SCALPERS! ALREADY! How can this happen!

HughFreakingDillon

Saltzy23 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Saltzy23 said:

I really just don't get the anger. They are a commodity being sold in large part by people that don't share the same passion for the actual event as many of those that want to go do. They are just like stocks, except ones that grant access to events and have a definitive expiration date.

If anything, organized, legalized 100% guaranteed secondary marketplaces have helped eliminate people buying fakes and getting really, REALLY screwed out of money.

I don't do it for PJ shows, but I'll admit right now that I have absolutely made money playing the StubHub market for many events over the years. It's easy, and it's gotten me into a ton of events for free.

kudos to you for admitting it, but at the same time........BRUTAL.

Why? Why is selling tickets at market rate a scarlet letter I should run from?

I would say that 75% of my sales are for New York Mets tickets, which I have season tickets for. I have 4 tickets, for 81 games. That's 324 tickets I need to use or sell in a 6 month span.

Not only does the team promote selling your extra's via StubHub, my Mets online account actually links directly to it for Christs sakes.

Last season because the team never thought in a million years they would go as far as they did allowed season ticket holders to load up on playoff tickets. I would up having my seats, plus 4 more full strips, plus a bunch of individual tickets for single games. I sold a bunch for face to friends and to my Mets online community, and made a freaking killing selling the rest which afforded me the ability to enjoy the whole run and make money the further they went. I'm not sure why I need to hide or feel ashamed about any of that. A buyer paid the price they wanted to pay for a commodity for something I \wanted to sell. What exactly am I ashamed of doing here?

by selling those tickets for the "market price", you are eliminating a large group of people that could otherwise afford to go to it. the winnipeg jets organization, for example, actually take away your season tickets if they catch you selling for more than face. you are allowed to sell, but only through their ticket exchange program. as a season ticket holder, let's say per game you are paying $80, but if you were to buy that ticket as a single, it would be $120. they allow you to take that price, since that is the price the person would be paying at a walk up anyway. I think there might be a small admin fee that goes to the Jets, but it's nominal.

when the jets first arrived, people were trying to sell their tickets for astronomical amounts to make back the money they had to spend on their season tickets. many got their seaons taken away from them.

I don't care if the Mets tell you it's ok. I personally don't think it is. you are profitting off of it. plain and simple.

Cheo Ramirez

Saltzy23 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Saltzy23 said:

I really just don't get the anger. They are a commodity being sold in large part by people that don't share the same passion for the actual event as many of those that want to go do. They are just like stocks, except ones that grant access to events and have a definitive expiration date.

If anything, organized, legalized 100% guaranteed secondary marketplaces have helped eliminate people buying fakes and getting really, REALLY screwed out of money.

I don't do it for PJ shows, but I'll admit right now that I have absolutely made money playing the StubHub market for many events over the years. It's easy, and it's gotten me into a ton of events for free.

kudos to you for admitting it, but at the same time........BRUTAL.

Why? Why is selling tickets at market rate a scarlet letter I should run from?

I would say that 75% of my sales are for New York Mets tickets, which I have season tickets for. I have 4 tickets, for 81 games. That's 324 tickets I need to use or sell in a 6 month span.

Not only does the team promote selling your extra's via StubHub, my Mets online account actually links directly to it for Christs sakes.

Last season because the team never thought in a million years they would go as far as they did allowed season ticket holders to load up on playoff tickets. I would up having my seats, plus 4 more full strips, plus a bunch of individual tickets for single games. I sold a bunch for face to friends and to my Mets online community, and made a freaking killing selling the rest which afforded me the ability to enjoy the whole run and make money the further they went. I'm not sure why I need to hide or feel ashamed about any of that. A buyer paid the price they wanted to pay for a commodity for something I \wanted to sell. What exactly am I ashamed of doing here?

bootlegger10

nmtheo said:

Thank you (Captain Obvious)!

It is 2016 and someone posted that scalpers are selling tickets before they go on sale to the public like it was shocking. How does this happen????

ldent42

FYI paperless entry is illegal in ny for some reason.
I hate Stub hub. Yes it's better than the guys standing outside selling potentially fake tickets, but it's still a scam in it's own right. They charge both the buyer and seller on every transaction.

schapp

my2hands said:

Paperless entry tickets that can't be transfered

End of problem

Paperless tickets are illegal in New York. One has to love lobbying.

http://www.dos.ny.gov/licensing/lawbooks/TicketReseller.pdf [25.30 (c)]

Saltzy23

HughFreakingDillon said:

Saltzy23 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Saltzy23 said:

I really just don't get the anger. They are a commodity being sold in large part by people that don't share the same passion for the actual event as many of those that want to go do. They are just like stocks, except ones that grant access to events and have a definitive expiration date.

If anything, organized, legalized 100% guaranteed secondary marketplaces have helped eliminate people buying fakes and getting really, REALLY screwed out of money.

I don't do it for PJ shows, but I'll admit right now that I have absolutely made money playing the StubHub market for many events over the years. It's easy, and it's gotten me into a ton of events for free.

kudos to you for admitting it, but at the same time........BRUTAL.

Why? Why is selling tickets at market rate a scarlet letter I should run from?

I would say that 75% of my sales are for New York Mets tickets, which I have season tickets for. I have 4 tickets, for 81 games. That's 324 tickets I need to use or sell in a 6 month span.

Not only does the team promote selling your extra's via StubHub, my Mets online account actually links directly to it for Christs sakes.

Last season because the team never thought in a million years they would go as far as they did allowed season ticket holders to load up on playoff tickets. I would up having my seats, plus 4 more full strips, plus a bunch of individual tickets for single games. I sold a bunch for face to friends and to my Mets online community, and made a freaking killing selling the rest which afforded me the ability to enjoy the whole run and make money the further they went. I'm not sure why I need to hide or feel ashamed about any of that. A buyer paid the price they wanted to pay for a commodity for something I \wanted to sell. What exactly am I ashamed of doing here?

by selling those tickets for the "market price", you are eliminating a large group of people that could otherwise afford to go to it. the winnipeg jets organization, for example, actually take away your season tickets if they catch you selling for more than face. you are allowed to sell, but only through their ticket exchange program. as a season ticket holder, let's say per game you are paying $80, but if you were to buy that ticket as a single, it would be $120. they allow you to take that price, since that is the price the person would be paying at a walk up anyway. I think there might be a small admin fee that goes to the Jets, but it's nominal.

when the jets first arrived, people were trying to sell their tickets for astronomical amounts to make back the money they had to spend on their season tickets. many got their seaons taken away from them.

I don't care if the Mets tell you it's ok. I personally don't think it is. you are profitting off of it. plain and simple.

I lay out like $5k a year for hundreds of tickets I have no clue are gonna be worthless if the team sucks. It's a huge risk buying season tickets. Selling the games you can for over face is how you recoup a lot of the expense. Everyone only looks at it through the eyes of the person who can't get in to the big game for the price they want to pay. No one ever looks at it through the eyes of the guy that bought Wednesday night games 4 months in advance they have no idea if they can go to or will matter at all. Allowing those people to be able to sell the high demand tickets at a premium is how they can mitigate the risk. Again, I have no idea idea why I need to apologize for that.

jdopj

The biggest problem is not Stub Hub, it's the distribution of the tickets initially.
When tickets get pulled right away and sent to the secondary market that's an issue. When there is an uneven playing field acquiring tickets, that not right either. However if you are a season ticket holder and you have an opportunity to recoup some expenses or personal seat licenses than go for it. If it's a bad season, or bad concert season, you will eat those tickets.

Bentleyspop

I don't have a strong opinion on this topic.
But I don't understand the anger either. We live in a free market economy. If the demand is there why shouldn't someone sell something, anything, at fair market value?

If you own a house and the market dictates that you can sell it for a million dollars even if you only paid 100, 000 would you sell it for what you paid? Conversely if it's 2008 and you can only get 50,000 maybe you sell at a loss.

Yes I know it's not fair to fans but last I checked event tickets aren't on the list of Maslows Hierarchy of Needs.

Empty Glass

Selling tickets on secondary market - bad

Selling a PJ vinyl for $200 on Lost Dogs - fair price, great guy

schapp

Saltzy23 said:

I really just don't get the anger. They are a commodity being sold in large part by people that don't share the same passion for the actual event as many of those that want to go do. They are just like stocks, except ones that grant access to events and have a definitive expiration date.

If anything, organized, legalized 100% guaranteed secondary marketplaces have helped eliminate people buying fakes and getting really, REALLY screwed out of money.

I don't do it for PJ shows, but I'll admit right now that I have absolutely made money playing the StubHub market for many events over the years. It's easy, and it's gotten me into a ton of events for free.

We don't like scalping because music events/sports, etc, have an emotion attached to it, thus we consider it unfair. Scalping is illegal in many countries, and even in the proximity of venues in the US.

However, I agree that it is a commodity and well, long live capitalism. My problem is not with having a secondary market, but about the unfairness of corporations cornering the market and the way tickets seem to get from the ticket seller to the resellers (bots, under the water deals, etc). That is what I think should be regulated and better prosecuted.

Saltzy23

schapp said:

Saltzy23 said:

I really just don't get the anger. They are a commodity being sold in large part by people that don't share the same passion for the actual event as many of those that want to go do. They are just like stocks, except ones that grant access to events and have a definitive expiration date.

If anything, organized, legalized 100% guaranteed secondary marketplaces have helped eliminate people buying fakes and getting really, REALLY screwed out of money.

I don't do it for PJ shows, but I'll admit right now that I have absolutely made money playing the StubHub market for many events over the years. It's easy, and it's gotten me into a ton of events for free.

We don't like scalping because music events/sports, etc, have an emotion attached to it, thus we consider it unfair. Scalping is illegal in many countries, and even in the proximity of venues in the US.

However, I agree that it is a commodity and well, long live capitalism. My problem is not with having a secondary market, but about the unfairness of corporations cornering the market and the way tickets seem to get from the ticket seller to the resellers (bots, under the water deals, etc). That is what I think should be regulated and better prosecuted.

Great post. 100% agree.

RP112579

Empty Glass said:

Selling tickets on secondary market - bad

Selling a PJ vinyl for $200 on Lost Dogs - fair price, great guy

This.

Vedd Hedd

I believe that only the 10C cares about 10C tickets. I dont think they care if you bought tickets off ticketmaster, and genuinely cant go, and sell those for whatever.

But yeah, reaffirming, reselling of 10C tickets over face is bad. reselling of 10C at ALL is bad. Selling your extra, because you had to buy 2 instead of 1 is ok, as long as its face.

Vedd Hedd

jdopj said:

The biggest problem is not Stub Hub, it's the distribution of the tickets initially.
When tickets get pulled right away and sent to the secondary market that's an issue. When there is an uneven playing field acquiring tickets, that not right either. However if you are a season ticket holder and you have an opportunity to recoup some expenses or personal seat licenses than go for it. If it's a bad season, or bad concert season, you will eat those tickets.

this

HughFreakingDillon

RP112579 said:

Empty Glass said:

Selling tickets on secondary market - bad

Selling a PJ vinyl for $200 on Lost Dogs - fair price, great guy

This.

nope. completely different. one has an expiration date. one does not. one can be purchased on another medium for the exact same experience for a fraction of the price. another cannot.

apples to oranges.

HughFreakingDillon

Saltzy23 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Saltzy23 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Saltzy23 said:

I really just don't get the anger. They are a commodity being sold in large part by people that don't share the same passion for the actual event as many of those that want to go do. They are just like stocks, except ones that grant access to events and have a definitive expiration date.

If anything, organized, legalized 100% guaranteed secondary marketplaces have helped eliminate people buying fakes and getting really, REALLY screwed out of money.

I don't do it for PJ shows, but I'll admit right now that I have absolutely made money playing the StubHub market for many events over the years. It's easy, and it's gotten me into a ton of events for free.

kudos to you for admitting it, but at the same time........BRUTAL.

Why? Why is selling tickets at market rate a scarlet letter I should run from?

I would say that 75% of my sales are for New York Mets tickets, which I have season tickets for. I have 4 tickets, for 81 games. That's 324 tickets I need to use or sell in a 6 month span.

Not only does the team promote selling your extra's via StubHub, my Mets online account actually links directly to it for Christs sakes.

Last season because the team never thought in a million years they would go as far as they did allowed season ticket holders to load up on playoff tickets. I would up having my seats, plus 4 more full strips, plus a bunch of individual tickets for single games. I sold a bunch for face to friends and to my Mets online community, and made a freaking killing selling the rest which afforded me the ability to enjoy the whole run and make money the further they went. I'm not sure why I need to hide or feel ashamed about any of that. A buyer paid the price they wanted to pay for a commodity for something I \wanted to sell. What exactly am I ashamed of doing here?

by selling those tickets for the "market price", you are eliminating a large group of people that could otherwise afford to go to it. the winnipeg jets organization, for example, actually take away your season tickets if they catch you selling for more than face. you are allowed to sell, but only through their ticket exchange program. as a season ticket holder, let's say per game you are paying $80, but if you were to buy that ticket as a single, it would be $120. they allow you to take that price, since that is the price the person would be paying at a walk up anyway. I think there might be a small admin fee that goes to the Jets, but it's nominal.

when the jets first arrived, people were trying to sell their tickets for astronomical amounts to make back the money they had to spend on their season tickets. many got their seaons taken away from them.

I don't care if the Mets tell you it's ok. I personally don't think it is. you are profitting off of it. plain and simple.

I lay out like $5k a year for hundreds of tickets I have no clue are gonna be worthless if the team sucks. It's a huge risk buying season tickets. Selling the games you can for over face is how you recoup a lot of the expense. Everyone only looks at it through the eyes of the person who can't get in to the big game for the price they want to pay. No one ever looks at it through the eyes of the guy that bought Wednesday night games 4 months in advance they have no idea if they can go to or will matter at all. Allowing those people to be able to sell the high demand tickets at a premium is how they can mitigate the risk. Again, I have no idea idea why I need to apologize for that.

the risk should be assumed by you, solely, as the initial purchaser. I don't personally think it's moral to just be able to buy a bunch of tickets you may not be able to afford because you can get rid of them later on for a massive mark-up. that's the very definition of scalping. I have personally never sold tickets to anything (concert, sporting event) for anything other than the price I paid. And no, I don't have much money at all. I could easily use the money I make off those tickets to go to another show I might otherwise not be able to afford. But I won't do it. I don't think it's right.

The last time Death From Above 1979 came to my city, my daughter went into the hospital, so I couldn't go. The show sold out in about 3 seconds. I sold them to a stranger the day of the show on kijiji for the price I paid. the guy couldn't believe it. It was like he won the lottery, as the few being sold were marked up significantly. why should I profit off his initial inability to get a ticket?

hrd2imgn

There was just a report on one of the network news stations (cannot recall for the life of me, but it was literally yesterday) The scam was those bots that literally buy 1000 tickets in a second and they are pretty much all gone in a minute, all gobbled up by brokers with bots/algorithms etc. Then they are resold at an astronomical markup and the tickets released to the public were never really ever available due to the evil computers. I believe the worthless politicians are getting involved, so that means nothing will happen.

They were bringing up The boss's shows as an example of how some dude was able to buy 1000 at a time.

So get ready to open your wallets and pay up the ass for tickets since ten club seems to have so few available these days (I am sure they have no real say in how many they get).
.

HesCalledDyer

Empty Glass said:

Selling tickets on secondary market - bad

Selling a PJ vinyl for $200 on Lost Dogs - fair price, great guy

Lol that's a good way to look at it!

Free

Looking back 20 years ago, music was for everyone and everyone could afford to go. Only the elite and those with bottomless wallets can afford to go when they lose with the 10c lottery and face the only option of buying off secondary markets when TM sells out in 5 minutes.

I'll take the way things were ANY DAY compared to the bullshit of now.

goldenegg

P-Town-P-Jam-Fan said:

The same way people speculatively sell stocks

That's not what's happening.

These are specific seats available for purchase, throughout the entire venue. StubHub gets tickets in advance and sells them at ridiculous prices. This happens for every show.