State Constitutional Ban on Gay Marriage

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Comments

  • norm
    norm Posts: 31,146
    jimed14 wrote:
    funny thing, the money was funneled in from OTHER states ... Nevada and Utah notably, The Mormons flooded money in.

    But, the no on 8 folks had a lot of heavy hitters on board too .... many celebs were doing everything they could ... ads, money, etc ...

    I don't honestly know who raised more.


    $73 million

    $35 million yes
    $37 million no
  • jimed14
    jimed14 Posts: 9,488
    cutback wrote:
    $73 million

    $35 million yes
    $37 million no


    well, there you go, as I thought, it was essentially even.
    "You're one of the few Red Sox fans I don't mind." - Newch91

    "I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
  • bootlegger10
    bootlegger10 Posts: 16,296
    So, is this thread appropriate for "The People Have the Power" song quotes, or only in threads where you all agree with the Peoples' decisions?

    This was not a corporation, this was not a legislature, this was not a court, this was the people voting.
  • meistereder
    meistereder Posts: 1,578
    jimed14 wrote:
    funny thing, the money was funneled in from OTHER states ... Nevada and Utah notably, The Mormons flooded money in.

    But, the no on 8 folks had a lot of heavy hitters on board too .... many celebs were doing everything they could ... ads, money, etc ...

    I don't honestly know who raised more.

    That actually makes sense because even though the politicians will say it is up to the states to decide, having gay marriage legal in a state -- any state -- has national implications. Other states have to recognize marriages that were entered into in another state. So other states had a huge interest in making sure no one in CA could enjoy the freedom. If gay marriage had been allowed to sink in here, it would have definitely had to have been enforced in other states.

    Now... interesting issue that I do not know how it will play out. I think there are some 12,000 or so gay marriages that were legally and constitutionally entered into in CA. As far as I understand, the amendment is not retroactive, so those are still valid. If I were the pro-gay marriage people, I would take some test cases and test the waters in court. You could, for example, try to enforce a legal CA gay marriage in another state like Massachusetts who may uphold it. Ultimately, if you had support, you could get into federal court and challenge it. The issue is not dead.
    San Diego 10/25/00, Mountain View 6/1/03, Santa Barbara 10/28/03, Northwest School 3/18/05, San Diego 7/7/06, Los Angeles 7/9/06, 7/10/06, Honolulu (U2) 12/9/06, Santa Barbara (EV) 4/10/08, Los Angeles (EV) 4/12/08, Hartford 6/27/08, Mansfield 6/28/08, VH1 Rock Honors The Who 7/12/08, Seattle 9/21/09, Universal City 9/30/09, 10/1/09, 10/6/09, 10/7/09, San Diego 10/9/09, Los Angeles (EV) 7/8/11, Santa Barbara (EV) 7/9/11, Chicago 7/19/13, San Diego 11/21/13, Los Angeles 11/23/13, 11/24/13, Oakland 11/26/13, Chicago 8/22/16, Missoula 8/13/18, Boston 9/2/18, Los Angeles 2/25/22 (EV), San Diego 5/3/22, Los Angeles 5/6/22, 5/7/22, Imola 6/25/22, Los Angeles 5/21/24, Boston 9/15/24, Ohanafest 2025 (EV)
  • decides2dream
    decides2dream Posts: 14,977
    bootlegger10 wrote:
    So, is this thread appropriate for "The People Have the Power" song quotes, or only in threads where you all agree with the Peoples' decisions?

    This was not a corporation, this was not a legislature, this was not a court, this was the people voting.


    and one can still express disappointment and sadness that their fellow citizens made this choice. that is all. it may be the will of the people of california, but i don't have to be happy about it.
    Stay with me...
    Let's just breathe...


    I am myself like you somehow


  • meistereder
    meistereder Posts: 1,578
    jimed14 wrote:
    well, there you go, as I thought, it was essentially even.


    Lots of money.
    San Diego 10/25/00, Mountain View 6/1/03, Santa Barbara 10/28/03, Northwest School 3/18/05, San Diego 7/7/06, Los Angeles 7/9/06, 7/10/06, Honolulu (U2) 12/9/06, Santa Barbara (EV) 4/10/08, Los Angeles (EV) 4/12/08, Hartford 6/27/08, Mansfield 6/28/08, VH1 Rock Honors The Who 7/12/08, Seattle 9/21/09, Universal City 9/30/09, 10/1/09, 10/6/09, 10/7/09, San Diego 10/9/09, Los Angeles (EV) 7/8/11, Santa Barbara (EV) 7/9/11, Chicago 7/19/13, San Diego 11/21/13, Los Angeles 11/23/13, 11/24/13, Oakland 11/26/13, Chicago 8/22/16, Missoula 8/13/18, Boston 9/2/18, Los Angeles 2/25/22 (EV), San Diego 5/3/22, Los Angeles 5/6/22, 5/7/22, Imola 6/25/22, Los Angeles 5/21/24, Boston 9/15/24, Ohanafest 2025 (EV)
  • meistereder
    meistereder Posts: 1,578
    bootlegger10 wrote:
    So, is this thread appropriate for "The People Have the Power" song quotes, or only in threads where you all agree with the Peoples' decisions?

    This was not a corporation, this was not a legislature, this was not a court, this was the people voting.


    I think people are expressing sadness that the people took a step backwards yesterday. It's also sad that the major theme of the yes on 8 ads was a lie.
    San Diego 10/25/00, Mountain View 6/1/03, Santa Barbara 10/28/03, Northwest School 3/18/05, San Diego 7/7/06, Los Angeles 7/9/06, 7/10/06, Honolulu (U2) 12/9/06, Santa Barbara (EV) 4/10/08, Los Angeles (EV) 4/12/08, Hartford 6/27/08, Mansfield 6/28/08, VH1 Rock Honors The Who 7/12/08, Seattle 9/21/09, Universal City 9/30/09, 10/1/09, 10/6/09, 10/7/09, San Diego 10/9/09, Los Angeles (EV) 7/8/11, Santa Barbara (EV) 7/9/11, Chicago 7/19/13, San Diego 11/21/13, Los Angeles 11/23/13, 11/24/13, Oakland 11/26/13, Chicago 8/22/16, Missoula 8/13/18, Boston 9/2/18, Los Angeles 2/25/22 (EV), San Diego 5/3/22, Los Angeles 5/6/22, 5/7/22, Imola 6/25/22, Los Angeles 5/21/24, Boston 9/15/24, Ohanafest 2025 (EV)
  • meistereder
    meistereder Posts: 1,578
    decides2dream wrote:
    and one can still express disappointment and sadness that their fellow citizens made this choice. that is all. it may be the will of the people of california, but i don't have to be happy about it.


    Keep in mind that throughout history, we have had countless unjust laws that were supported by the majority. Majority rule only means you have more people on your side. It says nothing about whether it's a just law.
    San Diego 10/25/00, Mountain View 6/1/03, Santa Barbara 10/28/03, Northwest School 3/18/05, San Diego 7/7/06, Los Angeles 7/9/06, 7/10/06, Honolulu (U2) 12/9/06, Santa Barbara (EV) 4/10/08, Los Angeles (EV) 4/12/08, Hartford 6/27/08, Mansfield 6/28/08, VH1 Rock Honors The Who 7/12/08, Seattle 9/21/09, Universal City 9/30/09, 10/1/09, 10/6/09, 10/7/09, San Diego 10/9/09, Los Angeles (EV) 7/8/11, Santa Barbara (EV) 7/9/11, Chicago 7/19/13, San Diego 11/21/13, Los Angeles 11/23/13, 11/24/13, Oakland 11/26/13, Chicago 8/22/16, Missoula 8/13/18, Boston 9/2/18, Los Angeles 2/25/22 (EV), San Diego 5/3/22, Los Angeles 5/6/22, 5/7/22, Imola 6/25/22, Los Angeles 5/21/24, Boston 9/15/24, Ohanafest 2025 (EV)
  • decides2dream
    decides2dream Posts: 14,977
    meistereder wrote:
    Keep in mind that throughout history, we have had countless unjust laws that were supported by the majority. Majority rule only means you have more people on your side. It says nothing about whether it's a just law.



    exactly.


    thus why it oftentimes is so unbelievably frustrating.


    i also realize that many who were not at all for obama, for example, feel that very same frustration, so i know full well it's all dependent on our own pov...but truly, equal rights should be equal rights! there is personal pov, and there is 'right'...and sometimes, it really does come down to that. and this is spoken/written by someone who very much resides in the grey areas of thinking for much in this world.
    Stay with me...
    Let's just breathe...


    I am myself like you somehow


  • jimed14
    jimed14 Posts: 9,488
    I think in time ... hopefully in our lifetime ... this will change.

    It's a generational thing .... it took a long time for the idea of a African American candidate for president to be come a reality, and indeed, it was the youth that helped this come true ...

    I'm sure, in time ... the tollerant will eventually outnumber the intollerant.
    "You're one of the few Red Sox fans I don't mind." - Newch91

    "I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
  • Enkidu
    Enkidu So Cal Posts: 2,996
    You know what else is interesting? It's the lesson our children are taught. My daughter is 12 and since preschool she's had classes with children with gay parents. So she's been brought up thinking that that was no big deal. Heterosexual parents, gay parents, divorced parents. And yeah, I live in LA. But my daughter was very upset about Prop 8, she didn't think it was fair. They voted on it at her school (she'll hear the results today).

    So as Jimed14 says, maybe in our lifetime it will change. I hope.
  • AmentsChick
    AmentsChick Posts: 6,969
    I fought like crazy to keep this from happening. Those of you outside of California may not realize the degree of hatred and anamosity that this measure brought out in people. I'm sick and saddened that prop 8 passed. We took a huge step forward with Obama...and (in my opinion) an even bigger step back with the passing of the ban on gay marriage.
    This is the greatest band in the world -- Ben Harper

  • meistereder
    meistereder Posts: 1,578
    Enkidu wrote:
    You know what else is interesting? It's the lesson our children are taught. My daughter is 12 and since preschool she's had classes with children with gay parents. So she's been brought up thinking that that was no big deal. Heterosexual parents, gay parents, divorced parents. And yeah, I live in LA. But my daughter was very upset about Prop 8, she didn't think it was fair. They voted on it at her school (she'll hear the results today).

    So as Jimed14 says, maybe in our lifetime it will change. I hope.


    Sounds like your daughter is very well adjusted. There are many people who would suggest that your daughter is worse off for being exposed to other kids with gay parents. Those people are ignorant and are afraid of gay people for some reason. But they won yesterday with this amendment. Not sure what else to say.
    San Diego 10/25/00, Mountain View 6/1/03, Santa Barbara 10/28/03, Northwest School 3/18/05, San Diego 7/7/06, Los Angeles 7/9/06, 7/10/06, Honolulu (U2) 12/9/06, Santa Barbara (EV) 4/10/08, Los Angeles (EV) 4/12/08, Hartford 6/27/08, Mansfield 6/28/08, VH1 Rock Honors The Who 7/12/08, Seattle 9/21/09, Universal City 9/30/09, 10/1/09, 10/6/09, 10/7/09, San Diego 10/9/09, Los Angeles (EV) 7/8/11, Santa Barbara (EV) 7/9/11, Chicago 7/19/13, San Diego 11/21/13, Los Angeles 11/23/13, 11/24/13, Oakland 11/26/13, Chicago 8/22/16, Missoula 8/13/18, Boston 9/2/18, Los Angeles 2/25/22 (EV), San Diego 5/3/22, Los Angeles 5/6/22, 5/7/22, Imola 6/25/22, Los Angeles 5/21/24, Boston 9/15/24, Ohanafest 2025 (EV)
  • Vedderlution_Baby
    Vedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    Prop 2 passed in Florida too.
  • pearljamjen
    pearljamjen Posts: 13,578
    jimed14 wrote:
    I think in time ... hopefully in our lifetime ... this will change.

    It's a generational thing .... it took a long time for the idea of a African American candidate for president to be come a reality, and indeed, it was the youth that helped this come true ...

    I'm sure, in time ... the tollerant will eventually outnumber the intollerant.

    I sure hope so. I've been pretty depressed about this. I wanted to be so happy that Obama won but I can't be happy right now.

    The comfort I take is that yesterday, walking around the campus where I work, there were so many students wearing "No on 8" signs. And there were signs all over the campus. Not one "yes" sign. Gives me hope for today's youth.

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