauce, then they don't have to label anything.

    To the vast majority of the population, these symbols mean nothing. They do, however, mean a lot to Kosher Jews and (I shit you not) White Supremacists.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    RainDog wrote:
    You mean you want the government to step in and start writing and enforcing laws against private food manufacturers?

    The different "secret" symbols you're talking about here - which are only secret if the definition of secret is "something RolandTD20Kdrummer didn't know about" - not only designate something as "Kosher," but also the private Jewish organization that designated it. A quick internet search broke it down for me as follows:
    Circled "U" = certified by the Orthodox Union
    cRc = the Chicago Rabbinical Council
    KOF-K (the weird "K" with the flag-looking stuff around it) = KOF-K Kosher Supervision
    K in a triangle = Triangle-K and Associates, Inc.
    K in a star = Star-K Kosher Certification Agency



    There are also quite a few others. Just as with all other religious denominations and their ingrained dogmas, there are different interpretations of what constitutes "Kosher." As such, different organizations have arisen to meet the needs of the "Kosher" market. What you seem to be implying is that the government should step in and "normalize" this labeling practice - essentially taking away from Jews the right to determine for themselves which organization and to recognize.

    And before I'm accused of "missing the point," I also want to add that none of these symbols are required. It's voluntary. If a food company doesn't want or care about Jewish customers, or they deal in pork, shellfish, or meat in cream sauce, then they don't have to label anything.

    To the vast majority of the population, these symbols mean nothing. They do, however, mean a lot to Kosher Jews and (I shit you not) White Supremacists.

    Well if it isn't Kosher, don't put a label. Makes sense. If it is, advertise it so that it also makes sense at face value without the semantics of having to "be in the know"
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

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  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    RainDog wrote:
    To the vast majority of the population, these symbols mean nothing. They do, however, mean a lot to Kosher Jews and (I shit you not) White Supremacists.
    And to people who are into informing the public.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

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  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    At least they are words, and I can recognize a chemical from basic ingredients like sugar, cocoa, butter, water, salt, flour, etc...quite easily.

    So without looking it up can you tell me what Polydimethylsiloxane is?

    Usually the Kosher symbols, The circled U or K, means that it is certified kosher and the Pareve means that their is no dairy or meat in that product. There is no extra additive to Kosher foods it is only different in the manner in which it was prepared. So you are making a big deal about nothing. Like I said I'm more concerned about the shit loads of preservatives, dyes, etc… that is in our foods.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    mammasan wrote:
    So without looking it up can you tell me what Polydimethylsiloxane is?

    Usually the Kosher symbols, The circled U or K, means that it is certified kosher and the Pareve means that their is no dairy or meat in that product. There is no extra additive to Kosher foods it is only different in the manner in which it was prepared. So you are making a big deal about nothing. Like I said I'm more concerned about the shit loads of preservatives, dyes, etc… that is in our foods.

    Probably something not naturally occurring in decent food... what foods is it in?

    Again ...why do I have to learn symbols?

    either print the word Kosher or use the same standard symbol.

    thanks... end of story.

    It's very simple.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    angelica wrote:
    And to people who are into informing the public.
    That would make sense if the public was being kept in the dark. It isn't.

    These symbols are voluntary and they're not some sort of "code." They're essentially association logos - like the American Dental Association and the MPAA.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    RainDog wrote:
    That would make sense if the public was being kept in the dark. It isn't.

    nobody here seemed to know about it...
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • mammasan
    mammasan Posts: 5,656
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Probably something not naturally occurring in decent food... what foods is it in?

    Again ...why do I have to learn symbols?

    either print the word Kosher or use the same standard symbol.

    thanks... end of story.

    It's very simple.

    Fine they could just print kosher on the label, but the point is who cares. The only people who should care are Jewish people who wish to keep kosher. To the rest of society it's a non-issue. I could understand if there was some type of additive in kosher foods that was not in non-kosher foods but there isn't. So again, you are making a mountain out of a mole hill.

    thanks… end of story.

    Also to answer your question, Polydimethylsiloxane is used in Diet Coke, Diet Pepsi and Sprite. It's a silicone based anti-foaming agent.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Probably something not naturally occurring in decent food... what foods is it in?

    Again ...why do I have to learn symbols?

    either print the word Kosher or use the same standard symbol.

    thanks... end of story.

    It's very simple.
    Not, as I mentioned in my post, when there are different interpretations of Kosher. The different symbols determine who did the analysis. If a Jew wants to find out what factors are being used to determine whether the food is Kosher enough for him, he has an easy frame of reference. If you don't want to eat anything Kosher, don't buy a product with an association label on it.

    That's even more simple. I'm surprised at you. As a Ron Paul supporter, I figured you wouldn't want another government bureaucracy (which would be tax funded, of course, unlike the current standard) involved in voluntary religious labelling.
  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    nobody here seemed to know about it...
    As I seemed to know about it - and was easily able to find out even more about it - that doesn't seem to be the case either.
  • decides2dream
    decides2dream Posts: 14,977
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    You're kidding right? (obviously) You couldn't understand what I'm saying from reading the thread? I guess we can all play make believe while we hash through it all again.

    I want clear concise labeling of food. I I don't want to encounter cryptic logos that I have to look up and vary from place to place to help me identify ANYTHING.

    If I have to ask buddy in the grocery store it's broken. fix it.



    obviously if you have NO IDEA what any of the symbols may mean, not exactly very effective advertsing is it? THAt is what i questioned, your choice of words. they are not "advertising"....they are simply marking foods for those who CARE to know, the food is kosher or not. i honestly cannot see a problem with it. this is not 'make believe'...this is making something an issue that is not. it does not change your food, the list of ingredients, what is IN the food, is clearly labeled. your food IS clearly and concisely labeled. some of it just may have further labeling to let those who care that it is ALSO certified kosher. end of story.



    btw - i don't see any agreement with your stance, and sounds to me like many DO know of the kosher symbols. i know i did. so i still fail to see your point.

    c'est la vie.
    Stay with me...
    Let's just breathe...


    I am myself like you somehow


  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    RainDog wrote:
    As I seemed to know about it - and was easily able to find out even more about it - that doesn't seem to be the case either.


    Ok, next time you go to the supermarket make up some cards with a marker, and ask people if they have any idea what the various Kosher labels mean.

    Ever watch Jay Leno jaywalking with the all stars skits?...you'll get the idea real fast..
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")

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