You did say that perhaps Unsung had a point. I'm saying that the likelihood of this book serving as early methodology to indoctrinate children is extremely low and is a reach to suggest so. One could dissect virtually anything and spin it to serve themselves if they wished. And, to what I said earlier... some here do this with great frequency and it really diminishes their credibility. If they ever did have something important to offer... it would likely be poorly received given the other material it rests with.
but his initial post was particularly vague ... if you want to pin him strictly as an anti-gov't crusader and interpret everything in a particular vain ... that is your choice ... if my objective is to interact and learn on a forum such as this ... the more i can separate agendas and assumptions the better off i will be ...
edit: also i said i'm not unsure he doesn't have a point ... double negative for sure but it clearly says that i don't see it as black and white ...
all i'm saying here is that i do see an ideology in this particular example ... and that simply kids are very influential ...
Your point about being open to learning and ideas is fair enough, but let's get serious here... how is one left to separate agendas and assumptions when the history of several posters is marked by the same ideology simply presented in a different context?
In this case... the 'ideology' that our liberties have been trampled upon was supported by a portion of a children's 'textbook' that seemed to insinuate that airport security is Big Brother flexing his muscles.
Tomorrow... we will likely see a link to a video of a policeman handcuffing a thug. The next day... a story of a government purchase that seems likely to support the impending takeover. The following day... we will read of how Eddie Vedder pm's someone to tell them how he's been impressed with these posts and that he wishes he could come out and support them publically... but cannot because of the repercussions.
Don't get me wrong... I'm pretty sure that I could saddle up beside anyone paying their 10C fees at a concert and enjoy a beer with them; but I find it alarming at some people's mentalities. To be fair... some people are likely alarmed at mine.
Airport security isn't wrong, airport security by government goons is.
Good lord, where in the picture is it clear WHO the "goons" are? Don't private security agents wear badges too?
Why is it wrong if the government does it?
You agree security is needed, and yet somehow, you conclude this picture of two unidentified cartoons searching someone at the airport is an example of horrible government propaganda, brainwashing kids into believing a STILL unspecified evil.
Wow. Simply, wow.
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You claim to be a lawyer and I'm an electrician having to tell you about a Constitution?
You don't know why government security is different compared to private?
Wow, simply wow.
On edit: directed at vant. I'm sick of sorting quotes on my phone.
I don't claim to be anything. I'm challenging your views in this thread as an average person.
You posted a picture from a children's book, called it a textbook, and decried it as evidence of government propaganda, despite the fact that there was no reference to anything about the government in the picture.
I'm challenging you to articulate how that is (a) propaganda ("propaganda" meaning there has to be some ulterior message), (b) how it is "government" propaganda, given that the picture doesn't say who is doing the searching, (c) what "message" you think is being sent to children who read this book, and (d) if that message is: "airport security done by the government is bad," then why you believe that's the case.
If you're going to level charge after charge against some unspecified government evil, and if you're going to use a children's book that's vague in it's imagery at best, you'd better be prepared to do the heavy lifting. The internet is a real easy place to post links, make broad unsupported claims and then deflect or ignore challenges to your viewpoint, but in the words of the posting guidelines, I think we can be better here. Can you?
Swing away.
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You claim to be a lawyer and I'm an electrician having to tell you about a Constitution?
You know that Italy isn't run by American "government goons" and that the US constitution doesn't really... apply there, right?
And after all the children molested by private contractors in the middle east (that we paid about 10 times as much as we would have paid the military to do the same job and would have been subject to American laws that would have made molesting kids punishable), aren't you a bit worried about... maybe a "private security" might not have your best interests at heart when searching your wife for weapons?
this book definitely pushes an ideology ... especially with the text accompanying it ... basically saying that we should all be grateful for all the security measures the gov't has put in place ... if she were simply abiding by the procedure - it would be one thing but the insinuation that it should make people happy is troubling to me ...
this kind of stuff works very well on children ... you only have to see the mass amounts of marketing dollars spent convincing kids that high fructose corn syrup laden synthetic shit is all they need in life to be happy ... and now you have a populace where 1/3 are diabetic or at risk ... civil liberties and the constitution have been slowly eroding for a long time now ...
i'm not sure unsung doesn't have a point here ...
...
I would agree with you but the fact remains, this is NOT a text book, rather a children's book that is avaible for sale. We can choose whether or not to buy it. The screening process is not that difficult. This level of reading can be on in just a few minutes by an adult and an assessment of it content can be evaluated. then, it can be purchased for your children or returned to its shelf.
The schools are not using this book as an indoctinating tool. Schools feed your kids all kind of lies... regarding our founding fathers our wars and all kinds of other shit. Probably so they don't raise a bunch of dissidents. Kids will grow up and figure shit out, just like the rest of us do.
One of the first things they'll discover... pigs don't fly coach and don't need to be screened by the TSA.
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Hail, Hail!!!
Sweet Jesus. The things you find on here. I'll believe this is some sort of propaganda...when pigs fly
Seriously, I've had this exact same conversation with my son when he was afraid to fly. I went step by step as to what to suspect and to ease his mind and make him comfortable with the whole process. I must be part of the machine.
Sweet Jesus. The things you find on here. I'll believe this is some sort of propaganda...when pigs fly
Seriously, I've had this exact same conversation with my son when he was afraid to fly. I went step by step as to what to suspect and to ease his mind and make him comfortable with the whole process. I must be part of the machine.
...
**mutters** (government goon)
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Let us also not forget the fact that pigs are a very jovial animal. Have you heard the expression, "happy as a pig in shit"? Well, it stands to reason that if pigs are happy being covered in excrement, then they are probably happy in most situations. Personally, if given the choice between being frisked at an airport, or rooting in shit, I'd be happy as Olivia to find myself being patted down. Also, through the exhaustive research of another poster, we now know that Olivia is particularly happy with things, even for a pig.
I'm not too sure what the "propaganda" is supposed to be here. For one, the context of the book is important - I doubt Olivia is just randomly pleased to be searched. But also, what exactly is wrong with checking airline passengers for weapons at the airport? I'm also pleased that they do that! If this was cops randomly checking her for weapons on a street corner or when she's walking into school, that would be another story.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
from what I can see... the problem is that it's "Government Goons" doing it. And I'm sure is a shock to the public employees whose job it is to make sure you're safe from a hijacking on your flight that you call them "goons."
The problem that Unsung has is that as a libertarian, he thinks that nothing should be done unless someone can make a profit from it. And while the publicly-paid and accountable employees doing the screening really haven't been the huge deal that they all wish it was so they can make a big stink... they'd be much happier if we were paying 10 times more for it and "private security" was doing it.... evn if they won't be held accountable for feeling up your 16 year-old daughter's boobs.
this book definitely pushes an ideology ... especially with the text accompanying it ... basically saying that we should all be grateful for all the security measures the gov't has put in place ... if she were simply abiding by the procedure - it would be one thing but the insinuation that it should make people happy is troubling to me ...
this kind of stuff works very well on children ... you only have to see the mass amounts of marketing dollars spent convincing kids that high fructose corn syrup laden synthetic shit is all they need in life to be happy ... and now you have a populace where 1/3 are diabetic or at risk ... civil liberties and the constitution have been slowly eroding for a long time now ...
i'm not sure unsung doesn't have a point here ...
Thank you. My original "textbook" comment may have been jumping the gun but I mentioned in a following post that I too was awaiting the full story. I could edit the title but really what's the point. I'm good with it.
Children should not be de-sensitized to wrongs. We must remain vigilant in the battle for our liberty and our overall well-being.
Why let the truth of it get in the way right? That wouldn't suit your agenda.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Comments
Your point about being open to learning and ideas is fair enough, but let's get serious here... how is one left to separate agendas and assumptions when the history of several posters is marked by the same ideology simply presented in a different context?
In this case... the 'ideology' that our liberties have been trampled upon was supported by a portion of a children's 'textbook' that seemed to insinuate that airport security is Big Brother flexing his muscles.
Tomorrow... we will likely see a link to a video of a policeman handcuffing a thug. The next day... a story of a government purchase that seems likely to support the impending takeover. The following day... we will read of how Eddie Vedder pm's someone to tell them how he's been impressed with these posts and that he wishes he could come out and support them publically... but cannot because of the repercussions.
Don't get me wrong... I'm pretty sure that I could saddle up beside anyone paying their 10C fees at a concert and enjoy a beer with them; but I find it alarming at some people's mentalities. To be fair... some people are likely alarmed at mine.
Good lord, where in the picture is it clear WHO the "goons" are? Don't private security agents wear badges too?
Why is it wrong if the government does it?
You agree security is needed, and yet somehow, you conclude this picture of two unidentified cartoons searching someone at the airport is an example of horrible government propaganda, brainwashing kids into believing a STILL unspecified evil.
Wow. Simply, wow.
2003-06-16 St. Paul
2006-06-26 St. Paul
2007-08-05 Chicago
2009-08-23 Chicago
2009-08-28 San Francisco
2010-05-01 NOLA (Jazz Fest)
2011-07-02 EV Minneapolis
2011-09-03 PJ20
2011-09-04 PJ20
2011-09-17 Winnipeg
2012-06-26 Amsterdam
2012-06-27 Amsterdam
2013-07-19 Wrigley
2013-11-21 San Diego
2013-11-23 Los Angeles
2013-11-24 Los Angeles
2014-07-08 Leeds, UK
2014-07-11 Milton Keynes, UK
2014-10-09 Lincoln
2014-10-19 St. Paul
2014-10-20 Milwaukee
2016-08-20 Wrigley 1
2016-08-22 Wrigley 2
2018-06-18 London 1
2018-08-18 Wrigley 1
2018-08-20 Wrigley 2
2022-09-16 Nashville
2023-08-31 St. Paul
2023-09-02 St. Paul
2023-09-05 Chicago 1
2024-08-31 Wrigley 2
2024-09-15 Fenway 1
2024-09-27 Ohana 1
2024-09-29 Ohana 2
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
You don't know why government security is different compared to private?
Wow, simply wow.
On edit: directed at vant. I'm sick of sorting quotes on my phone.
I don't claim to be anything. I'm challenging your views in this thread as an average person.
You posted a picture from a children's book, called it a textbook, and decried it as evidence of government propaganda, despite the fact that there was no reference to anything about the government in the picture.
I'm challenging you to articulate how that is (a) propaganda ("propaganda" meaning there has to be some ulterior message), (b) how it is "government" propaganda, given that the picture doesn't say who is doing the searching, (c) what "message" you think is being sent to children who read this book, and (d) if that message is: "airport security done by the government is bad," then why you believe that's the case.
If you're going to level charge after charge against some unspecified government evil, and if you're going to use a children's book that's vague in it's imagery at best, you'd better be prepared to do the heavy lifting. The internet is a real easy place to post links, make broad unsupported claims and then deflect or ignore challenges to your viewpoint, but in the words of the posting guidelines, I think we can be better here.
Swing away.
2003-06-16 St. Paul
2006-06-26 St. Paul
2007-08-05 Chicago
2009-08-23 Chicago
2009-08-28 San Francisco
2010-05-01 NOLA (Jazz Fest)
2011-07-02 EV Minneapolis
2011-09-03 PJ20
2011-09-04 PJ20
2011-09-17 Winnipeg
2012-06-26 Amsterdam
2012-06-27 Amsterdam
2013-07-19 Wrigley
2013-11-21 San Diego
2013-11-23 Los Angeles
2013-11-24 Los Angeles
2014-07-08 Leeds, UK
2014-07-11 Milton Keynes, UK
2014-10-09 Lincoln
2014-10-19 St. Paul
2014-10-20 Milwaukee
2016-08-20 Wrigley 1
2016-08-22 Wrigley 2
2018-06-18 London 1
2018-08-18 Wrigley 1
2018-08-20 Wrigley 2
2022-09-16 Nashville
2023-08-31 St. Paul
2023-09-02 St. Paul
2023-09-05 Chicago 1
2024-08-31 Wrigley 2
2024-09-15 Fenway 1
2024-09-27 Ohana 1
2024-09-29 Ohana 2
So then who should do it?
Or... should it just be... Voluntary?
You know that Italy isn't run by American "government goons" and that the US constitution doesn't really... apply there, right?
And after all the children molested by private contractors in the middle east (that we paid about 10 times as much as we would have paid the military to do the same job and would have been subject to American laws that would have made molesting kids punishable), aren't you a bit worried about... maybe a "private security" might not have your best interests at heart when searching your wife for weapons?
I would agree with you but the fact remains, this is NOT a text book, rather a children's book that is avaible for sale. We can choose whether or not to buy it. The screening process is not that difficult. This level of reading can be on in just a few minutes by an adult and an assessment of it content can be evaluated. then, it can be purchased for your children or returned to its shelf.
The schools are not using this book as an indoctinating tool. Schools feed your kids all kind of lies... regarding our founding fathers our wars and all kinds of other shit. Probably so they don't raise a bunch of dissidents. Kids will grow up and figure shit out, just like the rest of us do.
One of the first things they'll discover... pigs don't fly coach and don't need to be screened by the TSA.
Hail, Hail!!!
Hail, Hail!!!
Seriously, I've had this exact same conversation with my son when he was afraid to fly. I went step by step as to what to suspect and to ease his mind and make him comfortable with the whole process. I must be part of the machine.
http://www.reverbnation.com/brianzilm
**mutters** (government goon)
Hail, Hail!!!
The problem that Unsung has is that as a libertarian, he thinks that nothing should be done unless someone can make a profit from it. And while the publicly-paid and accountable employees doing the screening really haven't been the huge deal that they all wish it was so they can make a big stink... they'd be much happier if we were paying 10 times more for it and "private security" was doing it.... evn if they won't be held accountable for feeling up your 16 year-old daughter's boobs.
Because it's all about money.
Why let the truth of it get in the way right? That wouldn't suit your agenda.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
is this a textbook?
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Libertarians find conspiracy in EVERYTHING!!!! And they tend to overlook the racist ramblings of their hero Ron Paul.
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