Let's get to work!

WaveCameCrashin

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

:fp:



so since this is the heritage foundation we are talking about, the official conservative position must be "don't do anything. stay the course. let the earth cook. let the seas rise. the jury is still out. fuck green energy. fuck green jobs. drill baby drill. blame obama blah blah blah..."

when have any of the conservative media/blogosphere ever offered a solution to the energy crisis that has not been directly tied to big oil ie: "drill baby drill!!"???

they have no solutions. they have no answers. it is much easier to attack the guy in power and project your own lack of solutions onto the guy who is actually trying to do something different for once..

Yep that's it, just like Obama said Republicans want dirty air and dirty water. :roll:

Just wait til your electricity bills go through the roof in a couple of years due to all these insane regulations. The EPA's only solution is to drive all of our energy infusrtucture industries out of bussiness.

WaveCameCrashin

brianlux wrote:

WaveCameCrashin wrote:

brianlux wrote:

To those who quote the great George Carlin- oh yes, I loved G.C. as well. He had a great ability to hold up the mirror and show us how ridiculous or self-important or funny we all are. I totally understand his bit about the environment but what I get out of it is that idea that we are so self important and think we hold the world- maybe even the universe- in our hands. If you think that great Carlin bit describes me, fine, that's your right but I would argue that you haven't read my posts very well because it's not about me. No way.

My only suggestion would be to let go of your precious sarcasm for a minute and hold the mirror up to yourself for a change . I do, metaphorically speaking, and I'm fine with what I see. But so what? It's not about me.

No I don't think it describes you at all. I personally find you to be really cool and open minded just from a few of our pm's. unlike others on here. For what it's worth I do everything I can when it comes to the environment. For example, I ride my bike to work, pick up trash, I participate In our local beach sweeps when I can,recycle as much as possible. I started recycling all of our plastic bags and paper at work. I use a nalgene bottle so I don't have to buy water.

Like I said my problem is with the gov buearacrates and how they are tormenting small bussiness and private citizens. And I just dont get all the hate towards the companies that produce our energy. And I'm all for finding ways to improve these industries but we have to do it in a way so that we don't regress.

Thank you, Waves. Glad to hear you're doing your part in big ways!

Just as a thought, let's just focus on encouraging each other to do the right thing and not focus so much on who we do or don't like here. As for the government, we can vote and write and call our representatives but beyond that we can only be responsible for our own actions. And yes, we all like energy (or we wouldn't be sharing this forum) but let's support clean energy and find ways to decrease our energy consumption so we can continue to do this. Some companies are actually working on this. In our area for example, PG&E has been working on several energy saving programs and we participate in them at every chance.

:thumbup:

hedonist

brianlux wrote:

It amazes me that even here in "liberal" California I see far fewer people taking their own cloth bags into the grocery store rather than using brand new plastic or paper bags. We seem to be stuck in the dark ages on that one. That really has me scratching my head.

I do see many here in West Hollywood using the cloth ones, though I'm not sure if they're bringing with or buying them on the spot for future use. I'd use them too but still would have that damned trash bag issue!

Anyway, good food-for-thought thread, brian

gimmesometruth27

WaveCameCrashin wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

:fp:



so since this is the heritage foundation we are talking about, the official conservative position must be "don't do anything. stay the course. let the earth cook. let the seas rise. the jury is still out. fuck green energy. fuck green jobs. drill baby drill. blame obama blah blah blah..."

when have any of the conservative media/blogosphere ever offered a solution to the energy crisis that has not been directly tied to big oil ie: "drill baby drill!!"???

they have no solutions. they have no answers. it is much easier to attack the guy in power and project your own lack of solutions onto the guy who is actually trying to do something different for once..

Yep that's it, just like Obama said Republicans want dirty air and dirty water. :roll:

Just wait til your electricity bills go through the roof in a couple of years due to all these insane regulations. The EPA's only solution is to drive all of our energy infusrtucture industries out of bussiness.

what is your idea for a solution? continue with burning the same old fossil fuels, that actually make the EPA necessary because of all of the pollution, or try something cleaner? your answer should be obvious to me since you are against big government and the EPA, so we should be trying for clean alternatives to help reduce the EPA and the size of the federal government, correct? or the other choice is, as the term conservative implies, continue current course and don't change anything.

WaveCameCrashin

@gimmie-

I dont know what the answer is. I do know this.. The EPA has no plan what so ever. They have launched an all out war on the energy sector and we have not felt the repercussions yet and when you do you're going to be playin a different tune. Do you even realize all the thousands of products that are oil based. You know like that real pretty finish on that Gibson you have? Or how about Mr. Edison he's all over the place,and coal is his best friend.. I did however see a doc on coal mining in W.VA. And it was really dirty and the coal dust was fucking every ones house up. It was getting in their houses,water supply, it was every where. So yeah I was discusted by that. But it didn't make me hate all the coal companies and oil companies.


Here's an article to show you what these people think like.


http://cnsnews.com/blog/craig-bannister ... snt-enough


In preparation for Obama-EPA Regional Administrator Al Armendariz’s testimony before the House Energy and Commerce Committee on Wednesday, Sen. James Inhofe (R-Okla.) released a video montage of Obama EPA Regional Administrators longing to impose a green “Way Of Life Act” on Americans through the regulatory regime of the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA).

Regional Administrators talk of how they plan to “crucify” domestic energy producers, make their businesses “painful every step of the way,” or otherwise compel a green way-of-life.

Recently, Sen. Inhofe uncovered a video of Region 6 Administrator Al Armendariz admitting that EPA’s “general philosophy” is to “crucify” and “make examples” of oil and gas companies – just as Roman soldiers would crucify random citizens in conquered villages, to make an example of them. Armendariz subsequently resigned under fire for the exposed comments.

“But, it’s not just Armendariz,” Sen. Inhofe’s office warns:

“The purpose of this video is to get to know President Obama’s “green generals” – the regional administrators – who are going into battle for the Obama-EPA, working hard to force a green “way of life act” in regions across the United States.”

In the Inhofe video, EPA Region 2 Administrator Judith Enck claims, “I don’t think individual change is going to be enough” - while Armendariz twice says the Clean Water Act and Clean Air Act can be used as proxies to enforce the “Way Of Life Act” he wishes he had.

“I don’t have a Way of Life Act that I can enforce - I’ve got a Clean Air Act, I’ve got a  Clean Water Act, a Safe Drinking Water Act” that can be used to enforce green ideals, Armendariz says.

“nfortunately I don’t have a Way of Life Act I can enforce but at the same time EPA isn’t toothless and we do have certain things that we can enforce with the Clean Air Act, the Clean Water Act, the Safe Drinking Water Act - and that’s one of the reasons why (EPA enforcement chief) Cynthia is going to be here tomorrow, she’s gonna go around and take a look at some of the oil and gas facilities in the area.”

Sen. Inhofe’s office says these videos challenge the president’s claim that he favors an “all-of-the-above” energy policy:

President Obama claims to be for an “all of the above” approach to energy as he hits the campaign trail, yet these videos show us the truth: the Obama-EPA is more set on a green “way of life” that is “painful. Painful every step of the way.”

brianlux

WaveCameCrashin wrote:

Regional Administrators talk of how they plan to “crucify” domestic energy producers, make their businesses “painful every step of the way,” or otherwise compel a green way-of-life.

My first reaction to reading this is, "Well, this kind of brutal action will probably get us closer to sustainability that my docile, easier going approach." I hate to admit that because I tend to want to appeal to peoples sense of logic and sensibility. Only people generally aren't logical and don't always respond to what makes sense. Sad, isn't it?

WaveCameCrashin

brianlux wrote:

WaveCameCrashin wrote:

Regional Administrators talk of how they plan to “crucify” domestic energy producers, make their businesses “painful every step of the way,” or otherwise compel a green way-of-life.

My first reaction to reading this is, "Well, this kind of brutal action will probably get us closer to sustainability that my docile, easier going approach." I hate to admit that because I tend to want to appeal to peoples sense of logic and sensibility. Only people generally aren't logical and don't always respond to what makes sense. Sad, isn't it?

Yeah I tend to agree that people don't always do what's best, but we don't need a top down iron fisted all power central gov agencies either. I happened to agree with what Newt wanted to do with the EPA. Get rid of it and start all over with an " environmental solutions agency" further more I think these people could give a shit about the environment. All they care about is power.

usamamasan1

Drill
Frack
Nuke



Woot

peacefrompaul

WaveCameCrashin wrote:

brianlux wrote:

WaveCameCrashin wrote:

Regional Administrators talk of how they plan to “crucify” domestic energy producers, make their businesses “painful every step of the way,” or otherwise compel a green way-of-life.

My first reaction to reading this is, "Well, this kind of brutal action will probably get us closer to sustainability that my docile, easier going approach." I hate to admit that because I tend to want to appeal to peoples sense of logic and sensibility. Only people generally aren't logical and don't always respond to what makes sense. Sad, isn't it?

Yeah I tend to agree that people don't always do what's best, but we don't need a top down iron fisted all power central gov agencies either. I happened to agree with what Newt wanted to do with the EPA. Get rid of it and start all over with an " environmental solutions agency" further more I think these people could give a shit about the environment. All they care about is power.

Some probably care, there are just bad eggs so I'm not sure it's worth it. Then it just turns into another small group of people that have their influence in government and once again the politicians will strive towards their special interests, leaving everyone else behind.

brianlux

What I was trying to get at with this thread was let's (as in "let us") get to work and no, I don't just mean let the government get to work and I don't mean lets get to work wrecking the planet (you know what I mean ... hahaha... yawn).

No, we can't just sit around and expect the government to do it for us... though we could try demanding they do and, yeah, that's a long shot but what the heck, I write letter make phone calls, etc. because I think it's the right thing to do. But the even better thing to do is make a difference ourselves. Plan "no drive" days, turn off the machines more often, use cloth bags at the store, live closer to work, etc, etc. There is a lot we can do. And don't get me wrong, I'm no saint either. I've got to do more, lots more.

PJ_Soul

Desperate times call for desperate measures... Most people don't like to admit the fact that these are desperate times as far as the environment goes. People seem to think that this can be handled relatively painlessly. I disagree.

And yes, I think people have to actually suck it up and do way way more. Live near work or work near home, get rid of their cars, write their local public transportation systems to ask frequently for improved services... yeah, people are actually going to have to go out of their way to do their part. Most people just aren't willing. They won't ditch their cars... it's too hard to get the groceries home then. :roll:

brianlux

Here's and idea- how about putting the green back in "green"?

The whole "green" thing has been distorted in a number of ways. At first "green" meant doing things to improve the environment. Very quickly it became something hip to say or a word on a patch to sew on your backpack. It's also a word that has often become used to describe various forms on industry- not that this is all together a bad thing but think about it- it's often used as an excuse for us think we can have just as much stuff as ever only now our stuff is cool because it's "green".

Ok, enough "scolding"- here's the positive: Let's make "green" mean re-greening the planet. We don't want a brown or grey planet do we? Hell no- we want a green healthy planet. If we all did a little less consuming, a little more tree planting, a little more local shopping, less driving, preserving more open spaces, and do a little work cleaning up the joint we can move in that direction.

Forget about being hip- let's just put the green back in "green" because it's the right and smart thing to do.

peacefrompaul

brianlux wrote:

Here's and idea- how about putting the green back in "green"?

The whole "green" thing has been distorted in a number of ways. At first "green" meant doing things to improve the environment. Very quickly it became something hip to say or a word on a patch to sew on your backpack. It's also a word that has often become used to describe various forms on industry- not that this is all together a bad thing but think about it- it's often used as an excuse for us think we can have just as much stuff as ever only now our stuff is cool because it's "green".

Ok, enough "scolding"- here's the positive: Let's make "green" mean re-greening the planet. We don't want a brown or grey planet do we? Hell no- we want a green healthy planet. If we all did a little less consuming, a little more tree planting, a little more local shopping, less driving, preserving more open spaces, and do a little work cleaning up the joint we can move in that direction.

Forget about being hip- let's just put the green back in "green" because it's the right and smart thing to do.

It's turned into just that... being "hip" and those kids rarely do anything to help the environment from my experience. It has turned into a big money and power game in the government too... That's not what I want... Clean up your mess, recycle as much as you can, watch where you are throwing that cigarette butt, if you cut down a tree plant another in its place... All great things to help our environment... Now that is hip!

brianlux

peacefrompaul wrote:

brianlux wrote:

Here's and idea- how about putting the green back in "green"?

The whole "green" thing has been distorted in a number of ways. At first "green" meant doing things to improve the environment. Very quickly it became something hip to say or a word on a patch to sew on your backpack. It's also a word that has often become used to describe various forms on industry- not that this is all together a bad thing but think about it- it's often used as an excuse for us think we can have just as much stuff as ever only now our stuff is cool because it's "green".

Ok, enough "scolding"- here's the positive: Let's make "green" mean re-greening the planet. We don't want a brown or grey planet do we? Hell no- we want a green healthy planet. If we all did a little less consuming, a little more tree planting, a little more local shopping, less driving, preserving more open spaces, and do a little work cleaning up the joint we can move in that direction.

Forget about being hip- let's just put the green back in "green" because it's the right and smart thing to do.

It's turned into just that... being "hip" and those kids rarely do anything to help the environment from my experience. It has turned into a big money and power game in the government too... That's not what I want... Clean up your mess, recycle as much as you can, watch where you are throwing that cigarette butt, if you cut down a tree plant another in its place... All great things to help our environment... Now that is hip!

:thumbup:

riotgrl

Have you watched the documentary "Ethos"? I just streamed it on Netflix last night and it kind of said the same things. The message was consume less. If we could all do that in our own way then wouldn't that help? And wouldn't that make it more personal for each of us? Shop local business, only buy local food (when feasible of course). You choose how to help in the way that you can help instead of waiting for the government to do it or big business to do it. We know that they are in bed together and they have the same objective which is NOT helping us or helping the environment - WE have to do it.

brianlux

riotgrl wrote:

Have you watched the documentary "Ethos"? I just streamed it on Netflix last night and it kind of said the same things. The message was consume less. If we could all do that in our own way then wouldn't that help? And wouldn't that make it more personal for each of us? Shop local business, only buy local food (when feasible of course). You choose how to help in the way that you can help instead of waiting for the government to do it or big business to do it. We know that they are in bed together and they have the same objective which is NOT helping us or helping the environment - WE have to do it.

Thanks! I'll check it out. :thumbup: