Religion

2

Comments

  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    sponger wrote:
    It sounds like what you're saying is that we who do not like the preachiness of religion are really only interested in proving our sense of individuality. Is that what you're saying?
    No. I think it's valid to not like something. There are a ton of things that others do that I dislike, all around me a lot of the time! I'm saying when we blame the other guy, and take the "look what they are doing to me" route, we are not being conscious of our own role and how we are contributing to what we are creating that we don't like. If we are allowing someone to shove religion down our throat, or fighting it and thereby connecting with the dynamic, or even when we are letting it bother us, that is about us, not the other guy. The reason I tie this into the tribal mindset is because it shows us when we are "hooked" and thusly not individuated.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • hippiemom
    hippiemom Posts: 3,326
    angelica wrote:
    No. I think it's valid to not like something. There are a ton of things that others do that I dislike, all around me a lot of the time! I'm saying when we blame the other guy, and take the "look what they are doing to me" route, we are not being conscious of our own role and how we are contributing to what we are creating that we don't like. If we are allowing someone to shove religion down our throat, or fighting it and thereby connecting with the dynamic, or even when we are letting it bother us, that is about us, not the other guy. The reason I tie this into the tribal mindset is because it shows us when we are "hooked" and thusly not individuated.
    On a one-on-one basis, I agree with you. There are numerous very effective ways to shut down that sort of communication. I don't know what others are specifically talking about, but when I say that I dislike religion only when people attempt to force it on me, I'm talking about attempts to legislate religiously-based beliefs on everyone.
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    hippiemom wrote:
    On a one-on-one basis, I agree with you. There are numerous very effective ways to shut down that sort of communication. I don't know what others are specifically talking about, but when I say that I dislike religion only when people attempt to force it on me, I'm talking about attempts to legislate religiously-based beliefs on everyone.
    Yeah, I was definitely referring to one to one.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • hippiemom
    hippiemom Posts: 3,326
    angelica wrote:
    Yeah, I was definitely referring to one to one.
    If you discover an equally effective way to shut down the busy-body would-be legislators, please let me know!
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    hippiemom wrote:
    If you discover an equally effective way to shut down the busy-body would-be legislators, please let me know!
    Will do!
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • B nice
    B nice Posts: 182
    god is for idiots
    life has nothing to do with killing time
    Bring it on cause I'm no victim

    b nice loves pearl jam like ed vedder loves america
  • sponger
    sponger Posts: 3,159
    I wouldn't necessarily say that a belief in god is a sign of being intellectually challenged. There are plenty of intelligent people out there who are religious. I'd say that a belief in god is a sign of a lack of introspection. It's possible to be intelligent yet not know a thing about one's own self.
    reigning champion

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=272825
  • sponger
    sponger Posts: 3,159
    angelica wrote:
    No. I think it's valid to not like something. There are a ton of things that others do that I dislike, all around me a lot of the time! I'm saying when we blame the other guy, and take the "look what they are doing to me" route, we are not being conscious of our own role and how we are contributing to what we are creating that we don't like. If we are allowing someone to shove religion down our throat, or fighting it and thereby connecting with the dynamic, or even when we are letting it bother us, that is about us, not the other guy. The reason I tie this into the tribal mindset is because it shows us when we are "hooked" and thusly not individuated.

    You live in a society that is more secular than the states. At least, that's the impression I get about Canada. Things are a lot worse down here.
    reigning champion

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=272825
  • Smellyman2
    Smellyman2 Posts: 689
    With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.
    Steven Weinberg
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    sponger wrote:
    I wouldn't necessarily say that a belief in god is a sign of being intellectually challenged. There are plenty of intelligent people out there who are religious. I'd say that a belief in god is a sign of a lack of introspection. It's possible to be intelligent yet not know a thing about one's own self.
    I consider myself probably the most introspective person I've known and it's through my introspection that I have found how far I reach into the universe. I have touched base within with what is termed "God" on numerous occasions.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    sponger wrote:
    You live in a society that is more secular than the states. At least, that's the impression I get about Canada. Things are a lot worse down here.
    The thing is I "get" all kinds of beliefs. I see the connections and similarities much more than differences. So when someone is talking of the Christian sense of God, I naturally understand what they are talking about. Same with Scientology beliefs, and so on.

    You are probably right about Canada, from what I hear about your country via this board. At the same time, I was raised in church, with traditional religion (until I walked away at age 14 or so). I went to numerous bible clubs and groups as a child, and have generally been around untold God-fearing religious types. The irony for me is that my family members are predominantly athiest, so I've been dumped on, denigrated, demeaned and pathologized for having a natural predisposition to having spiritual experiences.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • Smellyman2
    Smellyman2 Posts: 689
    angelica wrote:
    The thing is I "get" all kinds of beliefs. I see the connections and similarities much more than differences. So when someone is talking of the Christian sense of God, I naturally understand what they are talking about. Same with Scientology beliefs, and so on.

    You are probably right about Canada, from what I hear about your country via this board. At the same time, I was raised in church, with traditional religion (until I walked away at age 14 or so). I went to numerous bible clubs and groups as a child, and have generally been around untold God-fearing religious types. The irony for me is that my family members are predominantly athiest, so I've been dumped on, denigrated, demeaned and pathologized for having a natural predisposition to having spiritual experiences.

    You were raised in church and around God fearing types, but family is predominantly atheist?
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    Smellyman wrote:
    You were raised in church and around God fearing types, but family is predominantly atheist?
    There are seven kids in my family. We were raised with religion and church. Only one other sibling besides myself believes in God now that we are adults. The others became supposedly "science-oriented" types who have been very vocal about the "make-believe" nature of God throughout the years.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • Smellyman2
    Smellyman2 Posts: 689
    angelica wrote:
    There are seven kids in my family. We were raised with religion and church. Only one other sibling besides myself believes in God now that we are adults. The others became supposedly "science-oriented" types who have been very vocal about the "make-believe" nature of God throughout the years.


    born-again scientists. good to hear.
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    Smellyman wrote:
    born-again scientists. good to hear.
    Very apropos term. I just might use that in the future!
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • sponger
    sponger Posts: 3,159
    angelica wrote:
    it's through my introspection that I have found how far I reach into the universe.

    I am curious to know what introspection and our reach into the universe have in common.
    reigning champion

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=272825
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    sponger wrote:
    I am curious to know what introspection and our reach into the universe have in common.
    From my experience, we're all part of life and are intimately connected to the universe. Unfortunately, most of us have been trained from birth to be objective and to look outside ourselves for the answers. I have found that we can connect to the ground state of life and natural law as it flows through us. Through this direct access we can realize we are at once the drop of water, and at the same time we are also the ocean. As within so without. Life is not really separated into within/without, except in our perception of that. When we can break through the illusory perceptions we've been taught, we can reclaim the harmony of seeing life as Is. We can return to our birthright--to the harmony in the "garden of Eden".

    Granted, we've had our perceptions trained to look at life a certain way. In order to be able to cleanse our perceptions, we have to learn to look at life in different ways.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • Abuskedti
    Abuskedti Posts: 1,917
    dotheevolution1 wrote:
    Thoughts?

    I took my date into a Christian store. She was looking for a book. Written by the author of a devotional book she likes. She asked one of the employees for help finding one when the employeed asked what seemed quite a funny question - she said: "is it fiction"?
  • Smellyman2
    Smellyman2 Posts: 689
    Abuskedti wrote:
    she said: "is it fiction"?

    haha

    "yes"

    "then you've come to the right place."
  • sponger
    sponger Posts: 3,159
    angelica wrote:
    From my experience, we're all part of life and are intimately connected to the universe. Unfortunately, most of us have been trained from birth to be objective and to look outside ourselves for the answers. I have found that we can connect to the ground state of life and natural law as it flows through us. Through this direct access we can realize we are at once the drop of water, and at the same time we are also the ocean. As within so without. Life is not really separated into within/without, except in our perception of that. When we can break through the illusory perceptions we've been taught, we can reclaim the harmony of seeing life as Is. We can return to our birthright--to the harmony in the "garden of Eden".

    Granted, we've had our perceptions trained to look at life a certain way. In order to be able to cleanse our perceptions, we have to learn to look at life in different ways.


    I disagree with most of that, but I'm not going to bother disagreeing because you probably won't take any of it personally, which is no fun.
    reigning champion

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=272825

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