So the US sold chemical weapons to Iraq...

sponger · February 2007

I've been trying to dig up some sources on this, and all I've been able to find are tidbits of info regarding the sale of anthrax, bubonic plague , and other various germ samples.

If I understand it right, Saddam's chemical weapon of choice was mustard gas mixed with nerve agents.

So, from who was Saddam getting the chemical weapons that he actually used?

fuck · February 2007

The Vatican.

flywallyfly · February 2007

Here is one of the salesmen.

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/_/1/saddam_rummy.jpg&imgrefurl=http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blsaddamrumsfeld.htm&h=240&w=468&sz=15&hl=en&start=4&tbnid=OqHvtxngzM8DOM:&tbnh=66&tbnw=128&prev=/images%3Fq%3Drumsfeld%2Band%2Bsaddam%2Bhussein%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den

sponger · February 2007

flywallyfly wrote:

Here is one of the salesmen.

According to google, Rumsfeld is guilty of not criticizing saddam for using mustard gas and nerve agents, but it doesn't say anything about selling those things to him.

gue_barium · February 2007

I believe it was Dow Chemical. I think the chemicals were sold as pesticides.

sponger · February 2007

gue_barium wrote:

I believe it was Dow Chemical. I think the chemicals were sold as pesticides.

According to this washing post article, Dow chemical made that sale in December 1988, which is after the gassing of the kurds and way after the gassing of the iranians.

In December 1988, Dow Chemical sold $1.5 million of pesticides to Iraq, despite U.S. government concerns that they could be used as chemical warfare agents.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A52241-2002Dec29?language=printer

And according to this website, analysis of mustard gas found by the UN showed that it did not originate from the US.

The UN report provides only negative evidence of the origin of the mustard gas sample. The absence in the sample analysed in Sweden and Switzerland of polysulphides and of more than a trace of sulphur indicates that it is not of past US-government manufacture, for all US mustard was made by the Levinstein process from ethylene and mixed sulphur chlorides.

http://www.iranchamber.com/history/articles/chemical_warfare_iran_iraq_war.php

And that link also says that it's possible that Iraq had actually been making its own mustard gas since the 1970's.

Unidentified US intelligence sources have been quoted as saying that Iraq began making mustard gas in the early 1970s.

So, the question remains: Did the US sell to Saddam the chemical weapons that he actually used?

gue_barium · February 2007

sponger wrote:

According to this washing post article, Dow chemical made that sale in December 1988, which is after the gassing of the kurds and way after the gassing of the iranians.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A52241-2002Dec29?language=printer

And according to this website, analysis of mustard gas found by the UN showed that it did not originate from the US.

http://www.iranchamber.com/history/articles/chemical_warfare_iran_iraq_war.php

And that link also says that it's possible that Iraq had actually been making its own mustard gas since the 1970's.

So, the question remains: Did the US sell to Saddam the chemical weapons that he actually used?

"Did the US?"
A chemical corporation did.

sponger · February 2007

gue_barium wrote:

"Did the US?"
A chemical corporation did.

A US chemical corporation with permission from the State Dept. The question is which corporation, if any, and when.

tybird · February 2007

It was my understanding that the weapons do have a U.S. origin and were probably sold during the Iran-Iraq war. If I was researching the issue, I would look at info available on that war.

If they had been producing mustard gas on their own, wouldn't the manufacturing facility been shown as proof during the U.S.'s recent great WMD hunt?

sponger · February 2007

tybird wrote:

It was my understanding that the weapons do have a U.S. origin and were probably sold during the Iran-Iraq war. If I was researching the issue, I would look at info available on that war.

If they had been producing mustard gas on their own, wouldn't the manufacturing facility been shown as proof during the U.S.'s recent great WMD hunt?

The UN all but completely dismantled Iraq's WMD machine after the Gulf War, so I wouldn't have expected it to be around during the recent hunt.

And researching the war is what I've been doing, and I've only been able to find stuff on pesticides, anthrax, and a few miscellaneous germs.

So far, I can't find anything on mustard gas and nerve agents being sold to Saddam by the US or entities operating within the US.

gue_barium · February 2007

THE US and Britain sold Saddam Hussein the technology and materials Iraq needed to develop nuclear, chemical and biological weapons of mass destruction.

Reports by the US Senate's committee on banking, housing and urban affairs -- which oversees American exports policy -- reveal that the US, under the successive administrations of Ronald Reagan and George Bush Sr, sold materials including anthrax, VX nerve gas, West Nile fever germs and botulism to Iraq right up until March 1992, as well as germs similar to tuberculosis and pneumonia. Other bacteria sold included brucella melitensis, which damages major organs, and clostridium perfringens, which causes gas gangrene.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/0908-08.htm

sponger · February 2007

gue_barium wrote:

THE US and Britain sold Saddam Hussein the technology and materials Iraq needed to develop nuclear, chemical and biological weapons of mass destruction.

Reports by the US Senate's committee on banking, housing and urban affairs -- which oversees American exports policy -- reveal that the US, under the successive administrations of Ronald Reagan and George Bush Sr, sold materials including anthrax, VX nerve gas, West Nile fever germs and botulism to Iraq right up until March 1992, as well as germs similar to tuberculosis and pneumonia. Other bacteria sold included brucella melitensis, which damages major organs, and clostridium perfringens, which causes gas gangrene.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/0908-08.htm

The findings of that committee are posted all over the web, yet commondreams is the only site to add "VX gas" into the mix. And considering that commondreams undeniably has a left-wing agenda, I can't help but be compelled to take this particular link with a grain of salt.

It still leaves the question regarding mustard gas unanswered anyway.

gue_barium · February 2007

sponger wrote:

The findings of that committee are posted all over the web, yet commondreams is the only site to add "VX gas" into the mix. And considering that commondreams undeniably has a left-wing agenda, I can't help but be compelled to take this particular link with a grain of salt.

It still leaves the question regarding mustard gas unanswered anyway.

I gotta believe the agents/chemicals to make mustard gas weren't sent in a mustard gas how-to kit, but they were sent.

http://www.metroactive.com/papers/metro/02.20.03/iraq-0308.html

U.S. Firms That Supplied Iraq's Weapons Program*
1.Honeywell (R, K)
2.Spectra Physics (K)
3. Semetex (R)
4. T.I. Coating (A, K)
5. Unisys (A, K)
6.Sperry Corp. (R, K)
7. Tektronix (R, A)
8. Rockwell (K)
9. Leybold Vacuum Systems (A)
10. Finnigan-MAT-U.S. (A)
11. Hewlett-Packard (A, R, K)
12. Dupont (A)
13. Eastman Kodak (R)
14. American Type Culture Collection (B)
15. Alcolac International (C)
16. Consarc (A)
17. Carl Zeiss--U.S. (K)
18. Cerberus (LTD) (A)
19. Electronic Associates (R)
20. International Computer Systems (A, R, K)
21. Bechtel (K)
22. EZ Logic Data Systems, Inc. (R)
23. Canberra Industries, Inc. (A)
24. Axel Electronics, Inc. (A)

Key:
A = nuclear weapon program
B = biological weapon program
C = chemical weapon program
R = rocket program
K = conventional weapons, military logistics, supplies at the Iraqi Ministry of Defense, and building of military plants

*According to the German daily newspaper Die Tageszeitung, which identified this list as a since-deleted portion of Iraq's 11,000-page report to the U.N. Security Council.

sponger · February 2007

OK, so there's no conclusive evidence that US entities sold to Saddam the chemical weapons that he actually used, but there is plenty of evidence that he purchased from US entities just about every other chemical weapon in existence. So, one would have to infer out of common sense that the weapons he actually used were purchased in some form or another from US entities at some point in time.

Thanks.

beachdweller · February 2007

sponger wrote:

I've been trying to dig up some sources on this, and all I've been able to find are tidbits of info regarding the sale of anthrax, bubonic plague , and other various germ samples.

If I understand it right, Saddam's chemical weapon of choice was mustard gas mixed with nerve agents.

So, from who was Saddam getting the chemical weapons that he actually used?

it was a mix of German, French, British, and American companies with their governments approval.

even flow? · February 2007

sponger wrote:

I've been trying to dig up some sources on this, and all I've been able to find are tidbits of info regarding the sale of anthrax, bubonic plague , and other various germ samples.

If I understand it right, Saddam's chemical weapon of choice was mustard gas mixed with nerve agents.

So, from who was Saddam getting the chemical weapons that he actually used?

Amazing the US didn't let those types of questions come up in the trial of the century in Bhagdad. Do you think there may have been a valid reason? Same reason why we don't see Yankee generals and chemical companies in a chair in the Hague. Anyway, aren't we all lucky that Saddam took those precious little secrets to his grave. And we can all speculate (what a joke) as to the countries that gave them too him. Right down to the cash from Canada.

ThumbingMyWay32 · February 2007

Anyone aware the French helped us fight the American Revolution?

I bet there's a forum where atleast a few Frenchies gather to bitch about that...

So the US sold chemical weapons to Iraq...

Comments