you know what, decides2dream, the champ and mookey, can shut the hell up!
You all posted on my original thread how PEARL JAM WOULD NEVER lower themselves to promote their music via tv promotions. You said it, I didnt. Then when you are proven wrong, and the band blatantly promotes, you slam me, for gloating. You dont like my thread. Leave it. I dont give a damn about it.
Evidently, I have to have a PHD in business to be taken seriously by you 3 idiots. Where are your freakin credentials?
Just because you think you know me based on some posts on a board, and let me assure you, you do not, doesnt mean I cant have knowledge on issues.
I actually never read or posted in that thread and carry no opinion over it so feel free not to put words in my mouth or at least fact check your posts.
I've explained my credentials to you in previous posts, but to summarize I'm 6 months shy of a BS in business (acctg and info sys), with 2 years of music industry experience and moving on towards earning my CPA license. You can look up the rest again if you feel.
I assume when you post that you are expressing yourself and sharing with the board a reflection of who you are. Also, you are displaying your (lack of) knowledge with your thoughts. You definitely have the right to share and express your ideas with whatever experience or knowledge you have, but we also have the right to have a rebuttal on the subject.
Once again another one of your threads has become derailed, not because of your thoughts and ideas, but because of your ego, narrow mind, and false sense of entitlement.
To the person who posted about the non influence of Rolling Stone and Spin, you are wrong sir. In the late 60's through the 80's, maybe even to 1994 or so, Rolling Stone was a major force in shaping the music industry and what was considered cool. The reviews of records by bands, has far reaching effects.
Well, when you claim I said something I didn't say, it's easy to make me look wrong. But please don't put words in my mouth. I did not say that those magazines are "non-influential." I said that it was your claim that "the majority of folks" used to learn about new music from these magazines was untrue. Indeed, your claim is demonstrably false. It isn't true now, and it wasn't true from the late '60s through the '80s. The U.S. population was, at its smallest, 150 million during this time period. The magazines' circulation was, at its largest, less than 3 million during this time period. It's not a majority; it's a tiny minority. Even allowing for influence beyond those folks who actually read the magazines, it is preposterous to suggest that it reached anything close to "the majority of folks."
And, by the way, the real lie to this theory will be put next week, when there is no appreciable increase in the album's sales after last night's exposure.
The sales of this album are almost exactly in line with the last two studio albums. The small decrease is a function of two things: 1) fewer people buying albums generally; and 2) the limited distribution created by allowing to be the only major bricks-and-mortar retailer to carry the album. It's that simple. The only thing that would extend this album's reach beyond the core fan base that need no encouragement to buy it-- short of playing the Super Bowl halftime show or performing at the Grammys-- is a major crossover radio hit. With that, the album could sell over a million copies. With a big hit, maybe 2 million copies. Otherwise, it will sell 500,000 copies or so, as expected.
The most significant thing the band could do to boost sales, if that's something they want, would be to relentlessly work "Just Breathe" to CHR/Top 40 radio.
Congratulations for rehashing what the band has already previously done (remember the Cold Case episode which featured nothing but PJ songs, and it coincided with the Ten remastered release... hmmmmmm weird).
But go ahead and pat yourself on the back... and get over yourself.
They were old songs (for the most part) that people have been hearing since 1991. That's different from promoting brand new songs on a brand new album.
Thanks EPOTTSIII!
"Vinyl or not, you will need to pay someone to take RA of your hands" - Smile05
424, xxx
This is my first post in these threads... (disclaimer to protect the innocent)
But I think PJ has done everything they could possibly do to promote this band in a healthy way, without ever diminishing their beliefs or overstepping their boundaries. (Even stepping back in the early nineties was a positive promotional tool, because it earned them respect, and worked the supply/demand model to a tee for us hard core fans.)
You would never hear 'Alive' on a viagra commercial, as was requested of them, but Yellow Ledbetter closed the very last episode of Friends, so they pick and choose to their likes and dislikes.
I'm not gonna get into all the things they have been doing for promotion, but my favorite is their recent willingness to play festivals.... Headlining them all.
So yeah, I think Pj is doing just about everything in their power that can be done within reach of their morals. (the target deal was within reach, although some may disagree.) For those who wonder why they don't sell millions of records the reasons are already obvious and stated above. So if you asked me, "with all the changes in the music business how does one sell a million records nowadays?"
1) Become really popular with the teenage youth, like Lil Wayne who recently sold over a million albums the first week, surpassing NSync's record I'm guessing. (and Vs. of course)
2) Write a jaw dropping, earth shattering album that can't be denied. ie. exile in main st., sgt. peppers, etc. OK Computer shot Radiohead into the stratosphere and that album is far from a pop album, it's experimental if anything.
3) Sign a deal with Target. Didn't Stone say Target bought a million records off them right off the bat?
Still, it's hard to sell a million records without MTV being what it was....
agreed.
also keep in mind, such things are not done at the last minute..so i am sure the band, and it's management, thought of this all by themselves. imagine that.
and, actually, as to this:
"People who promote records in record stores need to get over themselves, and need to come into the 21st century, where new ways of promotion are used."
um, no they don't. believe it or not, they can choose MULTIPLE ways to promote themselves, as they see fit. given they've been at it close to 20 years, i think they may have some inkling how to go about it, and in the ways THEY want. unbelievably, how they may choose to market their own work, may not 100% align with anyone else's views of how they 'should' do it...b/c i am sure they have their own personal baramoter of how they want to manage their own work/careers.
but go ahead and tell pj how they 'should' do it..i am sure all their staff are taking notes!
*cue the friends finale with yellow ledbetter playing in the background*
and the ONE and ONLY post i made in that other thread:
The fatal flaw in this line of thinking is in equating Pearl Jam in the Backspacer era with The Shins pre Garden State. It's an absolutely ridiculous comparison and simply doesn't hold up. Pearl Jam has been as exposed as they ever will be and aren't some underground darling waiting to be discovered. They are an aging act that the general public sees as irrelevant (not saying I agree, just saying that's the way it is). Someone at Grey's Anatomy licensing "Just Breathe" risks their show being seen as out of touch and irrelevant as well, whereas if they license a Mars Volta song or something by Phoenix they appear to have their finger on the pulse.
Don't kid yourself, Pearl Jam is smart enough to understand their place in the current climate. That's exactly why the Target deal is so smart when taken hand in hand with their complete ownership of the product. That is the kind of deal bands dream of. Getting their music heard on ESPN and Fox during baseball was another great move, as was mentioned before.
Regarding singles - you're behind the curve on this one as well. With the advent of satellite radio and digital downloads, singles are meaningless as well. I don't have satellite but when I was listening to it in the car last month I heard "The Fixer", "Got Some", "Amongst The Waves" and "Just Breathe" across a few channels. Why release one single when you can make the whole album available and let the music advertise itself - especially in this day and age.
When you question the actual packaging of the record you misunderstand the basic concept of making the physical product they are selling valuable. If they were to abandon the art and the liner notes what is to persuade anyone to buy the album at all? Think of the fact that they produce vinyl albums and ask yourself if this is a band that sees value in the physical possession of records. You're right - it's not the cutting edge, but there is no reason to go to the extremes that you are suggesting, especially for a band that ties the art of the album in with the experience of the music the way that Pearl Jam always has. They clearly don't care if the tastemakers get it or not, and at the end of the day it isn't going to hurt their bottom line. In fact, it gives people another reason to purchase what they are selling rather than stealing it digitally.
Finally, when discussing licensing of songs, I will agree with you that marrying music to an image (whether it's through a film, television show or even an ad) is a great marketing tool when the right piece of music is used to market the right film/television show/project. There have to be benefits to both parties. We have no idea if anyone is interested in using PJ's music at this point and if so, whether the band considers that use of their song in their best interest or in the best interest of the band.
Overall, I'm not sure there is a better example of an artist balancing their art with the commerce that their art generates for them. It's gotta be a very difficult line to walk and from my perspective, Pearl Jam does it expertly.
wow, excellent post. :thumbup:
what the OP seems to miss is simply, pj is 20 years in their career, a career started with a crazy BANG, and they've gotten what they want from that. they are EXACTLY where they want to be - and the target deal is exactly what they desired at this point in their career. end of story.
one million cds units - guaranteed - with a share of $5 a pop. damn genius. and they STILL got to sell to indie stores, on their own website, itunes, etc...i don't see how anyone could question the brilliance of that. again, pearl jam are exactly where they want to be. just b/c someone may think it's not where they should be, or how they personally think it 'should be done'.....doesn't make a shit of difference..
bizarre how i see NONE of what i am being accused of stating. weird.
however, always nice to feel special!
oh and hello...you think pearl jam or the mods or anyone in the 10c reads EVERY thread?
idk ANYone who reads EVERY thread on the board.
why the fuck would anyone do that?
This is for the original poster, but this was floating around the board back in January and February so I think PJ knows what they need to do to promote themselves:
I just got home so I don't feel like going through the whole thread to see if this was posted, but the whole promoting themselves with tv is not a new idea.
I mean there's a small, loyal contingent of Scrubs fans on here who always start a thread whenever the episode with "Long Road" airs is on.
Congratulations for rehashing what the band has already previously done (remember the Cold Case episode which featured nothing but PJ songs, and it coincided with the Ten remastered release... hmmmmmm weird).
But go ahead and pat yourself on the back... and get over yourself.
They were old songs (for the most part) that people have been hearing since 1991. That's different from promoting brand new songs on a brand new album.
No, no real difference at all, promotion is promotion whether they are new songs or old ones, the methods in which they are promoted are the same. They were still trying to sell the remastered album much like they try to sell new albums. And the reason why songs from Ten were used in that specific episode is because it dealt with the timeframe in which Ten was released.
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Admin
Social awareness does not equal political activism!
5/23/2011- An utter embarrassment... ticketing failures too many to list.
So if you asked me, "with all the changes in the music business how does one sell a million records nowadays?"
1) Become really popular with the teenage youth, like Lil Wayne who recently sold over a million albums the first week, surpassing NSync's record I'm guessing. (and Vs. of course)
Actually, he didn't even come close to 'N Sync's record, which was 2.3 million in first-week sales of "No Strings Attached."
2) Write a jaw dropping, earth shattering album that can't be denied. ie. exile in main st., sgt. peppers, etc. OK Computer shot Radiohead into the stratosphere and that album is far from a pop album, it's experimental if anything.
Not so much, and not good examples. The Stones and Beatles were already huge superstars when those albums came out. Significant sales were a given. Radiohead had two platinum albums before "OK Computer" (the greatest album of all-time, IMHO) and, although it went double-platinum, "OK Computer" was no sales juggernaut. It has sold less than two million copies in 12 years. It has never been among the 20 biggest-selling albums in the U.S. in any week since its release.
Jaw-dropping, earth-shattering albums rarely have the mainstream appeal it takes to rack up big sales. The average music consumer is not all that interested in being challenged. There are exceptions, but even the exceptions tend to be, when you get down to it, pop albums (e.g., "Nevermind").
3) Sign a deal with Target. Didn't Stone say Target bought a million records off them right off the bat?
Still, it's hard to sell a million records without MTV being what it was....
Those aren't retail sales to consumers. More than 700,000 of the copies Target bought are sitting on store or warehouse shelves.
The primary ticket to big-time sales remains pop radio. There is nothing else that drives sales like having a hit on mainstream top 40 radio.
Now I am not deluded enough to think the band decided to do this because they read my thread on this board, but I do feel satisfaction and redemption after reading that the band is now promoting the album via tv shows.
I created a thread about a week ago, where I suggested the band promoted Backspacer in ways that worked in 1991, but were useless and stupid in 2009. Some posters came to my defense and agreed with me, but quite a few suggested, that I had no buisness telling PJ what to do, and that I am not a commercial or buisness consultant so I should shut my mouth. People talked about how PJ would never promote their music via tv shows.
We obviously someone was right, and it aint those people who were calling me out!
The fundamentals of the situation are: we live in a world where no one buys records. Illegal downloading happens and it cant be stopped. We live in a world where MTV and VH1 no longer show videos, and a world where Rolling Stone, and Spin, no longer are ways in which the majority of folks find out about new bands and music news. We live in a world where radio is no longer a reliable way to promote music.
So what do you do?
Well you tap into the means in which people DO hear and find out about new music. And thats the new media, Pitchfork, Stereogum, YouTube viral videos and of course, tv shows which often times feature new and breaking bands, unheard bands during the most emotional and pivitol scenes. Flash Forward a few weeks back featured the Nick Drake gem Place to Be.
Lets hope that Flash Forward features a great song, and that new fans find out about the band via this promotional ad.
To promote an album in this day and age: you promote via tv and soundtracks and all that.
no, no, no...last week kelly curtis was bored so he came on here and saw a genius at work and immediately implemented the op's ideas (never mind the fact the show was produced weeks ago and this type of arrangement is usually done weeks before the show airs)...i'm surprised kelly hasn't been on the phone to hire this marketing genius!!
:wave:
I have no patience for bad music and stupid people...
The whole world will be different soon the whole world will be RELIEVED
This is for the original poster, but this was floating around the board back in January and February so I think PJ knows what they need to do to promote themselves:
I just got home so I don't feel like going through the whole thread to see if this was posted, but the whole promoting themselves with tv is not a new idea.
I mean there's a small, loyal contingent of Scrubs fans on here who always start a thread whenever the episode with "Long Road" airs is on.
Cool find..
'I want to hurry home to you
put on a slow, dumb show for you
and crack you up
so you can put a blue ribbon on my brain
god I'm very, very frightening
and I'll overdo it'
Comments
"I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
I actually never read or posted in that thread and carry no opinion over it so feel free not to put words in my mouth or at least fact check your posts.
I've explained my credentials to you in previous posts, but to summarize I'm 6 months shy of a BS in business (acctg and info sys), with 2 years of music industry experience and moving on towards earning my CPA license. You can look up the rest again if you feel.
I assume when you post that you are expressing yourself and sharing with the board a reflection of who you are. Also, you are displaying your (lack of) knowledge with your thoughts. You definitely have the right to share and express your ideas with whatever experience or knowledge you have, but we also have the right to have a rebuttal on the subject.
Once again another one of your threads has become derailed, not because of your thoughts and ideas, but because of your ego, narrow mind, and false sense of entitlement.
Where I'm not ugly and you're lookin' at me
Well, when you claim I said something I didn't say, it's easy to make me look wrong. But please don't put words in my mouth. I did not say that those magazines are "non-influential." I said that it was your claim that "the majority of folks" used to learn about new music from these magazines was untrue. Indeed, your claim is demonstrably false. It isn't true now, and it wasn't true from the late '60s through the '80s. The U.S. population was, at its smallest, 150 million during this time period. The magazines' circulation was, at its largest, less than 3 million during this time period. It's not a majority; it's a tiny minority. Even allowing for influence beyond those folks who actually read the magazines, it is preposterous to suggest that it reached anything close to "the majority of folks."
How is this groundbreaking? :?
The sales of this album are almost exactly in line with the last two studio albums. The small decrease is a function of two things: 1) fewer people buying albums generally; and 2) the limited distribution created by allowing to be the only major bricks-and-mortar retailer to carry the album. It's that simple. The only thing that would extend this album's reach beyond the core fan base that need no encouragement to buy it-- short of playing the Super Bowl halftime show or performing at the Grammys-- is a major crossover radio hit. With that, the album could sell over a million copies. With a big hit, maybe 2 million copies. Otherwise, it will sell 500,000 copies or so, as expected.
The most significant thing the band could do to boost sales, if that's something they want, would be to relentlessly work "Just Breathe" to CHR/Top 40 radio.
"Vinyl or not, you will need to pay someone to take RA of your hands" - Smile05
424, xxx
But I think PJ has done everything they could possibly do to promote this band in a healthy way, without ever diminishing their beliefs or overstepping their boundaries. (Even stepping back in the early nineties was a positive promotional tool, because it earned them respect, and worked the supply/demand model to a tee for us hard core fans.)
You would never hear 'Alive' on a viagra commercial, as was requested of them, but Yellow Ledbetter closed the very last episode of Friends, so they pick and choose to their likes and dislikes.
I'm not gonna get into all the things they have been doing for promotion, but my favorite is their recent willingness to play festivals.... Headlining them all.
So yeah, I think Pj is doing just about everything in their power that can be done within reach of their morals. (the target deal was within reach, although some may disagree.) For those who wonder why they don't sell millions of records the reasons are already obvious and stated above. So if you asked me, "with all the changes in the music business how does one sell a million records nowadays?"
1) Become really popular with the teenage youth, like Lil Wayne who recently sold over a million albums the first week, surpassing NSync's record I'm guessing. (and Vs. of course)
2) Write a jaw dropping, earth shattering album that can't be denied. ie. exile in main st., sgt. peppers, etc. OK Computer shot Radiohead into the stratosphere and that album is far from a pop album, it's experimental if anything.
3) Sign a deal with Target. Didn't Stone say Target bought a million records off them right off the bat?
Still, it's hard to sell a million records without MTV being what it was....
here's my first and ONLY post (excepting this one right now) that i have made in THIS thread:
and the ONE and ONLY post i made in that other thread:
bizarre how i see NONE of what i am being accused of stating. weird.
however, always nice to feel special!
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
idk ANYone who reads EVERY thread on the board.
why the fuck would anyone do that?
:thumbup:
have a great weekend all!
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/4756/pjinfozd7.jpg
I just got home so I don't feel like going through the whole thread to see if this was posted, but the whole promoting themselves with tv is not a new idea.
I mean there's a small, loyal contingent of Scrubs fans on here who always start a thread whenever the episode with "Long Road" airs is on.
- 8/28/98
- 9/2/00
- 4/28/03, 5/3/03, 7/3/03, 7/5/03, 7/6/03, 7/9/03, 7/11/03, 7/12/03, 7/14/03
- 9/28/04, 9/29/04, 10/1/04, 10/2/04
- 9/11/05, 9/12/05, 9/13/05, 9/30/05, 10/1/05, 10/3/05
- 5/12/06, 5/13/06, 5/27/06, 5/28/06, 5/30/06, 6/1/06, 6/3/06, 6/23/06, 7/22/06, 7/23/06, 12/2/06, 12/9/06
- 8/2/07, 8/5/07
- 6/19/08, 6/20/08, 6/22/08, 6/24/08, 6/25/08, 6/27/08, 6/28/08, 6/30/08, 7/1/08
- 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 9/21/09, 9/22/09, 10/27/09, 10/28/09, 10/30/09, 10/31/09
- 5/15/10, 5/17/10, 5/18/10, 5/20/10, 5/21/10, 10/23/10, 10/24/10
- 9/11/11, 9/12/11
- 10/18/13, 10/21/13, 10/22/13, 11/30/13, 12/4/13
No, no real difference at all, promotion is promotion whether they are new songs or old ones, the methods in which they are promoted are the same. They were still trying to sell the remastered album much like they try to sell new albums. And the reason why songs from Ten were used in that specific episode is because it dealt with the timeframe in which Ten was released.
Admin
Social awareness does not equal political activism!
5/23/2011- An utter embarrassment... ticketing failures too many to list.
Actually, he didn't even come close to 'N Sync's record, which was 2.3 million in first-week sales of "No Strings Attached."
Not so much, and not good examples. The Stones and Beatles were already huge superstars when those albums came out. Significant sales were a given. Radiohead had two platinum albums before "OK Computer" (the greatest album of all-time, IMHO) and, although it went double-platinum, "OK Computer" was no sales juggernaut. It has sold less than two million copies in 12 years. It has never been among the 20 biggest-selling albums in the U.S. in any week since its release.
Jaw-dropping, earth-shattering albums rarely have the mainstream appeal it takes to rack up big sales. The average music consumer is not all that interested in being challenged. There are exceptions, but even the exceptions tend to be, when you get down to it, pop albums (e.g., "Nevermind").
Those aren't retail sales to consumers. More than 700,000 of the copies Target bought are sitting on store or warehouse shelves.
The primary ticket to big-time sales remains pop radio. There is nothing else that drives sales like having a hit on mainstream top 40 radio.
you state the obvious
The whole world will be different soon the whole world will be RELIEVED
#resistgezi #resistturkey #resisttaksim #direnturkiye #direngezi
#standingman #duranadam
Cool find..
put on a slow, dumb show for you
and crack you up
so you can put a blue ribbon on my brain
god I'm very, very frightening
and I'll overdo it'
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=91525 :wtf: