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MLB 2024 Season

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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,839
    edited April 2023
    Wobbie said:
    If there's any place left in this country where owners can get the welfare financed by the public for an obscene, new venue it's Vegas.
    it will probably be another increase in the room tax that subsidizes the billionaire owner. no matter how much they jack up prices, certain people still love going to Vegas. as a former, 30 year resident of Vegas, I don’t get the allure. that said, the Indian casinos and fanduel-type sports betting are not the same.
    It is. 40% of it is based on the room tax. Edit: sorry, 40% of the Raiders stadium, that is, so figure something close to that. 
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,839
    I mean there's a resort/destination feel to Vegas imo, plus the actual corporations that have consolidated those online & satellite sportsbooks are located there. Outside of that, gambling at your local casino in Podunkville Town, USA is kinda pathetic & sad - and another conversation altogether.

    The land/casino owners there have a huge advantage over everything else so they basically get whatever they want.
    Vegas is special when it comes to table games and slots w the atmosphere.  I have been to other places across the states and have gotten that itch scratched though.  After being to Atlantic City a few times now though I will say that it is an actual dump.  What a cesspool.

    That being said, Vegas still should have lost some power.
    Part of the reason AC is a "cesspool" is because of the casinos.
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,696
    I mean there's a resort/destination feel to Vegas imo, plus the actual corporations that have consolidated those online & satellite sportsbooks are located there. Outside of that, gambling at your local casino in Podunkville Town, USA is kinda pathetic & sad - and another conversation altogether.

    The land/casino owners there have a huge advantage over everything else so they basically get whatever they want.
    Vegas is special when it comes to table games and slots w the atmosphere.  I have been to other places across the states and have gotten that itch scratched though.  After being to Atlantic City a few times now though I will say that it is an actual dump.  What a cesspool.

    That being said, Vegas still should have lost some power.
    Part of the reason AC is a "cesspool" is because of the casinos.
    Interesting that Vegas never really had that problem?
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    Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,677
    I have never not had a blast in AC
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,160
    Vegas was awesome 15-20 years ago.
    Now it is just way too expensive, crowded, and near impossible to navigate around. 
    We slept in the parking lot of the MGM in our car for the 2003 show. Now its like $30 just to park there for the evening. 
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    PoncierPoncier Posts: 16,448
    mace1229 said:
    Vegas was awesome 15-20 years ago.
    Now it is just way too expensive, crowded, and near impossible to navigate around. 
    We slept in the parking lot of the MGM in our car for the 2003 show. Now its like $30 just to park there for the evening. 
    Cheaper than a room still. 
    This weekend we rock Portland
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,696
    I have never not had a blast in AC
    I've had fun in AC too but it's still a cesspool.  I can do the same shit closer.

    mace1229 said:
    Vegas was awesome 15-20 years ago.
    Now it is just way too expensive, crowded, and near impossible to navigate around. 
    We slept in the parking lot of the MGM in our car for the 2003 show. Now its like $30 just to park there for the evening. 
    I find that the rooms in both AC and Vegas have gone up a bunch.  They used to be cheap and the money was made on the games.  Not so much anymore.

    Borgata is like $400 a night.  Just for a stupid room.
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,839
    edited April 2023
    I mean there's a resort/destination feel to Vegas imo, plus the actual corporations that have consolidated those online & satellite sportsbooks are located there. Outside of that, gambling at your local casino in Podunkville Town, USA is kinda pathetic & sad - and another conversation altogether.

    The land/casino owners there have a huge advantage over everything else so they basically get whatever they want.
    Vegas is special when it comes to table games and slots w the atmosphere.  I have been to other places across the states and have gotten that itch scratched though.  After being to Atlantic City a few times now though I will say that it is an actual dump.  What a cesspool.

    That being said, Vegas still should have lost some power.
    Part of the reason AC is a "cesspool" is because of the casinos.
    Interesting that Vegas never really had that problem?
    Not interesting really, the entire town was literally built around the industry. If you look at any other town that was established before a casino showed up and plopping a casino down immediately drops the surrounding town into poverty. There's a study I need to find that quantified that x amount of slot machines installed results in x amount of unemployment.

    Gambling is literally the worst addiction there is, not to be redundant with "literally" nor turn this into a different conversation which I was trying to avoid. 
    Post edited by Jearlpam0925 on
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    HesCalledDyerHesCalledDyer Maryland Posts: 16,426
    My understanding is that the city of Oakland & MLB themselves are as much to blame as John Fisher for the A's departure. From what I've read, A's ownership has been trying every outlet to reach a deal with city of Oakland. The waterfront project was announced, what? 6-7 years ago? According to Fisher, they were still looking at another 8-10 years before they'd have a new stadium.  MLB basically forced the A's hand to explore other outlets - namely Las Vegas - and instructed them to do so by spring 2024.

    I'm not stating any of this as undeniable truths. Just by the few bits I read yesterday, these are the main arguments I recall.
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,696
    I mean there's a resort/destination feel to Vegas imo, plus the actual corporations that have consolidated those online & satellite sportsbooks are located there. Outside of that, gambling at your local casino in Podunkville Town, USA is kinda pathetic & sad - and another conversation altogether.

    The land/casino owners there have a huge advantage over everything else so they basically get whatever they want.
    Vegas is special when it comes to table games and slots w the atmosphere.  I have been to other places across the states and have gotten that itch scratched though.  After being to Atlantic City a few times now though I will say that it is an actual dump.  What a cesspool.

    That being said, Vegas still should have lost some power.
    Part of the reason AC is a "cesspool" is because of the casinos.
    Interesting that Vegas never really had that problem?
    Not interesting really, the entire town was literally built around the industry. If you look at any other town that was established before a casino showed up and plopping a casino down immediately drops the surrounding town into poverty. There's a study I need to find that quantified that x amount of slot machines installed results in x amount of unemployment.

    Gambling is literally the worst addiction there is, not to be redundant with "literally" nor turn this into a different conversation which I was trying to avoid. 
    That little tidbit is interesting.  I had seen casinos built in the middle of nowhere in other states and towns grew up around them.
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    JeBurkhardtJeBurkhardt Posts: 4,618
    edited April 2023
    My understanding is that the city of Oakland & MLB themselves are as much to blame as John Fisher for the A's departure. From what I've read, A's ownership has been trying every outlet to reach a deal with city of Oakland. The waterfront project was announced, what? 6-7 years ago? According to Fisher, they were still looking at another 8-10 years before they'd have a new stadium.  MLB basically forced the A's hand to explore other outlets - namely Las Vegas - and instructed them to do so by spring 2024.

    I'm not stating any of this as undeniable truths. Just by the few bits I read yesterday, these are the main arguments I recall.
    There is plenty of blame to go around. John Fisher, Lew Wolff, the previous owner, the City of Oakland, MLB, take your pick. One example is the A's had an agreement to move to San Jose, but the Giants were given territorial rights for San Jose when they were trying to get a new stadium and threatening to leave for Florida. At the time, San Jose was considered as a home for the new Giants stadium. They eventually built the new ballpark in San Francisco, but refused to relinquish the rights to San Jose. When the A's found a site in San Jose, the Giants and MLB Commissioner Bud Selig kept it from happening. It was a mess. There were also attempts to locate ballparks in Fremont and on a college campus in Oakland, but fell through as well. I don't like that they are moving, but at this point there doesn't seem to be any real options. The Coliseum is a dump that hasn't been maintained properly and needs to be torn down. Add that to the desire of MLB to have a team in Las Vegas and here we are. The whole thing sucks. 
    Post edited by JeBurkhardt on
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    WobbieWobbie Posts: 29,739
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    If I had known then what I know now...

    Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
    VIC 07
    EV LA1 08
    Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
    Columbus 10
    EV LA 11
    Vancouver 11
    Missoula 12
    Portland 13, Spokane 13
    St. Paul 14, Denver 14
    Philly I & II, 16
    Denver 22
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    igotid88igotid88 Posts: 27,607
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    I miss igotid88
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    WobbieWobbie Posts: 29,739
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    If I had known then what I know now...

    Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
    VIC 07
    EV LA1 08
    Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
    Columbus 10
    EV LA 11
    Vancouver 11
    Missoula 12
    Portland 13, Spokane 13
    St. Paul 14, Denver 14
    Philly I & II, 16
    Denver 22
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    igotid88igotid88 Posts: 27,607
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    Probably. Is he a HOF? 3 WS. That usually puts people over 
    I miss igotid88
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    WobbieWobbie Posts: 29,739
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    Probably. Is he a HOF? 3 WS. That usually puts people over 
    Not an HOF’er. Posey is a more likely candidate for me, but his career may be viewed as too short.
    If I had known then what I know now...

    Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
    VIC 07
    EV LA1 08
    Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
    Columbus 10
    EV LA 11
    Vancouver 11
    Missoula 12
    Portland 13, Spokane 13
    St. Paul 14, Denver 14
    Philly I & II, 16
    Denver 22
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    igotid88igotid88 Posts: 27,607
    edited April 2023
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    Probably. Is he a HOF? 3 WS. That usually puts people over 
    Not an HOF’er. Posey is a more likely candidate for me, but his career may be viewed as too short.
    Again for Posey, 3 World Series rings helps plus a ROY and MVP. Especially if they're not going to vote in the surefire HOFs. It might be easier for him to get in
    I miss igotid88
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    WobbieWobbie Posts: 29,739
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    Probably. Is he a HOF? 3 WS. That usually puts people over 
    Not an HOF’er. Posey is a more likely candidate for me, but his career may be viewed as too short.
    Again for Posey, 3 World Series rings helps plus a ROY and MVP. Especially if they're not going to vote in the surefire HOFs. It might be easier for him to get in
    and a batting title and comeback player of the year.
    If I had known then what I know now...

    Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
    VIC 07
    EV LA1 08
    Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
    Columbus 10
    EV LA 11
    Vancouver 11
    Missoula 12
    Portland 13, Spokane 13
    St. Paul 14, Denver 14
    Philly I & II, 16
    Denver 22
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    igotid88igotid88 Posts: 27,607
    edited April 2023
    The Rays are taking advantage of their easy schedule. I could see them being 25-4 by the end of next week. Maybe 23-6
    Post edited by igotid88 on
    I miss igotid88
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,696
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    Probably. Is he a HOF? 3 WS. That usually puts people over 
    Not an HOF’er. Posey is a more likely candidate for me, but his career may be viewed as too short.
    Again for Posey, 3 World Series rings helps plus a ROY and MVP. Especially if they're not going to vote in the surefire HOFs. It might be easier for him to get in
    Posey is in.  Great catcher, great player in a tough position.
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    igotid88igotid88 Posts: 27,607
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    Probably. Is he a HOF? 3 WS. That usually puts people over 
    Not an HOF’er. Posey is a more likely candidate for me, but his career may be viewed as too short.
    Again for Posey, 3 World Series rings helps plus a ROY and MVP. Especially if they're not going to vote in the surefire HOFs. It might be easier for him to get in
    Posey is in.  Great catcher, great player in a tough position.
    If he doesn't have the 3 World Series he doesn't get in though. 
    I miss igotid88
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,839
    Never really given those teams much thought, but just broadly thinking about it - for a team that won 3 titles in 5 seasons is there anyone on there that are no-dount hall of famers? I guess Posey, maybe, sorta? Outside of that, they're probably the most bizarre "dynasty" I can think of. Each roster seems completely unrelated to the other two that won. 
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,696
    igotid88 said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    igotid88 said:
    Wobbie said:
    madison bumgarner....what a precipitous fall. :tired_face:
    I keep thinking of the playoff game when most pitcners would be taken out. But Bochy overextended him. It worked out. But maybe hurt him in the long run. 
    Oh, hell no. Bum was a horse. Juan Marichal wasn’t hurt by throwing 227 pitches over 16 innings. Nolan Ryan wasn’t hurt by throwing 235.
    Probably. Is he a HOF? 3 WS. That usually puts people over 
    Not an HOF’er. Posey is a more likely candidate for me, but his career may be viewed as too short.
    Again for Posey, 3 World Series rings helps plus a ROY and MVP. Especially if they're not going to vote in the surefire HOFs. It might be easier for him to get in
    Posey is in.  Great catcher, great player in a tough position.
    If he doesn't have the 3 World Series he doesn't get in though. 
    I agree with that.  He would be borderline.
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,696
    Never really given those teams much thought, but just broadly thinking about it - for a team that won 3 titles in 5 seasons is there anyone on there that are no-dount hall of famers? I guess Posey, maybe, sorta? Outside of that, they're probably the most bizarre "dynasty" I can think of. Each roster seems completely unrelated to the other two that won. 
    Other notables were Lincecum, Madbaum, Zito, Nady and Pablo Sandoval?  Fan favorite Hunter Pence too but nobody that is a sure fire HOFer.
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    markymark550markymark550 Columbia, SC Posts: 5,117
    I don't think any of them should get in. To me, we're getting back into the Hall of Very Good territory.
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    igotid88igotid88 Posts: 27,607
    edited April 2023
    I don't think any of them should get in. To me, we're getting back into the Hall of Very Good territory.
    Me neither. Especially if my guy can't get in even with better numbers
    I miss igotid88
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    igotid88igotid88 Posts: 27,607
    Never really given those teams much thought, but just broadly thinking about it - for a team that won 3 titles in 5 seasons is there anyone on there that are no-dount hall of famers? I guess Posey, maybe, sorta? Outside of that, they're probably the most bizarre "dynasty" I can think of. Each roster seems completely unrelated to the other two that won. 
    Other notables were Lincecum, Madbaum, Zito, Nady and Pablo Sandoval?  Fan favorite Hunter Pence too but nobody that is a sure fire HOFer.
    They had good players that peaked at the right time.
    I miss igotid88
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,839
    Like I said - very bizarre, sustained "dynasty". They rode on the back of some elite pitching, cobbled together an OK lineup, and then rolled the dice once getting into the playoffs. Not that I wouldn't take 3 titles in 5 seasons like that though, twist my arm...
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    WobbieWobbie Posts: 29,739
    Never really given those teams much thought, but just broadly thinking about it - for a team that won 3 titles in 5 seasons is there anyone on there that are no-dount hall of famers? I guess Posey, maybe, sorta? Outside of that, they're probably the most bizarre "dynasty" I can think of. Each roster seems completely unrelated to the other two that won. 
    Other notables were Lincecum, Madbaum, Zito, Nady and Pablo Sandoval?  Fan favorite Hunter Pence too but nobody that is a sure fire HOFer.
    nady?

    you know I love my giants but Posey is the only possible HOFer…different guys stepped up in each of the title years….3 different closers…journeymen like cody ross, marco scutaro, aubrey (asshat) huff, hunter pence, michael morse, andres torres, freddy sanchez, etc. came up big….GW pitchers changed from year to year (cain, lincecum, madbum, voglesong)….jeremy affeldt was huge….crawford, panda, belt and posey were together for most of it.

    it flies in the face of the superteam mentality.
    If I had known then what I know now...

    Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
    VIC 07
    EV LA1 08
    Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
    Columbus 10
    EV LA 11
    Vancouver 11
    Missoula 12
    Portland 13, Spokane 13
    St. Paul 14, Denver 14
    Philly I & II, 16
    Denver 22
  • Options
    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,696
    Wobbie said:
    Never really given those teams much thought, but just broadly thinking about it - for a team that won 3 titles in 5 seasons is there anyone on there that are no-dount hall of famers? I guess Posey, maybe, sorta? Outside of that, they're probably the most bizarre "dynasty" I can think of. Each roster seems completely unrelated to the other two that won. 
    Other notables were Lincecum, Madbaum, Zito, Nady and Pablo Sandoval?  Fan favorite Hunter Pence too but nobody that is a sure fire HOFer.
    nady?

    you know I love my giants but Posey is the only possible HOFer…different guys stepped up in each of the title years….3 different closers…journeymen like cody ross, marco scutaro, aubrey (asshat) huff, hunter pence, michael morse, andres torres, freddy sanchez, etc. came up big….GW pitchers changed from year to year (cain, lincecum, madbum, voglesong)….jeremy affeldt was huge….crawford, panda, belt and posey were together for most of it.

    it flies in the face of the superteam mentality.
    Xavier Nady was a highly touted Draft Pick that was good enough to be in the league for a while like Pence , but never great.
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