CNN's Atheism "debate"

Being an atheist is weird. To most of my friends and family I am the "crazy" one because I don't believe in magic and fairy tales.

hippiemom wrote:

I just now got around to watching this so-called "debate." What a crock! They couldn't find a single atheist to participate?

Tune in tomorrow when we debate Buddhism. Our guests will be two Hindus and a Muslim.

Apparently due to the outcry that the segment generated, Richard Dawkins will be appearing as a quest in the near future. I'd love to see it. I have a lot of respect for him, although I don't particularly agree with his apparent quest to rid the world of religion.

Live and let live is what I say. Without a diversity of religious beliefs the world would be much less interesting. If anyone wants to debate the merits of their particular religion with me I'm happy to partcipate, but I don't feel the need to attack them just for their beliefs. As long as they're harmless, what do I care?

Ahnimus wrote:

Should be interesting. But this is was they do, get some extremist from the "other side" to represent Atheism to the public.

Well, he's hardly an extremist. He's just very vocal about his ideas.

I haven't read his latest book yet, but he's now moved from writing primarily about evolutionary theory to a full fledged attack on religion, with logical arguments against the existence of god. Maybe it was done out of frustration at having his work attacked purely because it did not agree with fundamentalist christian/jewish/islamic teaching. I think his books on evolution attracted most of their criticism from fundamentalist christian groups. He seems to have launched a personal crusade on organised religion in general.

Scubascott wrote:

Well, he's hardly an extremist. He's just very vocal about his ideas.

I haven't read his latest book yet, but he's now moved from writing primarily about evolutionary theory to a full fledged attack on religion, with logical arguments against the existence of god. Maybe it was done out of frustration at having his work attacked purely because it did not agree with fundamentalist christian/jewish/islamic teaching. I think his books on evolution attracted most of their criticism from fundamentalist christian groups. He seems to have launched a personal crusade on organised religion in general.

I watched his movie, it was pretty good. I don't disagree with him. But he is kind of extreme attacking religion.

sponger wrote:

I don't know much about Dawkins other than that he mistook Mr. Garrison for a woman. But, if it's true that he is calling for the end of religion, then I don't think he makes for a very good representative of the atheist agenda.

The last thing we want judeo-christians thinking is that atheists are just as vain and oppressive as they are. We're supposed to be above that.

I don't know that he's actually calling for the end of religion. He's just not pulling any punches in putting his views across. I'll have to read his book and find out. According to wikipedia, the core messages of it are:

- Atheists can be happy, balanced, moral, and intellectually fulfilled.

- Natural selection and other scientific theories are superior to a "God hypothesis" in explaining the living world and perhaps even the cosmos.

- Children should not be labelled by their parents' religion. Terms like "Catholic child" or "Muslim child" should make people flinch.

-Atheists should be proud, not apologetic, because atheism is evidence of a healthy, independent mind.

Scubascott wrote:

I didn't know he had a movie. What's it called?

I just found this excerpt from 'The God Delusion'. He's describing Yahweh, the god of the old testament:

"arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction. Jealous and proud of it, a petty, unjust, unforgiving control freak, a vindictive bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser, a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidical, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully."

Yeah, pretty provacative language I guess.

I think this is it here
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6169720917221820689

Scubascott wrote:

"The idea of a divine creator belittles the elegant reality of the universe"

I couldn't agree more.

Oh the video gets better. It's great. We should get a list of Atheist documentaries together. One similarity I've found is that they are usually soft-spoken about the issues. It's funny to see an Atheist calmly interrogate a theist and have them flip-out and not answer the questions. Just gives solidity to the disbelief in religion.

Scubascott wrote:

I don't know that he's actually calling for the end of religion. He's just not pulling any punches in putting his views across. I'll have to read his book and find out. According to wikipedia, the core messages of it are:

- Atheists can be happy, balanced, moral, and intellectually fulfilled.

- Natural selection and other scientific theories are superior to a "God hypothesis" in explaining the living world and perhaps even the cosmos.

- Children should not be labelled by their parents' religion. Terms like "Catholic child" or "Muslim child" should make people flinch.

-Atheists should be proud, not apologetic, because atheism is evidence of a healthy, independent mind.

I am 1/2 way through this book now, and enjoying it greatly.

I would recommend it to those who will agree or disagree with it alike. It is not especially bashing the faithful- it is mainly explaining what atheism is- and in doing so he makes comparisons between a belief in god and no belief in god.

He expands greatly on what I have always found the strongest argument against god... that a universe derrived from a god is more improbable then a universe without a creating god. Because no matter how unlikely a universe beginning through natural means, a god who creates a universe must be in itself more improbable because, being able to design and create the universe, god must therefore be more complex then just a universe.

So saying god created the universe is not just shifting the question to where did god come from... it is simultaneously shifting the question and making the answer more complex. But anyway, I really don't care what people believe as long as they think about it.

I look forward to seeing him on CNN...

Scubascott wrote:

I just finished watching it. The muslim guy in Jerusalem was completely unreasonable, and kinda scary. If I was Richard Dawkins I think I would have run away.

He did lose his cool a little bit when he was talking to the evangelist guy though. You could see he was fuming on the inside. It seemed like the discussion degenerated very rapidly the moment he said 'You obviously know nothing about evolution'. I think that's the greatest problem with his writing. He can sometimes come across as sounding a bit arrogant, which is the perfect way to instantly repell religious people.

Yea, that particular evangelist was really aggressive though. The guy creeped me out more than the Muslim dude. I think Dawkins did pretty well, I'm not sure if I could have done that any better.

I mean, I get sick of hearing people say "Darwinism" is a myth, or it has no evidence. Because that's just totally absurd and obviously, they don't know anything about it.