Burstbuckers or '57 Classics?
DOSW
Posts: 2,014
OK, so originally I was going to save up for a '52 RI Telecaster and buy it at the end of next summer, but recently I've decided that I'll be going on an extended solo road trip in the summer so my funds will be a little tight. So instead I decided that I'll just upgrade my current guitar, an Epiphone Les Paul Ultra.
The question I have though is regarding pups. I've all but decided to put a Gibson P-94 in the neck (basically a P90 shaped to fit a humbucker slot), but I'm torn between a '57 Classic and a Burstbucker to put in the bridge. What's the difference? The only thing I've gathered so far is that the Burstbucker has a slightly higher output, but even that I'm not too sure about. For a reference, the sound I'm looking for is pretty much set in classic players like Page (live), Slash, and of course Stone and Mike, etc, etc... you know the deal. Sometimes I go higher gain to play more modern music but I almost never go into the metal range.
Also, what's the difference between Burstbucker 1, 2, 3, and Pro? And what about a regular 57 Classic vs a 57 Classic plus?
And one more thing... I know a lot of you like other pups besides Gibsons. Are there any that are better than the 57's or Burstbuckers at a lower price?
Okay, that's all now.
Sorry to pour on the questions, but you guys seem to know everything.
The question I have though is regarding pups. I've all but decided to put a Gibson P-94 in the neck (basically a P90 shaped to fit a humbucker slot), but I'm torn between a '57 Classic and a Burstbucker to put in the bridge. What's the difference? The only thing I've gathered so far is that the Burstbucker has a slightly higher output, but even that I'm not too sure about. For a reference, the sound I'm looking for is pretty much set in classic players like Page (live), Slash, and of course Stone and Mike, etc, etc... you know the deal. Sometimes I go higher gain to play more modern music but I almost never go into the metal range.
Also, what's the difference between Burstbucker 1, 2, 3, and Pro? And what about a regular 57 Classic vs a 57 Classic plus?
And one more thing... I know a lot of you like other pups besides Gibsons. Are there any that are better than the 57's or Burstbuckers at a lower price?
Okay, that's all now.
Sorry to pour on the questions, but you guys seem to know everything. It's a town full of losers and I'm pulling out of here to win
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments
'57 Classic: Tone is warm and subtle with full, even response. They have Alnico II magnets, vintage enamel coated wire, nickel
plated pole pieces, nickel slugs, maple spacers and vintage-style, two-conductor, braided wiring.
'57 Classic Plus: Mimics those late-1950s humbuckers that received a few extra turns of wire.
I find the Classic Plus harder to clean up (the Plus' always seem a little overdriven), so I personally prefer the Classic over the Plus.
Burstbuckers: Are basically a copy of the Gibson original "Patent Applied For" pickup (the pickups that give the '59 LP Standard its legendary sound).
They have unpolished magnets and non-potted coils - thus they do have some Microphonic issues at higher volumes.
Burstbuckrs do seem to have slightly less output than many modern pickups.
Burstbucker#1: is slightly underwound, with medium "vintage" output, and works well in both bridge and neck positions.
Burstbucker#2: is wound in the range of Gibson's '57 Classic, with slightly hotter "vintage" output than the BurstBucker#1.
Burstbucker#3: is slightly overwound, with hotter output, and works well in the bridge position with a BurstBucker#2 in the neck position.
BurstBucker Pro: have Alnico 5 magnets and are wax potted so that they can withstand loud volume pressures without annoying feedback.
This is a good feature since the microphonic problems won't be there (probably my choice if I were to go with a Burstbucker).
They are offered in a calibrated pair (neck and bridge position).
Output of the pickups is similar to the standard BurstBucker#1 and #2 models.
For pickups at cheaper prices - maybe take a look at Dimarzio's Vintage output series humbuckers http://www.dimarzio.com/
There are an awful lot of people that use Dimarzio, and they average about $20 less than Gibson.
Go to their website and take a listen to what they have - I'd maybe say look at their PAF series (also PAF Classic).
They wax-dip the PAF Classic twice (the second time with the cover installed) to eliminate microphonic noise (good idea).
Those also have 4-conductor cable which allows parallel and coil-splitting options (which you can't do with 2 wire pickups).
Also Seymour Duncan is a good option at a cheaper price.
Their Seymour Duncan SH-1 '59 Model is a nice choice (and again at about $20 less than Gibson). http://www.seymourduncan.com
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In some cases I like unpotted pickups better if you're playing loud and on the edge of feedback for a solo because I think the potting can take some of that "never know what's going to happen" personality out of them. That used to be my style, but I don't play in big places anymore and I live in the city now, so my neighbors are MUCH happier with my quieter style!
If you're playing through effects and lower volumes in small places, then get potted ones. Look for 4 wire pickups, too as you can split the coils and play with phasing and series if you want to do that down the line.
I don't think the 57 classics have that.
I like the Seymour Duncan '59 too, as well as the Pearly Gates. The Pearly Gates are a little hotter and distort a little more and are great pickups.
I like Lindy Fralin pickups, too. That's who I usually get them from. You can call him on the phone and describe what guitar you have and your style, and your amp and they wind them to those specs. About $120 per and I think they're worth it. If you don't like them you send them back and try another set.
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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NIcer pups will definitely be an improvement, but the tone wood in your Epiphone is only going to go so far, so spending too much may not be worth it.
There is a guy named Kent Armstrong who makes pretty nice pickups and a decent price. You can buy them from WD music. and they're about $80 per.
I had a Tele I got from someone who owed me, and it had two Armstrong PAF's in there. I put them in an Epiphone Elitist and they rocked out nicely.
I think your Epi has a thin maple top if I remember correctly. You can tell if you take a pickup out and look at the thickness of the maple there. If it's like the 1/8 or 1/4 inch maple, they tend to sound a little darker than a 1/2 inch maple top, so you may want a brighter pickup to compensate. They're pretty nice guitars so you might as well try it. New pickups are the best bang for your buck to change the sound.
You can also try adjusting your heights on your pickups and polepieces on the pickups, too. Sometimes you can find the sweet spots and get some better sound out of the ones you have!
Then you have even MORE money for that road trip. I highly recommend road trips! :cool:
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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The '57's is a much darker sounding guitar which revels in thick overdriven tones and crunches like a sonofabitch. I play heavy shit on that all the time.
The bursties are much lighter and more open sounding, and have amazing sizzle and sustain, hard to describe.
BUT, the wood in those guitars is so different that I would hesitate to give too much credit to the pups for the difference.
I agree with who's-pearljam, who seems to be back from the dead (Welcome back) , pup upgrade is a the best way to improve tone (actually pretty much the only way, without buying a new guitar), and road trips are crucial.
Everyone needs to break out of the groove they grew up in.
Thanks for the welcome! Not exactly back from the dead, maybe just out of touch here for a bit!
Yup, as a whole, you have to evaluate the whole guitar to find the right pup.
This is the pickup that I forgot to link up here:
http://wdmusic.com/patent_applied_for_style_open_29726_prd1.htm
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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If your pups are quite powerful , and get muddy, esp in the neck position, there ain't nothing stopping you from rolling off the volume a littel to reduce power. That kinda turns a burstbucker into a Classic 57 in a mo.
Most of us just leave the volumes and tones on 10 all the time, but a good guitar/amp combination will respond to volume changes, and it's worth fiddling about there.
It's modeled after a PAF. Which PAF I don't know, though! PAF's were pretty inconsistant in the first place and the ones that were considered great sounding were played by amazing guitarists on recordings and a regular person wouldn't get the same sound out of the same guitar.
It's hard to say exactly what it'll sound like in your guitar. It depends on your playing style and amp and all that stuff. One thing I DO know is that even if it's not as good as a Burstbucker, it will DEFINITELY sound better than the stock Epi's you have in there now. Sometimes it takes a few sets of pickups to find your sound, anyway. If you know how to do it yourself, then you can buy something, try it and sell them.
That's why I like Lindy Fralin's though. They cost more, are well built, and if they aren't the right sound, you send them back for a different pair or different winding.
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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