So unless I say everyone is a racist, you are just going to continue with the little and no actual comments?
If it's not worth getting into then stop posting smileys without comments.
hey ... i apologized ... what do you want?
it's just we've been through this ... you don't really think racism is a problem in the US ... i wholeheartedly disagree ... i can go on about how many racist bumper stickers i see down there but all you're gonna do is say it's not that big of a deal ... and we're at where we're at ...
No, you are wrong. And you think you'd no better since we have discussed it.
I've never said racism is not a problem in the US...you continue to put words in my mouth. I just don't think it is always the problem. Plenty of racism to go around, even up there (Native Americans come to mind). I just think it is lazy to always blame it on racism and ignore all the other issues involved.
Conservatives seem to have such a high level of denial when discussing racism. Do people actually think that there is an equal proportion of racists in each group across the political spectrum?
You can read between the lines in a lot of conservative's criticism of Obama in the last 4 years. Yes, there's is subjectivity in my interpretation, but why didn't Republicans have to "take back the country" when Clinton was president? (just one example)
Umm, I think the "Take our country back" stuff has been done plenty of times before.
This is the problem, so now any criticism of Obama, when you "read between the lines", is racist? This si the bullshit I'm talking about.
And it depends on how you are measuring racism. Do I think there are an equal number of black people that hate white people for being white as there are white people for hating black people for being black? I have no idea really. But I know both exist and I'm not going to excuse one or the other.
No, you are wrong. And you think you'd no better since we have discussed it.
I've never said racism is not a problem in the US...you continue to put words in my mouth. I just don't think it is always the problem. Plenty of racism to go around, even up there (Native Americans come to mind). I just think it is lazy to always blame it on racism and ignore all the other issues involved.
i am not really interested in going back to our discussions to point out what we've discussed ... it's not going to get us anywhere ...
all i will say is if you think it's lazy for people to claim racism then in some instances it's just as lazy to deny it
No, you are wrong. And you think you'd no better since we have discussed it.
I've never said racism is not a problem in the US...you continue to put words in my mouth. I just don't think it is always the problem. Plenty of racism to go around, even up there (Native Americans come to mind). I just think it is lazy to always blame it on racism and ignore all the other issues involved.
i am not really interested in going back to our discussions to point out what we've discussed ... it's not going to get us anywhere ...
all i will say is if you think it's lazy for people to claim racism then in some instances it's just as lazy to deny it
Then stop putting words in my mouth and I won't have to continually correct you.
As for your last statement, it is lazy to deny it outright as some times it is the root cause.
Then stop putting words in my mouth and I won't have to continually correct you.
As for your last statement, it is lazy to deny it outright as some times it is the root cause.
again - i am going by my recollection of our past conversations ... if you deny it - so be it ... if you are now saying racism is indeed a problem ... great ... if you claim to have said it in the past ... great ... i will say i remembered incorrectly ... either way ... it gets us to the same point ... that racism is indeed a problem in the US ... and a lot of places for that matter ...
Conservatives seem to have such a high level of denial when discussing racism. Do people actually think that there is an equal proportion of racists in each group across the political spectrum?
You can read between the lines in a lot of conservative's criticism of Obama in the last 4 years. Yes, there's is subjectivity in my interpretation, but why didn't Republicans have to "take back the country" when Clinton was president? (just one example)
the republicans were a major factor in shutting the gov't down during the Clinton years. The contract with America was exactly about "taking the country back"...same concept. But they may have not used the term, take our country back...although I am willing to bet they did.
Do people not remember the level of animosity that ran through the gov't during the Clinton years? they investigated the man for 8 years. They IMPEACHED HIIM...Selective remembering of what republicans acted like in the 90's might be clouding the opinion of what they are acting like now. Too much credit is being given to the gov't for the successes we saw in our economy in the 90's and the public seems to be remembering the Republican behavior a little too fondly IMO
there are definitely white, racist conservatives. I also know white racists who are voting for President Obama strangely enough. Racism is A problem, it just isn't the motivation for and cause of EVERY problem
There was an article in our local paper about the local NBA team going after white players because they want to sell tickets. Literally said the motivation behind recent signings is to accumulate WHITE basketball players to increase attendance...We had a franchise player that was black for a decade...sold out all the time, was a hot ticket and the place to be sports wise...Harvin, Peterson are two black athletes that are the face of another pro sports franchise here that sell thousands of tickets by themselves...you want to know what sells tickets...WINNING...nothing more nothing less. That is a prime example of when keeping racism real went wrong.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
And I'd ask someone to backup their bullshit about how Obama supporters are the REAL racists, but if there was any proof of this... We'd have seen it long ago.
My comment was about the overwhelming percentage of African Americans who supported Obama in the last election. My understanding is that it was a distinctly higher percentage than typically vote democrat.
There’s no doubt that most blacks supported Obama mostly because he was black. Same as all the uneducated white voters voted for Bush cause he sounded like them and he’d be a good guy to share some Bud Light and why most old white men are voting for Romney. All humans identify with their village, how we survived as a species.
Now when one is able to break out of the need to be a part of a group and see the issues and how they may affect one’s self interest, well those are the rare humans, the ones that have awareness.
Conservatives seem to have such a high level of denial when discussing racism. Do people actually think that there is an equal proportion of racists in each group across the political spectrum?
You can read between the lines in a lot of conservative's criticism of Obama in the last 4 years. Yes, there's is subjectivity in my interpretation, but why didn't Republicans have to "take back the country" when Clinton was president? (just one example)
Umm, I think the "Take our country back" stuff has been done plenty of times before.
This is the problem, so now any criticism of Obama, when you "read between the lines", is racist? This si the bullshit I'm talking about.
And it depends on how you are measuring racism. Do I think there are an equal number of black people that hate white people for being white as there are white people for hating black people for being black? I have no idea really. But I know both exist and I'm not going to excuse one or the other.
I'm going to take a guess and say you were about age 10 to 12 when Clinton finished his second term. And no,
there was little talk about needing to take our country back. My guess as to why is because it's used as a fear tactic, and that fear tactic isn't really going to stick when it's tried on a white guy. Fear and ignorance are rolled into racism and feed the other. Republicans play on fears, so it's logical that fearful people are drawn to the Republican party, therefore fearful racists are also more likely to be Republican.
I don't think anyone is asking you to excuse racism. My preference is that conservatives in here stop trying to minimize it and/or deny it. People aren't saying that anyone who is critical of Obama is a racist, either. My take on it is that there has been more of an alarmist/doomsday/fear response to Obama's policies because he is black.
There’s no doubt that most blacks supported Obama mostly because he was black. Same as all the uneducated white voters voted for Bush cause he sounded like them and he’d be a good guy to share some Bud Light and why most old white men are voting for Romney. All humans identify with their village, how we survived as a species.
Now when one is able to break out of the need to be a part of a group and see the issues and how they may affect one’s self interest, well those are the rare humans, the ones that have awareness.
There's no doubt? Blacks overwhelmingly vote Democrat regardless of the candidates race. In '08 there was greater turnout amongst black voters. Do people think this is due to racism, or due to inspiration that someone of your race and ethnicity might become president when 40 plus years ago you weren't even able to vote?
from the story "The increase included about 2 million more black voters," People interested in race as a motivator may look at that and say they came out because of a black candidate. More likely, Obama being considered the first black president was simply icing on the cake as those two million were finally inspired to participate in the election process and voted for a candidate that fit their beliefs...but some may have participated simply because a black democrat had the nomination.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
There’s no doubt that most blacks supported Obama mostly because he was black. Same as all the uneducated white voters voted for Bush cause he sounded like them and he’d be a good guy to share some Bud Light and why most old white men are voting for Romney. All humans identify with their village, how we survived as a species.
Now when one is able to break out of the need to be a part of a group and see the issues and how they may affect one’s self interest, well those are the rare humans, the ones that have awareness.
There's no doubt? Blacks overwhelmingly vote Democrat regardless of the candidates race. In '08 there was greater turnout amongst black voters. Do people think this is due to racism, or due to inspiration that someone of your race and ethnicity might become president when 40 plus years ago you weren't even able to vote?
Yeah thinking its more of being black than being a democrat. If you had old white dude as democrat and Obama as republican, more blacks would vote republican then ever before. Agree the inspiration part was a huge driver along with validation. Was a good thing. And how cool was it to see the red in whitey's eyes when he was elected. More racism on white side than black....as I see it.
My comment was about the overwhelming percentage of African Americans who supported Obama in the last election. My understanding is that it was a distinctly higher percentage than typically vote democrat.
Yes, that's probably true. But that's not racism.
Imagine... for a moment... that you grew up as a black person in a world where much of it was shut off to you. Never a black president... you may have even grown up not being allowed to eat at certain restaurants or drink from certain water fountains. Or go to certain schools.
Imagine that there was a man who had the chance to be proof that a black man COULD be president. Something you thought you'd never see in your lifetime.
Seeing a black president is something you'd only seen in science fiction (and I mean that... aside from "Deep Impact" and "Seaquest DSV," I can't think of any other black president in movies or TV shows.
Would you be maybe more likely to vote for him?
Does that make you a "racist?" Of course not. They didn't vote against John McCain because he's white. They voted for someone from their own community. Much like how many in the GLBT community have rallied around performers like Matt Bomer and Ricky Martin after they came out... supporting your own community doesn't mean you hate people who are NOT part of it.
My comment was about the overwhelming percentage of African Americans who supported Obama in the last election. My understanding is that it was a distinctly higher percentage than typically vote democrat.
Yes, that's probably true. But that's not racism.
Imagine... for a moment... that you grew up as a black person in a world where much of it was shut off to you. Never a black president... you may have even grown up not being allowed to eat at certain restaurants or drink from certain water fountains. Or go to certain schools.
Imagine that there was a man who had the chance to be proof that a black man COULD be president. Something you thought you'd never see in your lifetime.
Seeing a black president is something you'd only seen in science fiction (and I mean that... aside from "Deep Impact" and "Seaquest DSV," I can't think of any other black president in movies or TV shows.
Would you be maybe more likely to vote for him?
Does that make you a "racist?" Of course not. They didn't vote against John McCain because he's white. They voted for someone from their own community. Much like how many in the GLBT community have rallied around performers like Matt Bomer and Ricky Martin after they came out... supporting your own community doesn't mean you hate people who are NOT part of it.
Completely understandable and completely acceptable. If someone cannot understand this within this context... then they are simple.
My comment was about the overwhelming percentage of African Americans who supported Obama in the last election. My understanding is that it was a distinctly higher percentage than typically vote democrat.
Yes, that's probably true. But that's not racism.
Imagine... for a moment... that you grew up as a black person in a world where much of it was shut off to you. Never a black president... you may have even grown up not being allowed to eat at certain restaurants or drink from certain water fountains. Or go to certain schools.
Imagine that there was a man who had the chance to be proof that a black man COULD be president. Something you thought you'd never see in your lifetime.
Seeing a black president is something you'd only seen in science fiction (and I mean that... aside from "Deep Impact" and "Seaquest DSV," I can't think of any other black president in movies or TV shows.
Would you be maybe more likely to vote for him?
Does that make you a "racist?" Of course not. They didn't vote against John McCain because he's white. They voted for someone from their own community. Much like how many in the GLBT community have rallied around performers like Matt Bomer and Ricky Martin after they came out... supporting your own community doesn't mean you hate people who are NOT part of it.
that might have been the best post I have seen you write. Devil's advocate here...supporting someone from your group because they are from your group only seems a lot like the arguments I heard on Jerry Springer from racists. So doesn't it simply boil down to an individual and their heart. Unless they offer the info, no statistic alone will tell us about racism in voting IMO of course...
It is in interesting distinction. Not sure it even has to be made either way though. How have we figured out that it is race that is driving the criticisms to begin with? that is the part that is frustrating to me. maybe it isn't racism to vote FOR a white man because he is white, or FOR a black man because he is black...It is certainly short sided and silly to vote on that issue, but doesn't racism creep in when you vote AGAINST someone simply because of the color of their skin.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
My comment was about the overwhelming percentage of African Americans who supported Obama in the last election. My understanding is that it was a distinctly higher percentage than typically vote democrat.
Yes, that's probably true. But that's not racism.
Imagine... for a moment... that you grew up as a black person in a world where much of it was shut off to you. Never a black president... you may have even grown up not being allowed to eat at certain restaurants or drink from certain water fountains. Or go to certain schools.
Imagine that there was a man who had the chance to be proof that a black man COULD be president. Something you thought you'd never see in your lifetime.
Seeing a black president is something you'd only seen in science fiction (and I mean that... aside from "Deep Impact" and "Seaquest DSV," I can't think of any other black president in movies or TV shows.
Would you be maybe more likely to vote for him?
Does that make you a "racist?" Of course not. They didn't vote against John McCain because he's white. They voted for someone from their own community. Much like how many in the GLBT community have rallied around performers like Matt Bomer and Ricky Martin after they came out... supporting your own community doesn't mean you hate people who are NOT part of it.
I completely agree and well thought out, many in my family in law had that way of thinking.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Seeing a black president is something you'd only seen in science fiction (and I mean that... aside from "Deep Impact" and "Seaquest DSV," I can't think of any other black president in movies or TV shows.
Seeing a black president is something you'd only seen in science fiction (and I mean that... aside from "Deep Impact" and "Seaquest DSV," I can't think of any other black president in movies or TV shows.
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I remember the All State guy claiming he paved the way for Obama after he won.
Devil's advocate here...supporting someone from your group because they are from your group only seems a lot like the arguments I heard on Jerry Springer from racists. So doesn't it simply boil down to an individual and their heart. Unless they offer the info, no statistic alone will tell us about racism in voting IMO of course...
Well that's why I said "more likely."
The black community always looked at Alan Keys as a joke. He was a total knob. An asshole. That he was black wasn't look at as a source of pride in the black community... more of a dark mark they didn't talk about. So just being black wasn't enough to gain him any support. He also had to espouse views and policies that the community held. And as a Republican, anti-equality, anti-choice, corporate stooge, he was just laughed at. Same with Herman Cain. Herman Cain was a black man that Republicans briefly waved around the same way they waved around Sarah Palin. "Oh.. you want a woman... here... she's a woman... if that's all you want... here's a picture of her vagina!!" "Oh... you want a black man... well... Herman Cain is a black man.... yeah, he's an asshole and a serial adulterer and has zero knowledge about the world and knows nothing about being a head of state but he's black... and that's all you want, right?"
Wrong.
Just like how the gay community didn't exactly jump up and down when Roy Ashburn or Larry Craig got outed. Just being gay didn't make us any more likely to support them when they supported views and policies that were very much against what we usually support.
But anyone fucks with Barney Frank... Oh no you didn't. Cuz I'll cut a bitch.
I'd ALSO like to point out that Barack Obama has been the target of such vile slander and vitriol that it made a lot of us find our inner Angry Liberal Warrior and jump to his defense.
I've spoken to many disillusioned Republicans lamenting about how they just don't understand how Mitt Romney hit the ceiling at 48% of the popular vote and went no further, no matter how hard they pushed. They would then start to say things like "Anti-Colonial" and rant about birth certificates. And I'd tell them that "THAT is why."
If conservatives had taken the policy approach and talked about economic policies that resonated with the soccer moms and the Nascar dads... talked about issues that resonated with lower-wage earners about job market growth and the speed of the recovery... maybe that might have won more of them over.
But instead, all I saw were vicious attacks from bullies... name-calling, pointless slags about his birth certificate... calling him things like "Obummer" or "Odumma" or "Oballah!!!"
Whining about him being "the messiah" or "Your SOCIALIST EMPEROR!!" (which is a contradiction in terms... that's like saying "your elected queen."
Or people wailing about Reverend Wright.
If that video that surfaced 5 years ago of Reverend Wright saying "God Damn America" didn't make an impact 4 years ago... did you think that flogging that dead horse for four years was going to do anything other than make you look like a sore loser?
If calling his birth records into question didn't make a difference 4 years ago... did you think that it would now? And if so... what made you think that?
If you hammered away at him and called him a "socialist" and that just made the union members like him more.. did you really think that adding "Nazi Communist" to the end of that would help? Because all that did was piss off the Jewish and gay community MORE.
Devil's advocate here...supporting someone from your group because they are from your group only seems a lot like the arguments I heard on Jerry Springer from racists. So doesn't it simply boil down to an individual and their heart. Unless they offer the info, no statistic alone will tell us about racism in voting IMO of course...
Well that's why I said "more likely."
The black community always looked at Alan Keys as a joke. He was a total knob. An asshole. That he was black wasn't look at as a source of pride in the black community... more of a dark mark they didn't talk about. So just being black wasn't enough to gain him any support. He also had to espouse views and policies that the community held. And as a Republican, anti-equality, anti-choice, corporate stooge, he was just laughed at. Same with Herman Cain. Herman Cain was a black man that Republicans briefly waved around the same way they waved around Sarah Palin. "Oh.. you want a woman... here... she's a woman... if that's all you want... here's a picture of her vagina!!" "Oh... you want a black man... well... Herman Cain is a black man.... yeah, he's an asshole and a serial adulterer and has zero knowledge about the world and knows nothing about being a head of state but he's black... and that's all you want, right?"
Wrong.
Just like how the gay community didn't exactly jump up and down when Roy Ashburn or Larry Craig got outed. Just being gay didn't make us any more likely to support them when they supported views and policies that were very much against what we usually support.
But anyone fucks with Barney Frank... Oh no you didn't. Cuz I'll cut a bitch.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I'd ALSO like to point out that Barack Obama has been the target of such vile slander and vitriol that it made a lot of us find our inner Angry Liberal Warrior and jump to his defense.
I've spoken to many disillusioned Republicans lamenting about how they just don't understand how Mitt Romney hit the ceiling at 48% of the popular vote and went no further, no matter how hard they pushed. They would then start to say things like "Anti-Colonial" and rant about birth certificates. And I'd tell them that "THAT is why."
If conservatives had taken the policy approach and talked about economic policies that resonated with the soccer moms and the Nascar dads... talked about issues that resonated with lower-wage earners about job market growth and the speed of the recovery... maybe that might have won more of them over.
But instead, all I saw were vicious attacks from bullies... name-calling, pointless slags about his birth certificate... calling him things like "Obummer" or "Odumma" or "Oballah!!!"
Whining about him being "the messiah" or "Your SOCIALIST EMPEROR!!" (which is a contradiction in terms... that's like saying "your elected queen."
Or people wailing about Reverend Wright.
If that video that surfaced 5 years ago of Reverend Wright saying "God Damn America" didn't make an impact 4 years ago... did you think that flogging that dead horse for four years was going to do anything other than make you look like a sore loser?
If calling his birth records into question didn't make a difference 4 years ago... did you think that it would now? And if so... what made you think that?
If you hammered away at him and called him a "socialist" and that just made the union members like him more.. did you really think that adding "Nazi Communist" to the end of that would help? Because all that did was piss off the Jewish and gay community MORE.
This is really well stated . I am an independent, and not a huge fan of the President. But is seems Ike the republican faithful have gone off the deep end with the hate, and it has been a real turnoff. They don't have my support this year, and they won't unless they have something better to offer than "vote Romney because Obama is the anti-Christ".
Comments
No, you are wrong. And you think you'd no better since we have discussed it.
I've never said racism is not a problem in the US...you continue to put words in my mouth. I just don't think it is always the problem. Plenty of racism to go around, even up there (Native Americans come to mind). I just think it is lazy to always blame it on racism and ignore all the other issues involved.
Umm, I think the "Take our country back" stuff has been done plenty of times before.
This is the problem, so now any criticism of Obama, when you "read between the lines", is racist? This si the bullshit I'm talking about.
And it depends on how you are measuring racism. Do I think there are an equal number of black people that hate white people for being white as there are white people for hating black people for being black? I have no idea really. But I know both exist and I'm not going to excuse one or the other.
i am not really interested in going back to our discussions to point out what we've discussed ... it's not going to get us anywhere ...
all i will say is if you think it's lazy for people to claim racism then in some instances it's just as lazy to deny it
Then stop putting words in my mouth and I won't have to continually correct you.
As for your last statement, it is lazy to deny it outright as some times it is the root cause.
again - i am going by my recollection of our past conversations ... if you deny it - so be it ... if you are now saying racism is indeed a problem ... great ... if you claim to have said it in the past ... great ... i will say i remembered incorrectly ... either way ... it gets us to the same point ... that racism is indeed a problem in the US ... and a lot of places for that matter ...
the republicans were a major factor in shutting the gov't down during the Clinton years. The contract with America was exactly about "taking the country back"...same concept. But they may have not used the term, take our country back...although I am willing to bet they did.
Do people not remember the level of animosity that ran through the gov't during the Clinton years? they investigated the man for 8 years. They IMPEACHED HIIM...Selective remembering of what republicans acted like in the 90's might be clouding the opinion of what they are acting like now. Too much credit is being given to the gov't for the successes we saw in our economy in the 90's and the public seems to be remembering the Republican behavior a little too fondly IMO
there are definitely white, racist conservatives. I also know white racists who are voting for President Obama strangely enough. Racism is A problem, it just isn't the motivation for and cause of EVERY problem
There was an article in our local paper about the local NBA team going after white players because they want to sell tickets. Literally said the motivation behind recent signings is to accumulate WHITE basketball players to increase attendance...We had a franchise player that was black for a decade...sold out all the time, was a hot ticket and the place to be sports wise...Harvin, Peterson are two black athletes that are the face of another pro sports franchise here that sell thousands of tickets by themselves...you want to know what sells tickets...WINNING...nothing more nothing less. That is a prime example of when keeping racism real went wrong.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Now when one is able to break out of the need to be a part of a group and see the issues and how they may affect one’s self interest, well those are the rare humans, the ones that have awareness.
I'm going to take a guess and say you were about age 10 to 12 when Clinton finished his second term. And no,
there was little talk about needing to take our country back. My guess as to why is because it's used as a fear tactic, and that fear tactic isn't really going to stick when it's tried on a white guy. Fear and ignorance are rolled into racism and feed the other. Republicans play on fears, so it's logical that fearful people are drawn to the Republican party, therefore fearful racists are also more likely to be Republican.
I don't think anyone is asking you to excuse racism. My preference is that conservatives in here stop trying to minimize it and/or deny it. People aren't saying that anyone who is critical of Obama is a racist, either. My take on it is that there has been more of an alarmist/doomsday/fear response to Obama's policies because he is black.
There's no doubt? Blacks overwhelmingly vote Democrat regardless of the candidates race. In '08 there was greater turnout amongst black voters. Do people think this is due to racism, or due to inspiration that someone of your race and ethnicity might become president when 40 plus years ago you weren't even able to vote?
Percentage of the group isn't the only indicator that could be used to "prove" it otherwise...couldn't voter turn out increases also indicate it as well?
http://www.census.gov/newsroom/releases ... 9-110.html
from the story "The increase included about 2 million more black voters," People interested in race as a motivator may look at that and say they came out because of a black candidate. More likely, Obama being considered the first black president was simply icing on the cake as those two million were finally inspired to participate in the election process and voted for a candidate that fit their beliefs...but some may have participated simply because a black democrat had the nomination.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Yes, that's probably true. But that's not racism.
Imagine... for a moment... that you grew up as a black person in a world where much of it was shut off to you. Never a black president... you may have even grown up not being allowed to eat at certain restaurants or drink from certain water fountains. Or go to certain schools.
Imagine that there was a man who had the chance to be proof that a black man COULD be president. Something you thought you'd never see in your lifetime.
Seeing a black president is something you'd only seen in science fiction (and I mean that... aside from "Deep Impact" and "Seaquest DSV," I can't think of any other black president in movies or TV shows.
Would you be maybe more likely to vote for him?
Does that make you a "racist?" Of course not. They didn't vote against John McCain because he's white. They voted for someone from their own community. Much like how many in the GLBT community have rallied around performers like Matt Bomer and Ricky Martin after they came out... supporting your own community doesn't mean you hate people who are NOT part of it.
Completely understandable and completely acceptable. If someone cannot understand this within this context... then they are simple.
Nope, but thanks for the condescending comment. Always appreciated and valuable to the discussion!
that might have been the best post I have seen you write. Devil's advocate here...supporting someone from your group because they are from your group only seems a lot like the arguments I heard on Jerry Springer from racists. So doesn't it simply boil down to an individual and their heart. Unless they offer the info, no statistic alone will tell us about racism in voting IMO of course...
It is in interesting distinction. Not sure it even has to be made either way though. How have we figured out that it is race that is driving the criticisms to begin with? that is the part that is frustrating to me. maybe it isn't racism to vote FOR a white man because he is white, or FOR a black man because he is black...It is certainly short sided and silly to vote on that issue, but doesn't racism creep in when you vote AGAINST someone simply because of the color of their skin.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
I completely agree and well thought out, many in my family in law had that way of thinking.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
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Well that's why I said "more likely."
The black community always looked at Alan Keys as a joke. He was a total knob. An asshole. That he was black wasn't look at as a source of pride in the black community... more of a dark mark they didn't talk about. So just being black wasn't enough to gain him any support. He also had to espouse views and policies that the community held. And as a Republican, anti-equality, anti-choice, corporate stooge, he was just laughed at. Same with Herman Cain. Herman Cain was a black man that Republicans briefly waved around the same way they waved around Sarah Palin. "Oh.. you want a woman... here... she's a woman... if that's all you want... here's a picture of her vagina!!" "Oh... you want a black man... well... Herman Cain is a black man.... yeah, he's an asshole and a serial adulterer and has zero knowledge about the world and knows nothing about being a head of state but he's black... and that's all you want, right?"
Wrong.
Just like how the gay community didn't exactly jump up and down when Roy Ashburn or Larry Craig got outed. Just being gay didn't make us any more likely to support them when they supported views and policies that were very much against what we usually support.
But anyone fucks with Barney Frank... Oh no you didn't. Cuz I'll cut a bitch.
I've spoken to many disillusioned Republicans lamenting about how they just don't understand how Mitt Romney hit the ceiling at 48% of the popular vote and went no further, no matter how hard they pushed. They would then start to say things like "Anti-Colonial" and rant about birth certificates. And I'd tell them that "THAT is why."
If conservatives had taken the policy approach and talked about economic policies that resonated with the soccer moms and the Nascar dads... talked about issues that resonated with lower-wage earners about job market growth and the speed of the recovery... maybe that might have won more of them over.
But instead, all I saw were vicious attacks from bullies... name-calling, pointless slags about his birth certificate... calling him things like "Obummer" or "Odumma" or "Oballah!!!"
Whining about him being "the messiah" or "Your SOCIALIST EMPEROR!!" (which is a contradiction in terms... that's like saying "your elected queen."
Or people wailing about Reverend Wright.
If that video that surfaced 5 years ago of Reverend Wright saying "God Damn America" didn't make an impact 4 years ago... did you think that flogging that dead horse for four years was going to do anything other than make you look like a sore loser?
If calling his birth records into question didn't make a difference 4 years ago... did you think that it would now? And if so... what made you think that?
If you hammered away at him and called him a "socialist" and that just made the union members like him more.. did you really think that adding "Nazi Communist" to the end of that would help? Because all that did was piss off the Jewish and gay community MORE.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
This is really well stated . I am an independent, and not a huge fan of the President. But is seems Ike the republican faithful have gone off the deep end with the hate, and it has been a real turnoff. They don't have my support this year, and they won't unless they have something better to offer than "vote Romney because Obama is the anti-Christ".