I'm for raising the minimum wage. That makes sense. The idea of a livable wage to me does not, however. I'm a small business owner and my family and I are by no means making any money off of our hard work. I do 70 hrs a week and my 66 year old mom does about 30, and she works for no pay so we can survive. I make a decent salary but it's not much- I could prob make more being a chef for big companies like I was before this.
I just know that the kids and people I hire don't expect a livable wage working here at a bakery, and they never will. They know that working here or flipping burgers or making subway melts isn't going to pay a livable wage, nor should it.
I feel responsible for my employees well being and make sure I do everything in my power to keep them happy, but if I had to pay $15 an hour minimum I know I would lay off a few people to survive.
This is the same dilemma we're in- definitely pro living wage for people who depend on it and equal pay for men and women but small businesses generally cannot afford to pay $15 to a high school or college aged employee or retiree on a fixed income looking to make some money. There needs to be a clause that accounts for this. A minimum wage that applies straight across the board means small business owners will hire fewer students or retirees on a fixed income (my wife hires both but may not be able to in the future* ) and more and more of them will close (this is already happening). That's not fair for the small business owner, and not fair for the student or retiree on a fixed income. There needs to be some flexibility on this issue for small businesses. The other option is to do away with small businesses and just have corporate everything. Say goodbye to your local independent bakery, pub, bookstore, record store, etc.
*(I run my own small business by myself and see no retirement ever but that's OK with me as I'm OK with working until I drop dead but not everyone is that crazy, LOL!)
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I'm for raising the minimum wage. That makes sense. The idea of a livable wage to me does not, however. I'm a small business owner and my family and I are by no means making any money off of our hard work. I do 70 hrs a week and my 66 year old mom does about 30, and she works for no pay so we can survive. I make a decent salary but it's not much- I could prob make more being a chef for big companies like I was before this.
I just know that the kids and people I hire don't expect a livable wage working here at a bakery, and they never will. They know that working here or flipping burgers or making subway melts isn't going to pay a livable wage, nor should it.
I feel responsible for my employees well being and make sure I do everything in my power to keep them happy, but if I had to pay $15 an hour minimum I know I would lay off a few people to survive.
This is the same dilemma we're in- definitely pro living wage for people who depend on it and equal pay for men and women but small businesses generally cannot afford to pay $15 to a high school or college aged employee or retiree on a fixed income looking to make some money. There needs to be a clause that accounts for this. A minimum wage that applies straight across the board means small business owners will hire fewer students or retirees on a fixed income (my wife hires both but may not be able to in the future* ) and more and more of them will close (this is already happening). That's not fair for the small business owner, and not fair for the student or retiree on a fixed income. There needs to be some flexibility on this issue for small businesses. The other option is to do away with small businesses and just have corporate everything. Say goodbye to your local independent bakery, pub, bookstore, record store, etc.
*(I run my own small business by myself and see no retirement ever but that's OK with me as I'm OK with working until I drop dead but not everyone is that crazy, LOL!)
I'm for raising the minimum wage. That makes sense. The idea of a livable wage to me does not, however. I'm a small business owner and my family and I are by no means making any money off of our hard work. I do 70 hrs a week and my 66 year old mom does about 30, and she works for no pay so we can survive. I make a decent salary but it's not much- I could prob make more being a chef for big companies like I was before this.
I just know that the kids and people I hire don't expect a livable wage working here at a bakery, and they never will. They know that working here or flipping burgers or making subway melts isn't going to pay a livable wage, nor should it.
I feel responsible for my employees well being and make sure I do everything in my power to keep them happy, but if I had to pay $15 an hour minimum I know I would lay off a few people to survive.
This is the same dilemma we're in- definitely pro living wage for people who depend on it and equal pay for men and women but small businesses generally cannot afford to pay $15 to a high school or college aged employee or retiree on a fixed income looking to make some money. There needs to be a clause that accounts for this. A minimum wage that applies straight across the board means small business owners will hire fewer students or retirees on a fixed income (my wife hires both but may not be able to in the future* ) and more and more of them will close (this is already happening). That's not fair for the small business owner, and not fair for the student or retiree on a fixed income. There needs to be some flexibility on this issue for small businesses. The other option is to do away with small businesses and just have corporate everything. Say goodbye to your local independent bakery, pub, bookstore, record store, etc.
*(I run my own small business by myself and see no retirement ever but that's OK with me as I'm OK with working until I drop dead but not everyone is that crazy, LOL!)
I already did
So sorry! Do I remember correctly that you're hoping to open a new business?
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
as a guy who has very little post secondary education, and doesn't make much money, I take exception to the idea of the minimum wage being as high as $15 per hour. that's ludicrous. it will kill small and even medium size businesses at the same time as almost encouraging people to become complacent about furthering their career goals and ultimately fighting for jobs flipping burgers. that doesn't repair or build an economy.
as a guy who has very little post secondary education, and doesn't make much money, I take exception to the idea of the minimum wage being as high as $15 per hour. that's ludicrous. it will kill small and even medium size businesses at the same time as almost encouraging people to become complacent about furthering their career goals and ultimately fighting for jobs flipping burgers. that doesn't repair or build an economy.
Minimum wage jobs used to be considered entry level jobs/gain work experience as a way for the young person...now many people's have lost their good paying manufacturing/resource sector jobs and more and more people are relying on minimum wage jobs, unfortunately. Personally The only way to break the cycle of going from 1 minimum wage job to other minimum wage jobs is through education...and I believe Canada's education system lacks the proper tools to insure the most amount of young people are getting the necessary tools needed before leaving high school...the trades in this country are severely lacking qualified/trained people but many of the schools no longer off much in the way of tech courses...just my opinion.
Why does Switzerland have one of the lowest youth unemployment rates...educating the young/helping them getting trades...etc.
I think we have had more than one minimum wage thread on AMT but this seemed to be the one most recently commented in. Two new studies looking at the potential results of the minimum wage hike in Seattle, and the results are mixed. Some researchers claim that the effects of the hike are confounded or washed out by the effects of a hot labour market in Seattle.
it's very interesting to me to hear some of the small business owners here take on the minimum wage. i think for sure it needs to be raised but there have been some good points raised here regarding small businesses. it has me re-thinking that it should be at $15.00. I'm not sure now. maybe some kind of medium? it has to be higher than it currently is.
Basic Living Wage / Guaranteed Minimum Income / Universal Basic Income would solve a lot of these issues. And you get to scrap minimum wage laws, earned income tax credits, welfare programs, food stamps, housing assistance, tax deductions, and all the rest.
We as a country have the GDP to provide a roof, sustenance and health care to every man, woman and child; with plenty left over for the free market to battle over.
WI 6/27/98 WI 10/8/00 MO 10/11/00 IL 4/23/03 MN 6/26/06 MN 6/27/06 WI 6/30/06 IL 8/5/07 IL 8/21/08 (EV) IL 8/22/08 (EV) IL 8/23/09 IL 8/24/09 IN 5/7/10 IL 6/28/11 (EV) IL 6/29/11 (EV) WI 9/3/11 WI 9/4/11 IL 7/19/13 NE 10/09/14 IL 10/17/14 MN 10/19/14 FL 4/11/16 IL 8/20/16 IL 8/22/16 IL 08/18/18 IL 08/20/18 IT 07/05/2020AT 07/07/2020
It comments in the article that small businesses and larger businesses that provide health care to employees were partially exempt from the mandated minimums, but doesn't give details.
Sorry for choosing the Small Business thread - I just chose the most recent one dealing with minimum wage, but it's not the most applicable one to this article.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
it's very interesting to me to hear some of the small business owners here take on the minimum wage. i think for sure it needs to be raised but there have been some good points raised here regarding small businesses. it has me re-thinking that it should be at $15.00. I'm not sure now. maybe some kind of medium? it has to be higher than it currently is.
The vast majority of small businesses wouldn't be required to pay $15 and hour. There are always exceptions for businesses that have fewer than 15 (for instance) employees or collect less than 750,000$ (for instance) in revenue. Bakeries, bookstores, craft boutiques, hair salons, etc etc are all exempt.
Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,687
I stand by what I've said earlier. There needs to be some flexibility in wages, not a one size fits all. Working full-time for a corporation? Yes, a living wage is appropriate. High school kid working part-time at your local used book store to make some extra cash for those summer camping trips? You don't need a higher minimum wage and we can't afford to give it to you so we grow old working longer hours and, sorry, you get fewer.
Think outside that puny box, America.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
as a guy who has very little post secondary education, and doesn't make much money, I take exception to the idea of the minimum wage being as high as $15 per hour. that's ludicrous. it will kill small and even medium size businesses at the same time as almost encouraging people to become complacent about furthering their career goals and ultimately fighting for jobs flipping burgers. that doesn't repair or build an economy.
Maybe its just me but if people are being complacent making only $15 an hour then I would wonder if that person ever had a drive to further their careers goals.
While i believe that giving staff a working wage is a responsibility of doing business, I do agree about small business. In Toronto, we have whats called a housing allowance for low income people so that they can pay for rent and I wonder if that is something that would work concerning employment. for example, for small business, you get a wage allowance for $5 over what the minimum wage is.
as a guy who has very little post secondary education, and doesn't make much money, I take exception to the idea of the minimum wage being as high as $15 per hour. that's ludicrous. it will kill small and even medium size businesses at the same time as almost encouraging people to become complacent about furthering their career goals and ultimately fighting for jobs flipping burgers. that doesn't repair or build an economy.
Maybe its just me but if people are being complacent making only $15 an hour then I would wonder if that person ever had a drive to further their careers goals.
While i believe that giving staff a working wage is a responsibility of doing business, I do agree about small business. In Toronto, we have whats called a housing allowance for low income people so that they can pay for rent and I wonder if that is something that would work concerning employment. for example, for small business, you get a wage allowance for $5 over what the minimum wage is.
but what drives people to further their careers in the western world? MONEY (why I don't, I don't give a shit about how much money I have). if you can have a $15 an hour TO START job that is easy on your stress and skill levels, as opposed to 7 years of college to start at $18 per hour, why bother? you'll be in the hole for over a decade (if you're lucky) with student debt and will be working harder for the same amount of money, or even less after all is accounted for, as the kid flipping burgers.
I stand by what I've said earlier. There needs to be some flexibility in wages, not a one size fits all. Working full-time for a corporation? Yes, a living wage is appropriate. High school kid working part-time at your local used book store to make some extra cash for those summer camping trips? You don't need a higher minimum wage and we can't afford to give it to you so we grow old working longer hours and, sorry, you get fewer.
Think outside that puny box, America.
100%. depends on the business, their net worth, etc, etc.
Flight Risk out NOW!
www.headstonesband.com
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,687
I stand by what I've said earlier. There needs to be some flexibility in wages, not a one size fits all. Working full-time for a corporation? Yes, a living wage is appropriate. High school kid working part-time at your local used book store to make some extra cash for those summer camping trips? You don't need a higher minimum wage and we can't afford to give it to you so we grow old working longer hours and, sorry, you get fewer.
Think outside that puny box, America.
100%. depends on the business, their net worth, etc, etc.
True, and that seems to vary a lot. We're seeing small businesses in our twon either struggle or do great. The independent restaurants in town are the ones doing great. Sadly, independent bookstore's values have plummeted. I'm not sure you can give one away these days.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
as a guy who has very little post secondary education, and doesn't make much money, I take exception to the idea of the minimum wage being as high as $15 per hour. that's ludicrous. it will kill small and even medium size businesses at the same time as almost encouraging people to become complacent about furthering their career goals and ultimately fighting for jobs flipping burgers. that doesn't repair or build an economy.
Maybe its just me but if people are being complacent making only $15 an hour then I would wonder if that person ever had a drive to further their careers goals.
While i believe that giving staff a working wage is a responsibility of doing business, I do agree about small business. In Toronto, we have whats called a housing allowance for low income people so that they can pay for rent and I wonder if that is something that would work concerning employment. for example, for small business, you get a wage allowance for $5 over what the minimum wage is.
but what drives people to further their careers in the western world? MONEY (why I don't, I don't give a shit about how much money I have). if you can have a $15 an hour TO START job that is easy on your stress and skill levels, as opposed to 7 years of college to start at $18 per hour, why bother? you'll be in the hole for over a decade (if you're lucky) with student debt and will be working harder for the same amount of money, or even less after all is accounted for, as the kid flipping burgers.
I don't know if money is the only reason that people try to further their careers. I will admit that money is an important aspect of it but there are many people who have turned down more money to stay at a job that they love. concerning the "why bother" comment, i still believe that given the option more people would want to work in a job that they love and not just a job. maybe i am a minority here but I would not give up my very stressful job as a social worker to work in a factory even if the factory job gave me the same or somewhat less pay.
we also have to admit that increasing the minimum wage also gives more power to people with a higher level of knowledge. Great companies want great workers and will pay for those worker.
anyway, back to the topic. I still believe that government subsidies to small business to increase wages is a good idea.
I stand by what I've said earlier. There needs to be some flexibility in wages, not a one size fits all. Working full-time for a corporation? Yes, a living wage is appropriate. High school kid working part-time at your local used book store to make some extra cash for those summer camping trips? You don't need a higher minimum wage and we can't afford to give it to you so we grow old working longer hours and, sorry, you get fewer.
Think outside that puny box, America.
100%. depends on the business, their net worth, etc, etc.
True, and that seems to vary a lot. We're seeing small businesses in our twon either struggle or do great. The independent restaurants in town are the ones doing great. Sadly, independent bookstore's values have plummeted. I'm not sure you can give one away these days.
I think book stores in general values has gone down with the advent of ereaders and less people reading. this is the reason why when you go to places like Chapters or Indigo (do they have indigo in the usa?) who have moved strickly from selling books to have other things just as house wear in their stores
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unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
I stand by what I've said earlier. There needs to be some flexibility in wages, not a one size fits all. Working full-time for a corporation? Yes, a living wage is appropriate. High school kid working part-time at your local used book store to make some extra cash for those summer camping trips? You don't need a higher minimum wage and we can't afford to give it to you so we grow old working longer hours and, sorry, you get fewer.
Think outside that puny box, America.
100%. depends on the business, their net worth, etc, etc.
True, and that seems to vary a lot. We're seeing small businesses in our twon either struggle or do great. The independent restaurants in town are the ones doing great. Sadly, independent bookstore's values have plummeted. I'm not sure you can give one away these days.
I think book stores in general values has gone down with the advent of ereaders and less people reading. this is the reason why when you go to places like Chapters or Indigo (do they have indigo in the usa?) who have moved strickly from selling books to have other things just as house wear in their stores
I'm not aware of any Indigo stores in the U.S. but there may be.
E-readers and fewer people reading are part of the reason bookstores are struggling but so are slave shops like Amazon and the fact that anyone with a computer and a closet can now become a "book seller" (albeit, too often run by people who know little about literature). Add to that the fact that more and more people want everything quickly and easily.
Still, there are those who love to browse, who enjoy the feel smell and tactile sense of a good book and who appreciate the interaction and sense of a community that browsing in a neighborhood bookstore affords. If we survive, we may become a last relic of nostalgia or hold the same quaint curiosity young people have for vinyl records. Or we may be the last dinosaurs of our ilk.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I stand by what I've said earlier. There needs to be some flexibility in wages, not a one size fits all. Working full-time for a corporation? Yes, a living wage is appropriate. High school kid working part-time at your local used book store to make some extra cash for those summer camping trips? You don't need a higher minimum wage and we can't afford to give it to you so we grow old working longer hours and, sorry, you get fewer.
Think outside that puny box, America.
100%. depends on the business, their net worth, etc, etc.
True, and that seems to vary a lot. We're seeing small businesses in our twon either struggle or do great. The independent restaurants in town are the ones doing great. Sadly, independent bookstore's values have plummeted. I'm not sure you can give one away these days.
I think book stores in general values has gone down with the advent of ereaders and less people reading. this is the reason why when you go to places like Chapters or Indigo (do they have indigo in the usa?) who have moved strickly from selling books to have other things just as house wear in their stores
I'm not aware of any Indigo stores in the U.S. but there may be.
E-readers and fewer people reading are part of the reason bookstores are struggling but so are slave shops like Amazon and the fact that anyone with a computer and a closet can now become a "book seller" (albeit, too often run by people who know little about literature). Add to that the fact that more and more people want everything quickly and easily.
Still, there are those who love to browse, who enjoy the feel smell and tactile sense of a good book and who appreciate the interaction and sense of a community that browsing in a neighborhood bookstore affords. If we survive, we may become a last relic of nostalgia or hold the same quaint curiosity young people have for vinyl records. Or we may be the last dinosaurs of our ilk.
I hope you are not a relic, still go to bookstores about 1 or 2 times a week. have a good relationship with a bookstore in Toronto who orders books for me that are hard to find.
here is a question for people, if you knew a store that was giving their employees a living wage, would you be more partial to shop there or no even if it meant that their price was abit more expensive?
Well, if you believe that government should set pricing and wages for private companies then we obviously have different models.
Can you please still explain why you are against a minimum wage? and yes I do believe that the government should set wages for private companies.
Are you really proposing that the government (who is really doing a stellar job with the healthcare industry), be put in charge of determining all wages and prices in the private sector? What could possibly go wrong? Luckily we don't have any influence peddling going on in D.C., so I'm sure they'd do a fair and objective job (in secret, behind closed doors, providing their biggest donors with the highest wages and prices).
Sorry, but that would be one of the nuttier things I could imagine we'd want to do here. Our government is run by a bunch of incompetent boobs. I would never cede that sort of power and responsibility to such an inept bunch of crooks.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
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*(I run my own small business by myself and see no retirement ever but that's OK with me as I'm OK with working until I drop dead but not everyone is that crazy, LOL!)
LIVEFOOTSTEPS.ORG/USER/?USR=435
www.headstonesband.com
Why does Switzerland have one of the lowest youth unemployment rates...educating the young/helping them getting trades...etc.
http://www.cbc.ca/doczone/episodes/generation-jobless
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/business/economy/seattle-minimum-wage.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=second-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
We as a country have the GDP to provide a roof, sustenance and health care to every man, woman and child; with plenty left over for the free market to battle over.
Sorry for choosing the Small Business thread - I just chose the most recent one dealing with minimum wage, but it's not the most applicable one to this article.
There are always exceptions for businesses that have fewer than 15 (for instance) employees or collect less than 750,000$ (for instance) in revenue.
Bakeries, bookstores, craft boutiques, hair salons, etc etc are all exempt.
Think outside that puny box, America.
While i believe that giving staff a working wage is a responsibility of doing business, I do agree about small business. In Toronto, we have whats called a housing allowance for low income people so that they can pay for rent and I wonder if that is something that would work concerning employment. for example, for small business, you get a wage allowance for $5 over what the minimum wage is.
www.headstonesband.com
www.headstonesband.com
we also have to admit that increasing the minimum wage also gives more power to people with a higher level of knowledge. Great companies want great workers and will pay for those worker.
anyway, back to the topic. I still believe that government subsidies to small business to increase wages is a good idea.
If you understood economics you'd know why.
E-readers and fewer people reading are part of the reason bookstores are struggling but so are slave shops like Amazon and the fact that anyone with a computer and a closet can now become a "book seller" (albeit, too often run by people who know little about literature). Add to that the fact that more and more people want everything quickly and easily.
Still, there are those who love to browse, who enjoy the feel smell and tactile sense of a good book and who appreciate the interaction and sense of a community that browsing in a neighborhood bookstore affords. If we survive, we may become a last relic of nostalgia or hold the same quaint curiosity young people have for vinyl records. Or we may be the last dinosaurs of our ilk.
here is a question for people, if you knew a store that was giving their employees a living wage, would you be more partial to shop there or no even if it meant that their price was abit more expensive?
Are you really proposing that the government (who is really doing a stellar job with the healthcare industry), be put in charge of determining all wages and prices in the private sector? What could possibly go wrong? Luckily we don't have any influence peddling going on in D.C., so I'm sure they'd do a fair and objective job (in secret, behind closed doors, providing their biggest donors with the highest wages and prices).
Sorry, but that would be one of the nuttier things I could imagine we'd want to do here. Our government is run by a bunch of incompetent boobs. I would never cede that sort of power and responsibility to such an inept bunch of crooks.