2nd: The founders meant what they wrote about arms

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Comments

  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    69charger wrote:
    What is a reasonable alternative when faced with a potentially fatal threat? Slap fighting? Asking nicely for them to stop?

    Did you read my post?
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    jeffbr wrote:
    It's working pretty well for the Iraqi insurgents.

    Without the 2nd ammendment we'd have no ammendments left. The people who try to deny or rewrite the 2nd ammendment are the people who will be responsible for even more rapid erosions of the liberties we still enjoy.

    How is it working well for the insurgents? The U.S. took over their country with ease and are in control of it and the government. Just because a small bomb goes off every day or so, doesn't mean it's working well.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • jeffbr
    jeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    know1 wrote:
    How is it working well for the insurgents? The U.S. took over their country with ease and are in control of it and the government. Just because a small bomb goes off every day or so, doesn't mean it's working well.

    Do you believe order has been restored to the country? Why are we still there? Why haven't we turned it over to the Iraqi defense forces?

    If you read the thread you'll see that I said Shock & Awe worked perfectly. We cut through the military like a hot knife through butter. If our goal was the total annihilation of the population our military could take the country in weeks. But things are much more complicated than that, and because the citizens are armed, we can't simply walk the streets ensuring order. This is a protracted fight in the streets and alleys precisely because the citizenry is armed.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    the founding fathers' intentions are clear when you read their writings. the people are the 4th branch of government. we "police" the government. this completes the checks and balances our government is founded on.
    as far as iraq; if the iraqis had the right to bear arms; they would have over-thrown the tyrant and we wouldn't be there. think about that.
  • 69charger
    69charger Posts: 1,045
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Did you read my post?

    Yeah I did. You said only police should have guns and then you said maybe they should just have stun guns or tranquilizers.

    So where does that leave the general population? Where does that leave the person waiting for the police to arrive? Where does that leave the people waiting when the police WON'T arrive (like New Orleans)?

    Completely defenseless.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    69charger wrote:
    Yeah I did. You said only police should have guns and then you said maybe they should just have stun guns or tranquilizers.

    So where does that leave the general population? Where does that leave the person waiting for the police to arrive? Where does that leave the people waiting when the police WON'T arrive (like New Orleans)?

    Completely defenseless.

    agreed. police are for clean-up only. police are rarely at the comission of a crime. if the police only carry stun guns; then they are going to a gunfight with a knife; so to speak. the criminals will always have guns. i saw a program the other day which stated that the easiest way to sneek a nuke into the country is to put it in a bale of pot.
    a man with a gun is a citizen. a man without a gun is a subject.
  • 69charger
    69charger Posts: 1,045
    onelongsong wrote:
    a man with a gun is a citizen. a man without a gun is a subject.

    This a cool quote!
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    A majority of gun-related crimes or murders are committed with illegal weapons. Weapons obtained on the black market (which means stolen or brought into the country) illegally.

    Law abiding citizens who buy weapons through legal means, rarely get involved in any criminal activity.

    You people who have this idealistic vision of a country (world) without guns, are not living in reality. The reality is that those with criminal dispositions and intent would still get their hands on guns.

    There would be an awful amount of criminals with guns, and if you think your local police would arrive in time to save your asses; you're seriously deluted and watching way too many cop shows and movies.

    In the real world, it rarely works out that way. If ever.

    The Police for the most part arrive after people have already been killed by a criminal.

    Let's say that in an idealistic fantasy world the government did abolish all guns and put a complete stop to all guns entering the country. Criminals would then attack you and your family with knives, axes or any other sharp object they could get their hands on. What then? Outlaw all knives, forks, and lawn care/wood working tools? But wait, then there's ice picks, letter openers, turkey therometers, pencils, pens...etc...etc.

    What now? Outlaw all sharp objects?

    But wait, there's more. How about blunt objects that can be used for crushing another human being's skull? Outlaw all heavy blunt objects?

    Rocks? Outlaw all rocks! Clean up the landscape of any potentially dangerous rocks!!!

    Shall we all live with nothing but wicker and straw furniture, eating with our hands?

    Essentially, the agrument is not what other use do guns provide. It's about how guns are used and how any other object is used (knives, screwdrivers, an axe, a letter opener, scissors, garden shears...etc)

    Ultimately, history has shown that just about anything can be used to kill a human being. So just about any sharp, blunt or remotely dense and heavy object can be used to kill; and human beings have proven for thousands of years that when they want to kill, even the bone from an animal carcass will suffice.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    NMyTree wrote:
    A majority of gun-related crimes or murders are committed with illegal weapons. Weapons obtained on the black market (which means stolen or brought into the country) illegally.

    Law abiding citizens who buy weapons through legal means, rarely get involved in any criminal activity.

    You people who have this idealistic vision of a country (world) without guns, are not living in reality. The reality is that those with criminal dispositions and intent would still get their hands on guns.

    There would be an awful amount of criminals with guns, and if you think your local police would arrive in time to save your asses; you're seriously deluted and watching way too many cop shows and movies.

    In the real world, it rarely works out that way. If ever.

    The Police for the most part arrive after people have already been killed by a criminal.

    Let's say that in an idealistic fantasy world the government did abolish all guns and put a complete stop to all guns entering the country. Criminals would then attack you and your family with knives, axes or any other sharp object they could get their hands on. What then? Outlaw all knives, forks, and lawn care/wood working tools? But wait, then there's ice picks, letter openers, turkey therometers, pencils, pens...etc...etc.

    What now? Outlaw all sharp objects?

    But wait, there's more. How about blunt objects that can be used for crushing another human being's skull? Outlaw all heavy blunt objects?

    Rocks? Outlaw all rocks! Clean up the landscape of any potentially dangerous rocks!!!

    Shall we all live with nothing but wicker and straw furniture, eating with our hands?

    Essentially, the agrument is not what other use do guns provide. It's about how guns are used and how any other object is used (knives, screwdrivers, an axe, a letter opener, scissors, garden shears...etc)

    Ultimately, history has shown that just about anything can be used to kill a human being. So just about any sharp, blunt or remotely dense and heavy object can be used to kill; and human beings have proven for thousands of years that when they want to kill, even the bone from an animal carcass will suffice.

    exactly! i have many guns and not one has gone off on it's own and killed anything. the hunting arrow; also called broadhead arrow; is the deadliest weapon known besides bombs and wmds. they are also silent. shall we put them on the ban list too?

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