Options
U.S. snipers accused of 'baiting' Iraqis
Vedderlution_Baby
Posts: 2,545
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070925/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_iraq_snipers
WASHINGTON - Army snipers hunting insurgents in Iraq were under orders to "bait" their targets with suspicious materials, such as detonation cords, and then kill whoever picked up the items, according to the defense attorney for a soldier accused of planting evidence on an Iraqi he killed. Gary Myers, an attorney for Sgt. Evan Vela, said his client had acted "pursuant to orders."
ADVERTISEMENT
"We believe that our client has done nothing more than he was instructed to do by superiors," Myers said in a telephone interview.
Myers and Vela's father, Curtis Carnahan of Idaho Falls, Idaho, said in separate interviews that sworn statements and testimony in the cases of two other accused Ranger snipers indicate that the Army has a classified program that encourages snipers to "bait" potential targets and then kill whoever takes the bait.
The Army on Monday declined to confirm such a program exists.
"To prevent the enemy from learning about our tactics, techniques and training procedures, we don't discuss specific methods targeting enemy combatants," said Paul Boyce, an Army spokesman.
Boyce also said there are no classified programs that authorize the murder of Iraqi civilians or the use of "drop weapons" to make killings appeared to be legally justified, which is what Vela and the two other snipers are accused of doing.
The transcript of a court hearing for two of the three accused snipers makes several references to the existence of a classified "baiting" program but provides few details of how it works. A copy of the transcript was provided to The Associated Press by Vela's father.
The Washington Post, which first reported the existence of the "baiting" program, cited the sworn statement of Capt. Matthew P. Didier, the leader of a Ranger sniper scout platoon.
"Baiting is putting an object out there that we know they will use, with the intention of destroying the enemy," Didier said in the statement. "Basically, we would put an item out there and watch it. If someone found the item, picked it up and attempted to leave with the item, we would engage the individual as I saw this as a sign they would use the item against U.S. forces."
The Post said the program was devised by the Army's Asymmetric Warfare Group, which advises commanders on more effective methods in today's unconventional conflicts, including ways to combat roadside bombs.
Within months of the "baiting" program's introduction, three snipers in Didier's platoon were charged with murder for allegedly using those items and others to make shootings seem legitimate, according to the Post.
The Post said that although it doesn't appear that the three alleged shootings were specifically part of the classified program, defense attorneys argue that the program may have encouraged them by blurring the legal lines in a complex war zone.
The court martial of one of the accused soldiers, Spec. Jorge Sandoval Jr., is scheduled to begin in Baghdad on Wednesday. Also facing premeditated murder charges are Vela and Staff Sgt. Michael Hensley.
They are part of the Headquarters and Headquarters Company, 1st Battalion, 501st Infantry Regiment, 4th Brigade (Airborne), 25th Infantry Division, based at Fort Richardson, Alaska.
This is the best thing we could come with? Something that's a shitty plan, at best?
WASHINGTON - Army snipers hunting insurgents in Iraq were under orders to "bait" their targets with suspicious materials, such as detonation cords, and then kill whoever picked up the items, according to the defense attorney for a soldier accused of planting evidence on an Iraqi he killed. Gary Myers, an attorney for Sgt. Evan Vela, said his client had acted "pursuant to orders."
ADVERTISEMENT
"We believe that our client has done nothing more than he was instructed to do by superiors," Myers said in a telephone interview.
Myers and Vela's father, Curtis Carnahan of Idaho Falls, Idaho, said in separate interviews that sworn statements and testimony in the cases of two other accused Ranger snipers indicate that the Army has a classified program that encourages snipers to "bait" potential targets and then kill whoever takes the bait.
The Army on Monday declined to confirm such a program exists.
"To prevent the enemy from learning about our tactics, techniques and training procedures, we don't discuss specific methods targeting enemy combatants," said Paul Boyce, an Army spokesman.
Boyce also said there are no classified programs that authorize the murder of Iraqi civilians or the use of "drop weapons" to make killings appeared to be legally justified, which is what Vela and the two other snipers are accused of doing.
The transcript of a court hearing for two of the three accused snipers makes several references to the existence of a classified "baiting" program but provides few details of how it works. A copy of the transcript was provided to The Associated Press by Vela's father.
The Washington Post, which first reported the existence of the "baiting" program, cited the sworn statement of Capt. Matthew P. Didier, the leader of a Ranger sniper scout platoon.
"Baiting is putting an object out there that we know they will use, with the intention of destroying the enemy," Didier said in the statement. "Basically, we would put an item out there and watch it. If someone found the item, picked it up and attempted to leave with the item, we would engage the individual as I saw this as a sign they would use the item against U.S. forces."
The Post said the program was devised by the Army's Asymmetric Warfare Group, which advises commanders on more effective methods in today's unconventional conflicts, including ways to combat roadside bombs.
Within months of the "baiting" program's introduction, three snipers in Didier's platoon were charged with murder for allegedly using those items and others to make shootings seem legitimate, according to the Post.
The Post said that although it doesn't appear that the three alleged shootings were specifically part of the classified program, defense attorneys argue that the program may have encouraged them by blurring the legal lines in a complex war zone.
The court martial of one of the accused soldiers, Spec. Jorge Sandoval Jr., is scheduled to begin in Baghdad on Wednesday. Also facing premeditated murder charges are Vela and Staff Sgt. Michael Hensley.
They are part of the Headquarters and Headquarters Company, 1st Battalion, 501st Infantry Regiment, 4th Brigade (Airborne), 25th Infantry Division, based at Fort Richardson, Alaska.
This is the best thing we could come with? Something that's a shitty plan, at best?
Post edited by Unknown User on
0
Comments
You never know! Ipods carry a lot of music
I wonder if a child went up to pick up this bait will they still take that shot and at what age is the cut off point? That's even if they have one, such is the sad state of war.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
nice work, indeed....
www.myspace.com/jensvad
What do they do in the case of a child if this is so smart?
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
excellent point...
I say we should kill every man, women, and child....you never know, they could be a freedom hatin' tar-or-ist...
right, killer...?
Anyway, get your heads out of your asses and realize they are in a war. A soldier in battle will do a helluva lot more unsavory things than 'baiting' a corpse. War is hell.
If some random guy went searching a body looking for bomb equipment, I'd say its certainly possible he's wants to use it.
I doubt they blow away people without prejudice. Its just a battlefield tactic. Why would a kid run up and grab a detonator and run off with it? Do you think most American snipers would still pull the trigger if one did?
Good point. No child has ever been a soldier. Surely noone would use children as shields or weapons or soldiers.
www.myspace.com/jensvad
Then in that case we can just shoot anyone who moves or gets in the line of fire including our own troops or Iraqi military police. Yeah real brilliant idea.
.....But then again the US must win this war on terror at all cost cause they'll come here next. :rolleyes:
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I agree. Which is why we have to leave. Our military presence is the cause.
actually, in the article it says they lay out items that could be used to create IEDs. anyone that attempts to pick up an item and leave are taken down. Now, there's all kind of shit that could happen besides some asshole wanting to leave with the items to make a bomb. I think it's a poor plan and with the technology and experience of our army, we would be able to come up with better alternatives to this.
I gather in these desparate times, desparate measures are used another reason we should really leave.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Yeah b/c all Iraqi's born with knowledge of bomb part. What if its someone who doesnt know what it is and thinks that if they return it to the US military they will get an award? Amazing how worthless life has become.
I have a cousin who is a Marine. Thankfully made it home in one piece. Some of the stories he tells about what we hear vs what actually happens make me jaded with any news story I hear like this.
with an illegal smile
it don't cost very much
but it lasts a long while
won't you please tell the man
i didn't kill anyone
i'm just tryin to have me some fun
exactly. this article isn't much to go on. Yet everyone starts screaming about babykilling snipers from hell.
I wouldn't be so quick to judge.
yeah this war shouldn't have happened, but if you are in a war you do what it takes to make it through. Innocent people get killed in war. thats why war is horrible and why it should only be a last resort option.
And that is the biggest bullshit excuse to justify stupid shit that shouldn't happen.
where in the hell are you getting this information?
when I said mentioned, I mentioned by another poster. It said that nowhere in the article. Sorry for the confusion
(Just to clear it up, I live on Planet Sarcasm)