if he is killed by an american bullet it is an american victory
if he kills himself he is a martyr to his supporters.
:? :eh:
Yeah, it's an American victory but he's still a martyr, as far as his followers are concerned.
Suicide to prevent being captured ain't acceptable to those guys. He'd be remembered as a coward.
(AP) This book cover image released by Dutton shows "No Easy Day: The Firsthand Account of the Mission...
Full Image
WASHINGTON (AP) - A firsthand account of the Navy SEAL raid that killed Osama bin Laden contradicts previous accounts by administration officials, raising questions as to whether the terror mastermind presented a clear threat when SEALs first fired upon him....
did anyone ever think he presented a clear threat when the SEALs came upon him???? i just figured being bin laden was enough to get a bullet in the head.. rightly or wrongly.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Still just wonder why the conflicting accounts? Why the huge administration sell of how it went one way, but a SEAL's account of how it went another way. Again, I will say I'll take a SEAL's word over ANY politician out there regardless of party.
Still just wonder why the conflicting accounts? Why the huge administration sell of how it went one way, but a SEAL's account of how it went another way. Again, I will say I'll take a SEAL's word over ANY politician out there regardless of party.
politicians lie... all the fucking time. hence conflicting accounts on a lot of shit, not only this.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I'm surprised anyone would give a shit what the circumstances were. They should probably just be glad he's dead.
Or what? Are people suddenly bothered by the idea that the government could be hiding something about a secret military assassination mission? :roll: Do folks honestly want or expect complete disclosure from the US government about military missions so that their wartime enemies can know the real deal? I dunno... seems like a pretty unrealistic expectation to me. Probably the best story in that situation is the one that gets the enemies least riled up.
Plus, why believe the SEAL over anyone else? He may not be a politician, but that doesn't automatically make him honest or void of bullshit. Not saying he's not telling the truth of course... it's just... who cares? He seems to be the one doing a disservice to his country either way.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
"...Dimitri...He talks to me...'.."The Ghost of Greece..".
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
I still just wonder why Obama and his administration lied? Really no reason to. "Yeah we walked into the house and shot him in the head". "Yeah we walked into the house and he shot himself in the head like a coward". "Yeah we walked into the house and shot him in cold murder like he deserved". No one would care how it was done. Just wonder why the big elaborate story here of how he was using a woman as a human shield? Just blows my mind. :?
I still just wonder why Obama and his administration lied? Really no reason to. "Yeah we walked into the house and shot him in the head". "Yeah we walked into the house and he shot himself in the head like a coward". "Yeah we walked into the house and shot him in cold murder like he deserved". No one would care how it was done. Just wonder why the big elaborate story here of how he was using a woman as a human shield? Just blows my mind. :?
Just fucking tell shit like it is man. :fp:
There could be a very good reason for them not to have said what actually happened, likely having to do with reaction from the Middle East, but who knows - there could be any number of reasons, possibly security related, possibly to protect people, possibly for diplomatic reasons, or whatevr. Or this other guy could be full of shit. Obviously, they had SOME reason to say what they said. Given that, I think it's pretty fucking shitty for this guy to come out with another story, true or not. Doesn't seem to be in the best interests of his country at all, under these circumstances.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
My one big questions are the differences in this story really all that big? It seems like the difference is the guys position and whether he was holding a gun. This was an assiniation mission from the start. Why does it matter?
Also as someone who has read many seal books from lutrell to Somalia, this book is clearly for a lot of money and is not going to go over well in the military community, especially with the seals. This guy must have gotten a lot of money to lose all respect of anyone he has worked with.
If this is the biggest issue then it's a non issue. I also think its pretty funny that he gave him credit for going forward with the raid since he knew nothing of the intelligence they. "I give the guy credit for doing something I know nothing about"
NPR ran a good story about this today. They interviewed Peter Bergen about the incident and he basically said that the differences in reports were not that huge. Certainly, eyewitness reports can differ which may account for some of the discrepancies.
He also made mention of the fact that it was not illegal for Owen to write the book as the Navy does not make their guys sign non-disclosure statements unlike other special ops groups. Good listen if you have time to check it out.
He also made mention of the fact that it was not illegal for Owen to write the book as the Navy does not make their guys sign non-disclosure statements unlike other special ops groups.
Except when it comes to Republicans, right? I missed the thread you started this morning on the factual errors in Paul Ryan's speech last night. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction?
My one big questions are the differences in this story really all that big? It seems like the difference is the guys position and whether he was holding a gun. This was an assiniation mission from the start. Why does it matter?
Also as someone who has read many seal books from lutrell to Somalia, this book is clearly for a lot of money and is not going to go over well in the military community, especially with the seals. This guy must have gotten a lot of money to lose all respect of anyone he has worked with.
If this is the biggest issue then it's a non issue. I also think its pretty funny that he gave him credit for going forward with the raid since he knew nothing of the intelligence they. "I give the guy credit for doing something I know nothing about"
NPR ran a good story about this today. They interviewed Peter Bergen about the incident and he basically said that the differences in reports were not that huge. Certainly, eyewitness reports can differ which may account for some of the discrepancies.
He also made mention of the fact that it was not illegal for Owen to write the book as the Navy does not make their guys sign non-disclosure statements unlike other special ops groups. Good listen if you have time to check it out.
He also made mention of the fact that it was not illegal for Owen to write the book as the Navy does not make their guys sign non-disclosure statements unlike other special ops groups.
Really? I wonder why that is
Not sure - it might have been more because Bergen felt the book did not disclose anything that would be harmful to national security and would not be subject to any agreements. My statement of non-disclosure is probably incorrect - I can't recall what terminology he used exactly but I do remember that the Navy has different agreements than other special forces units in other branches.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
Except when it comes to Republicans, right? I missed the thread you started this morning on the factual errors in Paul Ryan's speech last night. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction?
The Pentagon warned a former Navy SEAL that he faces legal action and loss of the profit for writing a book about the raid that killed Osama bin Laden, according to a letter released Thursday night.
The letter, addressed to Mark Owen, the pseudonym for Matt Bissonnette, alleges that he broke two non-disclosure agreements. He signed the agreements after leaving the Navy in April 2012 and in 2007, and they prevent him from releasing classified information.
It was sent to Bissonnette by Jeh Johnson, the Pentagon's top lawyer.
"I write to formally advise you of your material breach and violation of your agreements, and to inform you that the (Pentagon) is considering pursuing against you, and all those acting in concert with you, all remedies legally available to us in light of this situation," Johnson wrote in the letter, which was sent in care of the publisher, Penguin Putnam.
The book, No Easy Day, gives a first-hand account of the May 2011 raid that killed bin Laden, the terror mastermind. Bissonnette did not submit the book to the Pentagon for pre-publication review as required by the military, according to the Pentagon.
Dutton, the publisher, has maintained that the book does not disclose secret information. It goes on sale Tuesday.
It's unclear how far the military is willing to go in punishing a member of the team that killed bin Laden after a decade on the run. Two officials have told USA TODAY that prosecution is unlikely.
He also made mention of the fact that it was not illegal for Owen to write the book as the Navy does not make their guys sign non-disclosure statements unlike other special ops groups.
Really? I wonder why that is
Not sure - it might have been more because Bergen felt the book did not disclose anything that would be harmful to national security and would not be subject to any agreements. My statement of non-disclosure is probably incorrect - I can't recall what terminology he used exactly but I do remember that the Navy has different agreements than other special forces units in other branches.
Even Team 6? I thought it may be a little different for them since they tend to do the most secret tasks. Interesting... thank you.
Not sure - it might have been more because Bergen felt the book did not disclose anything that would be harmful to national security and would not be subject to any agreements. My statement of non-disclosure is probably incorrect - I can't recall what terminology he used exactly but I do remember that the Navy has different agreements than other special forces units in other branches.
Even Team 6? I thought it may be a little different for them since they tend to do the most secret tasks. Interesting... thank you.
Thats' what I would have thought as well. Bergen seemed to think there would be more fallout from fellow SEAL's because he broke their own code of silence. I saw the article Who Princess posted that says the Pentagon is possibly pursuing legal action, although, I think its unlikely because it would make the Pentagon look bad, prosecuting a hero. Anyhow, it should be interesting to see how it all plays out.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
The Pentagon warned a former Navy SEAL that he faces legal action and loss of the profit for writing a book about the raid that killed Osama bin Laden, according to a letter released Thursday night.
The letter, addressed to Mark Owen, the pseudonym for Matt Bissonnette, alleges that he broke two non-disclosure agreements. He signed the agreements after leaving the Navy in April 2012 and in 2007, and they prevent him from releasing classified information.
It was sent to Bissonnette by Jeh Johnson, the Pentagon's top lawyer.
"I write to formally advise you of your material breach and violation of your agreements, and to inform you that the (Pentagon) is considering pursuing against you, and all those acting in concert with you, all remedies legally available to us in light of this situation," Johnson wrote in the letter, which was sent in care of the publisher, Penguin Putnam.
The book, No Easy Day, gives a first-hand account of the May 2011 raid that killed bin Laden, the terror mastermind. Bissonnette did not submit the book to the Pentagon for pre-publication review as required by the military, according to the Pentagon.
Dutton, the publisher, has maintained that the book does not disclose secret information. It goes on sale Tuesday.
It's unclear how far the military is willing to go in punishing a member of the team that killed bin Laden after a decade on the run. Two officials have told USA TODAY that prosecution is unlikely.
how does the publisher know if there were no secrets? Kinda implies that he knows something?
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Somehow I don't find that just because this guy was there, he is any more or less believable than the official account. It's possible he's trying to set the record straight but it looks a lot more like he's doing it for the $$$. A firsthand account sounds exciting but I'm sure that embellishing the details would sell a few more copies.
I'd expect that there are LOTS of details not disclosed to the general public last year but somehow I don't think we're going to get them from this book.
Except when it comes to Republicans, right? I missed the thread you started this morning on the factual errors in Paul Ryan's speech last night. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction?
I didn't hear any factual errors.
...
And... there is your answer.
If you only listen to the voices you agree with... you'll only hear the lies you already believe in.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
So where's the bluster and shouts of TREASON!!!, I mean when the whole Wikileaks thing broke some of you were foaming at the mouth over a service man or two supplying info.
Isn't this kind of the same thing, actually it may even be worse, given this SEAL is going to profit from book sales. Is it that he gets a pass because he's not a Lady GaGa fan??
I guess if you only listen to the voices you disagree with the same applies then?
...
I have no idea what that is even supposed to mean. I am not very fluent in illogic.
...
Anyway... with your being such an avid seeker or truth, you must have been absolutely livid about that whole Pat Tillman thing, weren't you? I mean, that thing was so far off from the actual truth... you must have blown a gasket.
Am I right?
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Comments
Martyrdom is overrated...dramatic.
(this comes from the daughter of a typical and yet not-so-typical Jewish mother
Yeah, it's an American victory but he's still a martyr, as far as his followers are concerned.
Suicide to prevent being captured ain't acceptable to those guys. He'd be remembered as a coward.
did anyone ever think he presented a clear threat when the SEALs came upon him???? i just figured being bin laden was enough to get a bullet in the head.. rightly or wrongly.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
politicians lie... all the fucking time. hence conflicting accounts on a lot of shit, not only this.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Or what? Are people suddenly bothered by the idea that the government could be hiding something about a secret military assassination mission? :roll: Do folks honestly want or expect complete disclosure from the US government about military missions so that their wartime enemies can know the real deal? I dunno... seems like a pretty unrealistic expectation to me. Probably the best story in that situation is the one that gets the enemies least riled up.
Plus, why believe the SEAL over anyone else? He may not be a politician, but that doesn't automatically make him honest or void of bullshit. Not saying he's not telling the truth of course... it's just... who cares? He seems to be the one doing a disservice to his country either way.
That Mark Owen guy is a bitter, whiney little douche.
I would have figured that a Navy SEAL wouldn't be bursting into tears that he didn't become famous or act so... well, like a crybaby asshole.
I used to respect those guys.
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
The poison from the poison stream caught up to you ELEVEN years ago and you floated out of here. Sept. 14, 08
Just fucking tell shit like it is man. :fp:
NPR ran a good story about this today. They interviewed Peter Bergen about the incident and he basically said that the differences in reports were not that huge. Certainly, eyewitness reports can differ which may account for some of the discrepancies.
He also made mention of the fact that it was not illegal for Owen to write the book as the Navy does not make their guys sign non-disclosure statements unlike other special ops groups. Good listen if you have time to check it out.
http://www.npr.org/2012/08/30/160322677/manhunt-author-reviews-navy-seals-no-easy-day
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
Really? I wonder why that is
Except when it comes to Republicans, right? I missed the thread you started this morning on the factual errors in Paul Ryan's speech last night. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction?
Good stuff. I read his article on CNN this morning. Was very good. I'll check this out.
Not sure - it might have been more because Bergen felt the book did not disclose anything that would be harmful to national security and would not be subject to any agreements. My statement of non-disclosure is probably incorrect - I can't recall what terminology he used exactly but I do remember that the Navy has different agreements than other special forces units in other branches.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
I didn't hear any factual errors.
Even Team 6? I thought it may be a little different for them since they tend to do the most secret tasks. Interesting... thank you.
Thats' what I would have thought as well. Bergen seemed to think there would be more fallout from fellow SEAL's because he broke their own code of silence. I saw the article Who Princess posted that says the Pentagon is possibly pursuing legal action, although, I think its unlikely because it would make the Pentagon look bad, prosecuting a hero. Anyhow, it should be interesting to see how it all plays out.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
http://news.yahoo.com/pentagon-tells-ex-seal-could-face-legal-action-013735101--abc-news-topstories.html?_esi=1
I'd expect that there are LOTS of details not disclosed to the general public last year but somehow I don't think we're going to get them from this book.
And... there is your answer.
If you only listen to the voices you agree with... you'll only hear the lies you already believe in.
Hail, Hail!!!
I guess if you only listen to the voices you disagree with the same applies then?
Isn't this kind of the same thing, actually it may even be worse, given this SEAL is going to profit from book sales. Is it that he gets a pass because he's not a Lady GaGa fan??
I have no idea what that is even supposed to mean. I am not very fluent in illogic.
...
Anyway... with your being such an avid seeker or truth, you must have been absolutely livid about that whole Pat Tillman thing, weren't you? I mean, that thing was so far off from the actual truth... you must have blown a gasket.
Am I right?
Hail, Hail!!!