Your opinion about Immigration.

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Comments

  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,602
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    DPrival78 said:
    battan1120 wrote:
    Illegal immigrants will soon be known as undocumented democrats
    that's really funny rush. i seem to remember in 2000 and 2004 the latino community was heavily in favor of bush...
    Maybe someone mentioned it already, but I’m lazy..  There’s a new Harvard poll out saying Trump’s approval amongst Hispanics is up 10 points. 

    Take that with a grain of salt, like any other poll, but I don’t think it’s crazy to say that those who played by the rules may not be so thrilled with those who don’t. 
    Completely. Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration, as they competed with legal workers and lowered their pay as a result. But he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some too.
    " Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration"  This is true.

    "he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some"  This I've never heard.

    But would Cesar Chavez have supported Trump.  Would he have agreed with separating children from their parents? 

    I said that middle part because I lived in LA and San Diego for most of my life. I saw many demonstrations and marches down the freeway, school-wide walkouts over immigration.
    Almost all of them I would see people holding banners with his name or chanting “Chavez” as they marched down.
    Maybe it wasn’t a national thing, but down in LA and San Diegothey definitely threw his name around all the time from what I saw and experienced.
    I remember being in school myself and as a college student, observing high school classrooms at the time or a substitute teacher when these marches first became a thing, and word would spread that people are marching and students would just get up and run out of campus yelling “Caesar Chavez!!”
    But to answer your wueatuon, I doubt he would support Trump in separating the children. Most republicans didn’t support that either.
    Sure took them a long time to voice their displeasure. 
    I remember many republican politicians voicing their dislike of the policy. Although I'm sure there were some, I can't think of anyone who said they liked what was going on.
    Some news reports on Fox tried to downplay it, but most people don't count what they say anyway, so why start now?
    Polls taken before the EO showed that Republicans voters supported the policy by a clip of 58%, while overall it had a 2/3 negative rating.  

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/18/politics/immigration-trump-approval/index.html



  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    edited June 2018
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    DPrival78 said:
    battan1120 wrote:
    Illegal immigrants will soon be known as undocumented democrats
    that's really funny rush. i seem to remember in 2000 and 2004 the latino community was heavily in favor of bush...
    Maybe someone mentioned it already, but I’m lazy..  There’s a new Harvard poll out saying Trump’s approval amongst Hispanics is up 10 points. 

    Take that with a grain of salt, like any other poll, but I don’t think it’s crazy to say that those who played by the rules may not be so thrilled with those who don’t. 
    Completely. Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration, as they competed with legal workers and lowered their pay as a result. But he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some too.
    " Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration"  This is true.

    "he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some"  This I've never heard.

    But would Cesar Chavez have supported Trump.  Would he have agreed with separating children from their parents? 

    I said that middle part because I lived in LA and San Diego for most of my life. I saw many demonstrations and marches down the freeway, school-wide walkouts over immigration.
    Almost all of them I would see people holding banners with his name or chanting “Chavez” as they marched down.
    Maybe it wasn’t a national thing, but down in LA and San Diegothey definitely threw his name around all the time from what I saw and experienced.
    I remember being in school myself and as a college student, observing high school classrooms at the time or a substitute teacher when these marches first became a thing, and word would spread that people are marching and students would just get up and run out of campus yelling “Caesar Chavez!!”
    But to answer your wueatuon, I doubt he would support Trump in separating the children. Most republicans didn’t support that either.
    Yeah, I doubt he would have either. 

    I think part of the reason Chavez was against illegal entry of migrant workers was because they were brought in by big agribusiness as cheap labor.  Chavez protested the corporate agribusiness who brought these workers in.  Those were the real criminals, not the workers.

    Here again is a point that continues to be overlooked:  A lot of these "illegals" are brought in as cheap labor.   And yet who do we villainize? The corporate farmers who bring them in, or the poor people from south of the border who are taking the opportunity to improve their lives?  This point get passed over again and again. 
    Post edited by brianlux on
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,473
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    DPrival78 said:
    battan1120 wrote:
    Illegal immigrants will soon be known as undocumented democrats
    that's really funny rush. i seem to remember in 2000 and 2004 the latino community was heavily in favor of bush...
    Maybe someone mentioned it already, but I’m lazy..  There’s a new Harvard poll out saying Trump’s approval amongst Hispanics is up 10 points. 

    Take that with a grain of salt, like any other poll, but I don’t think it’s crazy to say that those who played by the rules may not be so thrilled with those who don’t. 
    Completely. Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration, as they competed with legal workers and lowered their pay as a result. But he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some too.
    " Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration"  This is true.

    "he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some"  This I've never heard.

    But would Cesar Chavez have supported Trump.  Would he have agreed with separating children from their parents? 

    I said that middle part because I lived in LA and San Diego for most of my life. I saw many demonstrations and marches down the freeway, school-wide walkouts over immigration.
    Almost all of them I would see people holding banners with his name or chanting “Chavez” as they marched down.
    Maybe it wasn’t a national thing, but down in LA and San Diegothey definitely threw his name around all the time from what I saw and experienced.
    I remember being in school myself and as a college student, observing high school classrooms at the time or a substitute teacher when these marches first became a thing, and word would spread that people are marching and students would just get up and run out of campus yelling “Caesar Chavez!!”
    But to answer your wueatuon, I doubt he would support Trump in separating the children. Most republicans didn’t support that either.
    Yeah, I doubt he would have either. 

    I think part of the reason Chavez was against illegal entry of migrant workers was because they were brought in by big agribusiness as cheap labor.  Here again is a point that continues to be overlooked.  A lot of these "illegals" are brought in as cheap labor.   And yet who do we villainize? The corporate farmers who bring them in, or the poor people from south of the border who are taking the opportunity to improve their lives?  This point get passed over again and again. 
    Yes it does. To the point where people even ignore that the POTUS used such labour himself with no qualms.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    PJ_Soul said:
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    DPrival78 said:
    battan1120 wrote:
    Illegal immigrants will soon be known as undocumented democrats
    that's really funny rush. i seem to remember in 2000 and 2004 the latino community was heavily in favor of bush...
    Maybe someone mentioned it already, but I’m lazy..  There’s a new Harvard poll out saying Trump’s approval amongst Hispanics is up 10 points. 

    Take that with a grain of salt, like any other poll, but I don’t think it’s crazy to say that those who played by the rules may not be so thrilled with those who don’t. 
    Completely. Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration, as they competed with legal workers and lowered their pay as a result. But he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some too.
    " Caesar Chavez was actually against illegal immigration"  This is true.

    "he’s somehow become the symbol for illegal immigration for some"  This I've never heard.

    But would Cesar Chavez have supported Trump.  Would he have agreed with separating children from their parents? 

    I said that middle part because I lived in LA and San Diego for most of my life. I saw many demonstrations and marches down the freeway, school-wide walkouts over immigration.
    Almost all of them I would see people holding banners with his name or chanting “Chavez” as they marched down.
    Maybe it wasn’t a national thing, but down in LA and San Diegothey definitely threw his name around all the time from what I saw and experienced.
    I remember being in school myself and as a college student, observing high school classrooms at the time or a substitute teacher when these marches first became a thing, and word would spread that people are marching and students would just get up and run out of campus yelling “Caesar Chavez!!”
    But to answer your wueatuon, I doubt he would support Trump in separating the children. Most republicans didn’t support that either.
    Yeah, I doubt he would have either. 

    I think part of the reason Chavez was against illegal entry of migrant workers was because they were brought in by big agribusiness as cheap labor.  Here again is a point that continues to be overlooked.  A lot of these "illegals" are brought in as cheap labor.   And yet who do we villainize? The corporate farmers who bring them in, or the poor people from south of the border who are taking the opportunity to improve their lives?  This point get passed over again and again. 
    Yes it does. To the point where people even ignore that the POTUS used such labour himself with no qualms.
    Yes, thank you! 

    It is so frustrating that these points get ignored and instead the finger is pointed at the poor people trying to survive.  In my opinion, this is blatant racism. 
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • DPrival78DPrival78 CT Posts: 2,259
    Republican politicians want the cheap labor. Democrat politicians want the votes.  Very few of these people have actual souls. 
    i'm more a fan of popular bands.. like the bee-gees, pearl jam
  • LongestRoadLongestRoad Posts: 477
    unsung said:
    I mean because an illegal killed her.
    "An illegal"

    Illegal is not a fucking noun.  A human being cannot be "an illegal."  
    Please tell me you're not defending a murderer.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,808
    unsung said:
    I mean because an illegal killed her.
    "An illegal"

    Illegal is not a fucking noun.  A human being cannot be "an illegal."  
    Please tell me you're not defending a murderer.
    he's attacking the term, not the person it refers to. come on. 
    Darwinspeed, all. 

    Cheers,

    HFD




  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    unsung said:
    I mean because an illegal killed her.
    "An illegal"

    Illegal is not a fucking noun.  A human being cannot be "an illegal."  
    Please tell me you're not defending a murderer.
    he's attacking the term, not the person it refers to. come on. 
    I don't know, he might be.  You know that Dyer- he's a me-e-e-e-an motherfucker! :wink:
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,808
    brianlux said:
    unsung said:
    I mean because an illegal killed her.
    "An illegal"

    Illegal is not a fucking noun.  A human being cannot be "an illegal."  
    Please tell me you're not defending a murderer.
    he's attacking the term, not the person it refers to. come on. 
    I don't know, he might be.  You know that Dyer- he's a me-e-e-e-an motherfucker! :wink:
    DYER'S GETTIN' UPSET
    Darwinspeed, all. 

    Cheers,

    HFD




  • LongestRoadLongestRoad Posts: 477
    brianlux said:
    the response above is twisting my words

    No, it isn't. Your words weren't even used, let alone twisted. H2TM was responding to your comment concerning perceived criminality among immigrants. 
    You are also twisting my words. Are you saying there are only criminal American citizens?? There has never been a criminal from south of the border come into this country? Stop trying to focus on twisting my words to sound like I think the majority of immigrants coming into this country are criminals. But  you can bet your ass I don't want any of the drug dealing rapist gang members coming into this country no matter how small a percentage there is of them. Not one of those scumbags should be able to sneak in. Not only for the people that are already here but also for the immigrants that those low lifes try to prey on. Are the liberals able to comprehend that without twisting my words? I have a hunch not. lol

    Why do you focus so much on the outliers?  You do know that every group has it's criminal element, right?  But, that really has little to do with the topic of immigration here anyway and yet you keep focusing on it.  Are your letting fear talk?  And your wording... "criminals from the south", "drug dealing rapist gang members", "scumbags".  You really set yourself up for coming across as having some serious prejudices.  You never talk about the vast majority of these people who are simply trying to flee from a terrible situation.  You express no empathy for the down-trodden.  You only talk about the outliers, those few nefarious souls (and yes there are some) but almost nothing about the vast many who are victims of injustice.  Your viewpoint is extremely narrow.  And I'm not going to claim that is because you are a "conservative" the way you categorize several of us as "liberals".  No, I suspect your viewpoint is narrow because you are fearful.  Good God, are these supposedly bad people beating down your door, raping your female family members, roaming your streets like packs of wolves and selling drugs behind your house?  Jeez, I hope not!
    I've been defending immigrants. If you can't see the problems that are causing immigrants to flee their countries, there is a real problem. They're not risking their lives and freedom for no reason other than to hang in America.  Don't brush the atrocities being commited down south and in our border towns under the carpet so we can have an open border. I'm sure the people fleeing those countries don't want that garbage following them here either. One of your posts talked about legalized drugs to combat the corruption, that would be the biggest mistake ever. Let's take a look at the "legalized" pain management clinics that popped up all over the country when Bush was in office. Now we have the mega pill popping epidemic. Let's stick to just legalizing marijuana, at least that's something that can help some people, you never hear of someone overdosing on weed and maybe if all the leaders of the world passed around the peace pipe before starting their talks more may be accomplished towards peace. lol. And no I don't smoke.  
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,473
    brianlux said:
    the response above is twisting my words

    No, it isn't. Your words weren't even used, let alone twisted. H2TM was responding to your comment concerning perceived criminality among immigrants. 
    You are also twisting my words. Are you saying there are only criminal American citizens?? There has never been a criminal from south of the border come into this country? Stop trying to focus on twisting my words to sound like I think the majority of immigrants coming into this country are criminals. But  you can bet your ass I don't want any of the drug dealing rapist gang members coming into this country no matter how small a percentage there is of them. Not one of those scumbags should be able to sneak in. Not only for the people that are already here but also for the immigrants that those low lifes try to prey on. Are the liberals able to comprehend that without twisting my words? I have a hunch not. lol

    Why do you focus so much on the outliers?  You do know that every group has it's criminal element, right?  But, that really has little to do with the topic of immigration here anyway and yet you keep focusing on it.  Are your letting fear talk?  And your wording... "criminals from the south", "drug dealing rapist gang members", "scumbags".  You really set yourself up for coming across as having some serious prejudices.  You never talk about the vast majority of these people who are simply trying to flee from a terrible situation.  You express no empathy for the down-trodden.  You only talk about the outliers, those few nefarious souls (and yes there are some) but almost nothing about the vast many who are victims of injustice.  Your viewpoint is extremely narrow.  And I'm not going to claim that is because you are a "conservative" the way you categorize several of us as "liberals".  No, I suspect your viewpoint is narrow because you are fearful.  Good God, are these supposedly bad people beating down your door, raping your female family members, roaming your streets like packs of wolves and selling drugs behind your house?  Jeez, I hope not!
    I've been defending immigrants. If you can't see the problems that are causing immigrants to flee their countries, there is a real problem. They're not risking their lives and freedom for no reason other than to hang in America.  Don't brush the atrocities being commited down south and in our border towns under the carpet so we can have an open border. I'm sure the people fleeing those countries don't want that garbage following them here either. One of your posts talked about legalized drugs to combat the corruption, that would be the biggest mistake ever. Let's take a look at the "legalized" pain management clinics that popped up all over the country when Bush was in office. Now we have the mega pill popping epidemic. Let's stick to just legalizing marijuana, at least that's something that can help some people, you never hear of someone overdosing on weed and maybe if all the leaders of the world passed around the peace pipe before starting their talks more may be accomplished towards peace. lol. And no I don't smoke.  
    Who the heck said anything about an open border?

    I suggest you do a little research on Portugal's decriminalization of all drugs, so you actually know how such an idea can really work well.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    brianlux said:
    the response above is twisting my words

    No, it isn't. Your words weren't even used, let alone twisted. H2TM was responding to your comment concerning perceived criminality among immigrants. 
    You are also twisting my words. Are you saying there are only criminal American citizens?? There has never been a criminal from south of the border come into this country? Stop trying to focus on twisting my words to sound like I think the majority of immigrants coming into this country are criminals. But  you can bet your ass I don't want any of the drug dealing rapist gang members coming into this country no matter how small a percentage there is of them. Not one of those scumbags should be able to sneak in. Not only for the people that are already here but also for the immigrants that those low lifes try to prey on. Are the liberals able to comprehend that without twisting my words? I have a hunch not. lol

    Why do you focus so much on the outliers?  You do know that every group has it's criminal element, right?  But, that really has little to do with the topic of immigration here anyway and yet you keep focusing on it.  Are your letting fear talk?  And your wording... "criminals from the south", "drug dealing rapist gang members", "scumbags".  You really set yourself up for coming across as having some serious prejudices.  You never talk about the vast majority of these people who are simply trying to flee from a terrible situation.  You express no empathy for the down-trodden.  You only talk about the outliers, those few nefarious souls (and yes there are some) but almost nothing about the vast many who are victims of injustice.  Your viewpoint is extremely narrow.  And I'm not going to claim that is because you are a "conservative" the way you categorize several of us as "liberals".  No, I suspect your viewpoint is narrow because you are fearful.  Good God, are these supposedly bad people beating down your door, raping your female family members, roaming your streets like packs of wolves and selling drugs behind your house?  Jeez, I hope not!
    I've been defending immigrants. If you can't see the problems that are causing immigrants to flee their countries, there is a real problem. They're not risking their lives and freedom for no reason other than to hang in America.  Don't brush the atrocities being commited down south and in our border towns under the carpet so we can have an open border. I'm sure the people fleeing those countries don't want that garbage following them here either. One of your posts talked about legalized drugs to combat the corruption, that would be the biggest mistake ever. Let's take a look at the "legalized" pain management clinics that popped up all over the country when Bush was in office. Now we have the mega pill popping epidemic. Let's stick to just legalizing marijuana, at least that's something that can help some people, you never hear of someone overdosing on weed and maybe if all the leaders of the world passed around the peace pipe before starting their talks more may be accomplished towards peace. lol. And no I don't smoke.  
    Whoa, first of all I'm really surprised you say I "can't see the problems that are causing immigrants to flee their countries" when I've mentioned that several times. And when have I "brushed aside the atrocities committed down south and in our border towns under thee carpet"?  I have not done that.  Those statements left me scratching my head. 

    As for legalizing ALL drugs, I have held that opinion for decades.  It's not a popular opinion, it is never going to happen, but I belief it would be a very good idea.  Users are going to use, legal or not.  Plus, making drugs illegal increases crime.  Is this not a fact?  I think so.  Plus, our prisons have huge numbers of people in them that committed no crime other that shooting up some junk or smoking something or snorting something up their nose.  Instead of spending more money on prisons, I think it would make more sense to set up more rehab centers, and improve education and reduce poverty so that people would be less likely to turn to drugs.  If we spent more energy on improving the environment and promoting healthy choices, fewer people would turn to drugs. These are all reasons I stand by my belief that ALL drugs should be made legal or at the very least, decriminalized. 

    As for weed, yeah, seeing Trump and Jong-un would be rather entertaining.  But the thing is, pot makes some people gooffy or even stupid so don't expect too much!
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 36,481
    brianlux said:
    the response above is twisting my words

    No, it isn't. Your words weren't even used, let alone twisted. H2TM was responding to your comment concerning perceived criminality among immigrants. 
    You are also twisting my words. Are you saying there are only criminal American citizens?? There has never been a criminal from south of the border come into this country? Stop trying to focus on twisting my words to sound like I think the majority of immigrants coming into this country are criminals. But  you can bet your ass I don't want any of the drug dealing rapist gang members coming into this country no matter how small a percentage there is of them. Not one of those scumbags should be able to sneak in. Not only for the people that are already here but also for the immigrants that those low lifes try to prey on. Are the liberals able to comprehend that without twisting my words? I have a hunch not. lol

    Why do you focus so much on the outliers?  You do know that every group has it's criminal element, right?  But, that really has little to do with the topic of immigration here anyway and yet you keep focusing on it.  Are your letting fear talk?  And your wording... "criminals from the south", "drug dealing rapist gang members", "scumbags".  You really set yourself up for coming across as having some serious prejudices.  You never talk about the vast majority of these people who are simply trying to flee from a terrible situation.  You express no empathy for the down-trodden.  You only talk about the outliers, those few nefarious souls (and yes there are some) but almost nothing about the vast many who are victims of injustice.  Your viewpoint is extremely narrow.  And I'm not going to claim that is because you are a "conservative" the way you categorize several of us as "liberals".  No, I suspect your viewpoint is narrow because you are fearful.  Good God, are these supposedly bad people beating down your door, raping your female family members, roaming your streets like packs of wolves and selling drugs behind your house?  Jeez, I hope not!
    I've been defending immigrants. If you can't see the problems that are causing immigrants to flee their countries, there is a real problem. They're not risking their lives and freedom for no reason other than to hang in America.  Don't brush the atrocities being commited down south and in our border towns under the carpet so we can have an open border. I'm sure the people fleeing those countries don't want that garbage following them here either. One of your posts talked about legalized drugs to combat the corruption, that would be the biggest mistake ever. Let's take a look at the "legalized" pain management clinics that popped up all over the country when Bush was in office. Now we have the mega pill popping epidemic. Let's stick to just legalizing marijuana, at least that's something that can help some people, you never hear of someone overdosing on weed and maybe if all the leaders of the world passed around the peace pipe before starting their talks more may be accomplished towards peace. lol. And no I don't smoke.  
    You lost me at, “open border.”
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  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    "Don't brush the atrocities being commited down south and in our border towns under the carpet so we can have an open border."

    I think it must be the carpet longest is talking about.  You know, like with fringe edges:


    or tears:




    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • DPrival78DPrival78 CT Posts: 2,259
    edited June 2018
    No democrat wants open borders, let’s not get crazy. 




    i'm more a fan of popular bands.. like the bee-gees, pearl jam
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    DPrival78 said:
    No democrat wants open borders, let’s not get crazy. 




    I believe in borders because they are there but I don't understand them.  They are both artificial and illogical. 
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    edited June 2018
    Humans are silly... one species... on one rock all by ourselves... in a massive universe... drawing imaginary lines... calling those that cross the made up lines, illegal

    Lol
  • Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    Only animals (other than humans) generally understand bio-regions. You won't find North American Coyotes fighting for resources with Serengeti Plains Gazelles.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • brianlux said:
    Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    Only animals (other than humans) generally understand bio-regions. You won't find North American Coyotes fighting for resources with Serengeti Plains Gazelles.

    Correct.

    But we're talking intrahuman conflict.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 8,956
    brianlux said:
    Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    Only animals (other than humans) generally understand bio-regions. You won't find North American Coyotes fighting for resources with Serengeti Plains Gazelles.
    That only because they are in different continents. Polar bears and Penquins have never had any conflicts either.
    You dont think if the Gazelles suddenly appeared in North America there wouldn’t be conflict with coyotes, or some other animal living in the region?
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    We are a little more advanced than penguins & gazelles
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    Only animals (other than humans) generally understand bio-regions. You won't find North American Coyotes fighting for resources with Serengeti Plains Gazelles.
    That only because they are in different continents. Polar bears and Penquins have never had any conflicts either.
    You dont think if the Gazelles suddenly appeared in North America there wouldn’t be conflict with coyotes, or some other animal living in the region?
    Good point.  My analogy sucks.
    my2hands said:
    We are a little more advanced than penguins & gazelles
    Well, we have the ability to reason which means we have the ability to solve problems, work together and get along.  But instead we chose to fight instead of make peace and work together.  Not saying you mean this, but whenever I hear people excuse our warring ways by saying, "It's just our animal nature" I reply, "So we evolved to the point of being able to reason and do what makes sense for what?  For no damn good reason?"  Either nature fucked up, or (if there is one) God fucked up, or people are fucking up.  You can guess which one I think it is!

    I choose peace.  No more war.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    Only animals (other than humans) generally understand bio-regions. You won't find North American Coyotes fighting for resources with Serengeti Plains Gazelles.
    That only because they are in different continents. Polar bears and Penquins have never had any conflicts either.
    You dont think if the Gazelles suddenly appeared in North America there wouldn’t be conflict with coyotes, or some other animal living in the region?
    Good point.  My analogy sucks.
    my2hands said:
    We are a little more advanced than penguins & gazelles
    Well, we have the ability to reason which means we have the ability to solve problems, work together and get along.  But instead we chose to fight instead of make peace and work together.  Not saying you mean this, but whenever I hear people excuse our warring ways by saying, "It's just our animal nature" I reply, "So we evolved to the point of being able to reason and do what makes sense for what?  For no damn good reason?"  Either nature fucked up, or (if there is one) God fucked up, or people are fucking up.  You can guess which one I think it is!

    I choose peace.  No more war.
    https://youtu.be/fj-10lIrboM
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,592
    my2hands said:
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    Only animals (other than humans) generally understand bio-regions. You won't find North American Coyotes fighting for resources with Serengeti Plains Gazelles.
    That only because they are in different continents. Polar bears and Penquins have never had any conflicts either.
    You dont think if the Gazelles suddenly appeared in North America there wouldn’t be conflict with coyotes, or some other animal living in the region?
    Good point.  My analogy sucks.
    my2hands said:
    We are a little more advanced than penguins & gazelles
    Well, we have the ability to reason which means we have the ability to solve problems, work together and get along.  But instead we chose to fight instead of make peace and work together.  Not saying you mean this, but whenever I hear people excuse our warring ways by saying, "It's just our animal nature" I reply, "So we evolved to the point of being able to reason and do what makes sense for what?  For no damn good reason?"  Either nature fucked up, or (if there is one) God fucked up, or people are fucking up.  You can guess which one I think it is!

    I choose peace.  No more war.
    https://youtu.be/fj-10lIrboM
    That about says it all.  Thank you!
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • my2hands said:
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Basically territorial like any other animal on the planet- coveting resources and guarding against rivals competing for resources.

    Watch the docu-movie Chimpanzee and note the similarities between our species.
    Only animals (other than humans) generally understand bio-regions. You won't find North American Coyotes fighting for resources with Serengeti Plains Gazelles.
    That only because they are in different continents. Polar bears and Penquins have never had any conflicts either.
    You dont think if the Gazelles suddenly appeared in North America there wouldn’t be conflict with coyotes, or some other animal living in the region?
    Good point.  My analogy sucks.
    my2hands said:
    We are a little more advanced than penguins & gazelles
    Well, we have the ability to reason which means we have the ability to solve problems, work together and get along.  But instead we chose to fight instead of make peace and work together.  Not saying you mean this, but whenever I hear people excuse our warring ways by saying, "It's just our animal nature" I reply, "So we evolved to the point of being able to reason and do what makes sense for what?  For no damn good reason?"  Either nature fucked up, or (if there is one) God fucked up, or people are fucking up.  You can guess which one I think it is!

    I choose peace.  No more war.
    https://youtu.be/fj-10lIrboM

    I've never seen that before.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • HesCalledDyerHesCalledDyer Maryland Posts: 16,416
    unsung said:
    I mean because an illegal killed her.
    "An illegal"

    Illegal is not a fucking noun.  A human being cannot be "an illegal."  
    Please tell me you're not defending a murderer.
    he's attacking the term, not the person it refers to. come on. 
    Thanks, Hugh. 
  • LongestRoadLongestRoad Posts: 477
    brianlux said:
    brianlux said:
    the response above is twisting my words

    No, it isn't. Your words weren't even used, let alone twisted. H2TM was responding to your comment concerning perceived criminality among immigrants. 
    You are also twisting my words. Are you saying there are only criminal American citizens?? There has never been a criminal from south of the border come into this country? Stop trying to focus on twisting my words to sound like I think the majority of immigrants coming into this country are criminals. But  you can bet your ass I don't want any of the drug dealing rapist gang members coming into this country no matter how small a percentage there is of them. Not one of those scumbags should be able to sneak in. Not only for the people that are already here but also for the immigrants that those low lifes try to prey on. Are the liberals able to comprehend that without twisting my words? I have a hunch not. lol

    Why do you focus so much on the outliers?  You do know that every group has it's criminal element, right?  But, that really has little to do with the topic of immigration here anyway and yet you keep focusing on it.  Are your letting fear talk?  And your wording... "criminals from the south", "drug dealing rapist gang members", "scumbags".  You really set yourself up for coming across as having some serious prejudices.  You never talk about the vast majority of these people who are simply trying to flee from a terrible situation.  You express no empathy for the down-trodden.  You only talk about the outliers, those few nefarious souls (and yes there are some) but almost nothing about the vast many who are victims of injustice.  Your viewpoint is extremely narrow.  And I'm not going to claim that is because you are a "conservative" the way you categorize several of us as "liberals".  No, I suspect your viewpoint is narrow because you are fearful.  Good God, are these supposedly bad people beating down your door, raping your female family members, roaming your streets like packs of wolves and selling drugs behind your house?  Jeez, I hope not!
    I've been defending immigrants. If you can't see the problems that are causing immigrants to flee their countries, there is a real problem. They're not risking their lives and freedom for no reason other than to hang in America.  Don't brush the atrocities being commited down south and in our border towns under the carpet so we can have an open border. I'm sure the people fleeing those countries don't want that garbage following them here either. One of your posts talked about legalized drugs to combat the corruption, that would be the biggest mistake ever. Let's take a look at the "legalized" pain management clinics that popped up all over the country when Bush was in office. Now we have the mega pill popping epidemic. Let's stick to just legalizing marijuana, at least that's something that can help some people, you never hear of someone overdosing on weed and maybe if all the leaders of the world passed around the peace pipe before starting their talks more may be accomplished towards peace. lol. And no I don't smoke.  
    Whoa, first of all I'm really surprised you say I "can't see the problems that are causing immigrants to flee their countries" when I've mentioned that several times. And when have I "brushed aside the atrocities committed down south and in our border towns under thee carpet"?  I have not done that.  Those statements left me scratching my head. 

    As for legalizing ALL drugs, I have held that opinion for decades.  It's not a popular opinion, it is never going to happen, but I belief it would be a very good idea.  Users are going to use, legal or not.  Plus, making drugs illegal increases crime.  Is this not a fact?  I think so.  Plus, our prisons have huge numbers of people in them that committed no crime other that shooting up some junk or smoking something or snorting something up their nose.  Instead of spending more money on prisons, I think it would make more sense to set up more rehab centers, and improve education and reduce poverty so that people would be less likely to turn to drugs.  If we spent more energy on improving the environment and promoting healthy choices, fewer people would turn to drugs. These are all reasons I stand by my belief that ALL drugs should be made legal or at the very least, decriminalized. 

    As for weed, yeah, seeing Trump and Jong-un would be rather entertaining.  But the thing is, pot makes some people gooffy or even stupid so don't expect too much!
    That wasn't meant for you. I'm just tired of the reasons immigrants fleeing are being minimized.

    For some leaders, they may already be stupid.

    The rehab centers are a lot of the time short term solutions. If people have access to drugs once they get out and even sometimes when they're still in rehab it's not enough to fix the problem. Education, "just say no to drugs" education didn't stop all the kids from getting into drugs. Reduce poverty? There's plenty, plenty of wealthy drug addicts. 
    Instead of legalizing drugs, make it a mandatory life in prison for drug dealers up to the death penalty(that'll reduce the prison population) if a drug related fatality can be linked to them. They're murderers. If not immediate as in some cases,  eventually they murder people and destroy families. There are people with addictive personalities who can't do anything in moderation. Remove the drug dealers, remove the problem. Problem solved. 
  • thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
    People should enter the United States legally, just like in every other country. Amnesty to those is extreme circumstances. 
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