B. Palin's pregnancy -- Is it fair to discuss? Is it relevant?

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  • Staceb10
    Staceb10 Posts: 675
    scb wrote:
    Access is not just about laws but also about the kind of relationship teenagers have with their parents. If parents expect their teenagers to use birth control if/when they have sex, they need to foster an environment where their kids feel comfortable coming to them about these things. My experience is that those parents who preach that abstinence is the only way - even if they do "explain birth control to their kids" - tend to have kids who not only would never dream of coming to their parents when in need of contraception, but who are also less likely to use it at all for fear of their parents finding a condom wrapper, hearing that someone saw them at the clinic, etc. Having to sneak around your parents' backs is just one of the many barriers to service.


    I don't agree with that. If they are comfortable enough to "sneak" around and have sex and are aware of birth control options but chose not to use it because their parents might find out then what good is sex education anyway? Based on what you are saying then only teens with parents who don't support abstinence only will actually use it so why should a parent who believes in abstinence only even expose their teens to the education?
  • digster
    digster Posts: 1,293
    Staceb10 wrote:
    I don't agree with that. If they are comfortable enough to "sneak" around and have sex and are aware of birth control options but chose not to use it because their parents might find out then what good is sex education anyway? Based on what you are saying then only teens with parents who don't support abstinence only will actually use it so why should a parent who believes in abstinence only even expose their teens to the education?

    Here's the point you're not addressing;

    What is the point of an abstinence only education? What is the harm in giving teenagers all the options, if for the only reason that more information usually allows people, adults and teens alike, to make better, more knowledgeable decisions? As I said in another thread, an abstinence only education is the equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and closing your eyes and pretending reality is not happening.

    EDIT: Never mind, I saw in an earlier post you agreed with the notion that abstinence only doesn't work...the point is that has to go for everyone. Kids should not have to be scared to use birth control, and that's definetely going to happen in a household that stresses abstinence only.
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    Staceb10 wrote:
    You are right about one thing.. abstinence only education doesn't work. Now, can you tell me that this "loon's" daughter didn't receive any education about birth control anywhere? Just because her mother promotes abstinence only doesn't mean she was unware of any other forms or types of birth control. I think at minimum 90% of people in the US that get pregnant know about birth control options these days.
    Maybe not....mom's big time into her career (not that its a bad thing), dad's busy with two or three jobs....mom got pregnant...with downs baby...what 4 other siblings....add in the talk of how children are a blessing..and God decides when another miracle will enter our food chain...so maybe she rolled the dice..thinking since god loved her she wouldn't get pregnant. Some public sex education can't be a bad thing.
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    digster wrote:
    Here's the point you're not addressing;

    What is the point of an abstinence only education? What is the harm in giving teenagers all the options, if for the only reason that more information usually allows people, adults and teens alike, to make better, more knowledgeable decisions? As I said in another thread, an abstinence only education is the equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and closing your eyes and pretending reality is not happening.
    ...okay wispering so all the other children can't hear this...if you don't talk about sex...children won't be curious about they're boobies and boners and never have sex...shhhhh....keep it quiet....shhhh...

    plus sex is dirty..and sinful....bad sex, bad sex....
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    scb wrote:
    Access is not just about laws but also about the kind of relationship teenagers have with their parents. If parents expect their teenagers to use birth control if/when they have sex, they need to foster an environment where their kids feel comfortable coming to them about these things. My experience is that those parents who preach that abstinence is the only way - even if they do "explain birth control to their kids" - tend to have kids who not only would never dream of coming to their parents when in need of contraception, but who are also less likely to use it at all for fear of their parents finding a condom wrapper, hearing that someone saw them at the clinic, etc. Having to sneak around your parents' backs is just one of the many barriers to service.


    So, you're telling me that if your 15-17 year old daughter came to you and asked you to buy her condoms or start the pill, you just go ahead and git 'er done?

    I can honestly say, I have no idea what I would do in that case.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Cosmo
    Cosmo Posts: 12,225
    cincybearcat wrote:
    So, you're telling me that if your 15-17 year old daughter came to you and asked you to buy her condoms or start the pill, you just go ahead and git 'er done?

    I can honestly say, I have no idea what I would do in that case.
    ...
    I would. I remember being a teenager.
    I'd also warn her about shit like AIDS and Herpes and Syph because I love her... and I'd also let her in on what all teenage boys think about and want... because, at one time, I was a teenaged boy.
    Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
    Hail, Hail!!!
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    Cosmo wrote:
    ...
    I would. I remember being a teenager.
    I'd also warn her about shit like AIDS and Herpes and Syph because I love her... and I'd also let her in on what all teenage boys think about and want... because, at one time, I was a teenaged boy.


    I do all of that...except maybe the pill/condom thing. Hell, I have no idea what I'd do...I know that #1 I mention the issues with having sex and #2 try to disuade her for sure...I'm not looking forward to this conversation.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • norm
    norm Posts: 31,146
    cincybearcat wrote:
    So, you're telling me that if your 15-17 year old daughter came to you and asked you to buy her condoms or start the pill, you just go ahead and git 'er done?


    um...yeah.....after a long conversation...;)


    i would much rather buy my kid birth control that a stroller or an abortion....or have to take them to an aids clinic one day
  • blackredyellow
    blackredyellow Posts: 5,889
    cincybearcat wrote:
    So, you're telling me that if your 15-17 year old daughter came to you and asked you to buy her condoms or start the pill, you just go ahead and git 'er done?

    I can honestly say, I have no idea what I would do in that case.

    The problem to me, at least would be with their age... My approach would likely be different if I had a 15 year-old daughter ask me, than if a 17-year-old did.

    I don't know... As far as kids, I have one son so far, and he's a long time from this stuff. I think dealing with boys at that age is so much easier for a father.
    My whole life
    was like a picture
    of a sunny day
    “We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
    ― Abraham Lincoln
  • Cosmo
    Cosmo Posts: 12,225
    cincybearcat wrote:
    I do all of that...except maybe the pill/condom thing. Hell, I have no idea what I'd do...I know that #1 I mention the issues with having sex and #2 try to disuade her for sure...I'm not looking forward to this conversation.
    ...
    You can try to disuade her... but, really... with the pill you are putting up a solid defense. Think of it as abstinence being hope... and the pill being fact.
    She will also need to be told of the consequences... including the emotional consequences that come along with sex and the side effects of using the pill.
    ...
    I'd also have a long serious talk with that boyfriend of hers, too. One where he walks away informed... and very scared.
    Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
    Hail, Hail!!!
  • norm
    norm Posts: 31,146
    Cosmo wrote:
    ...
    You can try to disuade her... but, really... with the pill you are putting up a solid defense. Think of it as abstinence being hope... and the pill being fact.
    She will also need to be told of the consequences... including the emotional consequences that come along with sex and the side effects of using the pill.
    ...
    I'd also have a long serious talk with that boyfriend of hers, too. One where he walks away informed... and very scared.


    shapening and polishing large knives and muttering incoherently while the boy is around is just good parenting ;):D
  • Thecure
    Thecure Posts: 814
    puremagic wrote:
    Quite acting like the democrats made this an issue. McCain's people knew of this pregnancy even before they made the public announcement of Palin's selection. The fact that Governor Palin is allowing her daughter to be used as a holier than though, pro life poster child just shows what kind a parent she is. This has become just a sinful media display of a mother whoring out her daughter for the good of the Party. Let's hope the supreme court appreciates the trouble.

    how is Palin making her daughter a holier than thou pro life poster child? teh daughter is preganant and is having the baby, who cares?
    People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

    If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
    - Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
  • Thecure
    Thecure Posts: 814
    riffrandall wrote:
    Without getting into who screened Sarah Palin and who didn't, or whether Bristol Palin's sex life is appropriate to discuss-
    I would just like to ask (as a parent), what kind of a mother does this to her daughter? Regardless of the screening process, Sarah Palin knew that Bristol was pregnant, and yet she still accepted the VP nom.
    Who does that? What type of person deliberately puts their own child through this type of scrutiny?

    you can say this about any politician. i woudl also say what kind of father allows this (or is making these decision only a women decision)
    People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

    If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
    - Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
  • decides2dream
    decides2dream Posts: 14,977
    cutback wrote:
    um...yeah.....after a long conversation...;)


    i would much rather buy my kid birth control that a stroller or an abortion....or have to take them to an aids clinic one day


    agreed.


    let's face it, think back to when YOU lost your virginity.....and decide from there. isn't it far wiser to assist your child with the BESt options for their choices? sure, absolutely encoruage waiting, making infomred decisions, etc...but i would far rather know that my child was well-informed and that i was there for him/her....than leave them to their own devices and misinformation, etc. i remember back to what my parents told me...NOTHING......and much the same for my 2 older sisters, and it is amazing none of us ended up pregnant at a young age. we were lucky, and sure.....found out a lot and took care of somethings ourselves, without our parents knowledge. it should NOT have to be that way.



    and btw - yes, i am childless and will remain so....however, i was an educator and we all had to be well-informed on such issues, also for abuse, etc. and sure, i too was a teenager once, and i DO also know of a few - sadly very few - who DID have parents who were open and honest with them, and yes, went with them to get BC. i think it far healthier honestly.
    Stay with me...
    Let's just breathe...


    I am myself like you somehow


  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    cutback wrote:
    shapening and polishing large knives and muttering incoherently while the boy is around is just good parenting ;):D


    I'm buying a shotgun...and completely NON-functioning shotgun.

    I plan on cleaning it just about everytime a boyfriend shows up to pick her up. ;)
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Cosmo
    Cosmo Posts: 12,225
    cutback wrote:
    shapening and polishing large knives and muttering incoherently while the boy is around is just good parenting ;):D
    ...
    Or talking about how much you love your daughter... you sweet little Princess... and how it would drive you completely insane if anyone ever hurt her... you wouldn't be able to control your rage...
    ... while you are cleaning your shotgun.
    Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
    Hail, Hail!!!
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    Staceb10 wrote:
    I don't agree with that. If they are comfortable enough to "sneak" around and have sex and are aware of birth control options but chose not to use it because their parents might find out then what good is sex education anyway? Based on what you are saying then only teens with parents who don't support abstinence only will actually use it so why should a parent who believes in abstinence only even expose their teens to the education?

    I'm not sure I get what you're saying here.

    But all I'm saying is that the "here's some factual information about birth control BUT YOU BETTER NOT EVER USE IT!!!" approach isn't as effective as one based in reality.
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    Cosmo wrote:
    ...
    Or talking about how much you love your daughter... you sweet little Princess... and how it would drive you completely insane if anyone ever hurt her... you wouldn't be able to control your rage...
    ... while you are cleaning your shotgun.


    Now you're thinking...see my post 1 up. ;)
    hippiemom = goodness
  • decides2dream
    decides2dream Posts: 14,977
    scb wrote:
    I'm not sure I get what you're saying here.

    But all I'm saying is that the "here's some factual information about birth control BUT YOU BETTER NOT EVER USE IT!!!" approach isn't as effective as one based in reality.



    just another twist of a 'don't ask, don't tell' policy.......;)


    personally, MOST especially if i had a daughter....i'd want to know, i'd want to be infomred, and i would want her to be infomred and not afraid to discuss such with me. would it be uncomfortable? sure. would one encourage witing, discuss the gravity of it all, etc? sure again. thing is though.....bottomline, one 'oops!' so heavily will weigh on a girl for perhas life. i rather not think of a 15 year old having sex, but i'd rather think about a 15 year old having sex while using BC, preferably 2 forms. the pill for pregnancy, and condoms for disease. it would ease my mind a GREAT deal. b/c we may all know about being infomred and prepared....but when feeling pressured and sure even desiring...and there's no condom around......yikes.......
    Stay with me...
    Let's just breathe...


    I am myself like you somehow


  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    cincybearcat wrote:
    So, you're telling me that if your 15-17 year old daughter came to you and asked you to buy her condoms or start the pill, you just go ahead and git 'er done?

    I can honestly say, I have no idea what I would do in that case.

    I like to think I would. Hell, I plan to have condoms around for my daughter or son to use without having to ask. I would even like to get her on a more reliable form of birth control BEFORE she starts having sex. Of course I would also talk to her about all the reasons why it's a bad idea to have sex at a young age, etc. And it would probably be extremely hard to not freak out if I found out she was having sex.

    But I think our children's health needs outweigh our needs as parents to bury our heads in the sand and think our kids are better than the others. I've seen the results of the bury-you-head-in-the-sand method and they can be devastating. How is saying, "I'll just pray that my kids never have sex instead of giving them the tools they need to be safe" any better than the kids saying, "I'll just pray I won't get pregnant instead of practicing safe sex"?

    (Note: I'll admit that I'm not a parent. But, while no one ever knows for sure how they would handle any situation, this is how I would like to handle this one should it ever arise.)

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