Rap stars flaunt $$, rock stars don't

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  • Echoes wrote:
    The ignorance in your post speaks for itself, TMY. Refuting blanket generalizations about a genre the poster clearly knows nothing about is not a hard thing to do (Apologies on the grammar), so hard in fact, that it isn't necessary to point out the fallacies in your argument, and the grotesque lack of perpective in your opinion.

    There are many things wrong with it, and most of them start with your use of the universal quantifier.

    Who is this directed at???

    The original poster??
    "I Miss You Already!!!!!"

    "Sorry is the fool who trades his love for high-rise rent, Seems the more you make equals the loneliness you get"

    .NJD.
  • Brisk.Brisk. Posts: 11,486
    yeh, i reckon that rock is talented, and i guess some rap is, though rock i reckon more, as you got voaclists,guitar and drums and whatever else you want and write the lyrics, but rapper is just lyricsi guess and catchy tune

    anyway, mainstream rap isn't skill as i think they are just chosen on their looks, tbh if someone gave me mainstream rap lyrcsi, i'll rap them same as 50 cent, he was just chosen of looks

    but iam just saying this for mainstream, i dont know anything really about underground rap

    :D
  • Has anyone not learned anything from MC Hammer? Sure he has somewhat turned his life around, but I'm sure if he didn't spend it like a moron he and his family would be better off.

    Some of these rap artists spend money like it is going out of style. Their thought process seems to be spend it as long as it comes in. Others, for example, like 50 cent and Russell Simmons, Jay-Z, Diddy, etc. have built lucrative businesses doing other things. Baffles me to think that some of these 20 year old rappers can afford to drop over 300m on a Rolls and still have enough money put away that will carry them forward when their "careers" are gone. Seems like some of them have a false sense of security and think the money will always be rolling in.

    This is also assuming they are actually purchasing these cars and homes when most likely they have more debt than cash.
    I'll scream my lungs out...'til I fill this thread!
  • Off base??

    Ok. well thanks for your two cents...seeing as you explained your post so well....

    Trust me, it really wouldn't be that difficult to refute such well thought out statements such as:
    "Every fuckin song is about the same thing, and it is all shit!"

    "These rapper's are not talented!"

    "There is probably 3, maybe 4 different categories a rapper can sing a song "about"

    But what would be the point? You clearly see the world through broad generalizations and stereotypes - and I'm not so sure anything I say will change that.
  • lamperti77 wrote:
    Has anyone not learned anything from MC Hammer? Sure he has somewhat turned his life around, but I'm sure if he didn't spend it like a moron he and his family would be better off.

    Some of these rap artists spend money like it is going out of style. Their thought process seems to be spend it as long as it comes in. Others, for example, like 50 cent and Russell Simmons, Jay-Z, Diddy, etc. have built lucrative businesses doing other things. Baffles me to think that some of these 20 year old rappers can afford to drop over 300m on a Rolls and still have enough money put away that will carry them forward when their "careers" are gone. Seems like some of them have a false sense of security and think the money will always be rolling in.

    This is also assuming they are actually purchasing these cars and homes when most likely they have more debt than cash.

    Plenty of rock artists have squandered their money. So have athletes, bankers, garbage men, and school teachers.
  • rock star's do... not good ones... but they do..

    think..

    hair metal..

    *shudders*

    is this the hair metal era of rap?

    it's certianly annoying enough to be..
    Come on pilgrim you know he loves you..

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    Oh my, they dropped the leash.



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  • I BrisK I wrote:
    anyway, mainstream rap isn't skill as i think they are just chosen on their looks, tbh if someone gave me mainstream rap lyrcsi, i'll rap them same as 50 cent, he was just chosen of looks

    i'm not a fan of fiddy, not at all... but i'd actually like to see you rap better than him :D


    seriously though, as someone pointed out earlier on, saying rap sucks based on the mainstream hip-hop on mtv is like saying rock music is crap when you only know good charlotte... i'd actually agree with this statement then... mainstream rock that's only marketed at teenage girls does suck big time...

    but being a rapper and producing a good hip-hop track requires lots of skill, just like making good rock music...
    there are lots of awfull rap lyrics about guns, cars and bitches but there are also many mindless "i'm so angry" rock lyrics or boring conventional love songs...
    if you're looking for more than that in rock music you just have to dig a little bit deeper... it's the same with good rap... it's there, you'll just have to look a little bit harder...
    ~~~
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  • Saying that all rappers are about $$$$ and bling bling is like saying all rock bands are like Creed or even worst.... There are plenty of rap and hip hop bands that sing about the devils and currpotion of the system and talk about things worth paying attention to.
  • D Lo Brown wrote:
    Plenty of rock artists have squandered their money. So have athletes, bankers, garbage men, and school teachers.

    as for athletes, orientations are held for rookies to help with planning, business managers, etc...

    too many kids look up to their lifestyle (athletes and musicians). almost makes me sick to watch how these people just piss away their money. it's a shame they won't realize what they had until it's gone.
    I'll scream my lungs out...'til I fill this thread!
  • StuffnJunk wrote:
    so i was watching a show on 50 cent and he was saying "i'll stick around as long as they'll pay to see me"............and i thought about eddie vedder, a bit of a difference in opinion...........rap stars cover themselves in jewelry, have their own power drink, have their own video game, MAKE VIDEOS FOR MTV, flaunt their houses and cars, etc etc etc......and it adds to their credibility............yet rock stars (aside from 80's cheese metal) go to great lengths to hide it, they are almost ashamed by success, and avoid overexposure

    is it a white/black thing?

    white liberal guilt?

    people from the ghetto who get rich want the world to know about it?

    middle class whites who get rich miss.....,uh, middle class stuff?

    ive never had much of a problem of these 50 cents characters flaunting their material possesions. the way i look at it is that lots of these individuals grew up in the ghettos, surrounded by poverty and violence, and without that much. if you make it out of the cycle, why not flaunt it and make as much as you can? 50 cent knows he'll never be an legitimate artist accept by the music community, but right now can make loads of money he never imagined growing up. they're making their money off white middle class surburban kids and laughing it up. how's that for irony?

    middle class is bewildered by these "thugs" and "gangsters" while their kids write their checks. and the best part? the kids who have clue or preception what any of them are singing about.
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  • D Lo Brown wrote:
    Trust me, it really wouldn't be that difficult to refute such well thought out statements such as:



    But what would be the point? You clearly see the world through broad generalizations and stereotypes - and I'm not so sure anything I say will change that.

    The original post said "rap stars" therefore, i was under the impression that he was in fact talking about: 50 Cent, Jay-Z, Kanye West.etc

    I'm sorry but everything by these guys all sounds the same to me, that Golddigger song by Kanye West was probably one of the worst songs released in 2005, it's awful!!!

    I'm not stereotyping, just stating my opinion on these particular type of rapper's, (the mainstream ones). I honestly don't think that these guys are talented. It's pretty easy to steal a beat from an old song and turn it into a rap song, i dunno, i just don't get it. Play an instrument then get back to me (directed at the rappers)
    "I Miss You Already!!!!!"

    "Sorry is the fool who trades his love for high-rise rent, Seems the more you make equals the loneliness you get"

    .NJD.
  • Echoes wrote:
    Hahah I love watching people who know dick all about rap talk shit about it.
    well i started this post........some people have said that "rap is crap", but i never said that or anything about the level of talent involved........all i meant was that if you take the major rap artists featured on MTV and BET and compare them to the rock bands on MTV2 and Fuse, you see this difference in money being flaunted/not flaunted

    mind you, i am 29 and all i listen to is PEARL JAM, so i really don't know dick all about any of these artists, it is just a broad generalization i found interesting (and that i knew would spark at least 3 pages of heated responses)
    "I'll tell you what: If all I had was Pearl Jam, and I didn't have another band in the world, I would not be worried. Because in there is the essence of making great music. You don't have to use it all at once, but it's there." - Neil Young
  • StuffnJunk wrote:
    .all i meant was that if you take the major rap artists featured on MTV and BET and compare them to the rock bands on MTV2 and Fuse, you see this difference in money being flaunted/not flaunted

    and if you knew more about the history of rock star excess, you'd see that there's not much of a difference.
  • The original post said "rap stars" therefore, i was under the impression that he was in fact talking about: 50 Cent, Jay-Z, Kanye West.etc

    YOUR post didn't specify anything.
    I'm sorry but everything by these guys all sounds the same to me,

    I bet it would to someone with a narrow mind.
    that Golddigger song by Kanye West was probably one of the worst songs released in 2005, it's awful!!!

    So you didn't like one song. who cares?
    I'm not stereotyping,

    bwahahahahahahahahaha
    just stating my opinion on these particular type of rapper's, (the mainstream ones).

    We know it's your opinion. Thanks for pointing that out though...
    I honestly don't think that these guys are talented.

    That's because you don't understand what they're doing.
    It's pretty easy to steal a beat from an old song and turn it into a rap song,

    It's SLIGHLTY more complicated than that.
    i dunno, i just don't get it.

    Smartest thing you've said yet.
  • D Lo Brown wrote:

    YOUR post didn't specify anything.

    Fair Enough
    D Lo Brown wrote:
    I bet it would to someone with a narrow mind.

    I have a narrow mind because i have a certain opinion on rap?????
    D Lo Brown wrote:
    That's because you don't understand what they're doing.

    Tell me then...what are they doing???

    You seem to be an expert yet you haven't came up with anything in any of your posts. You've just insulted other peopple's posts, so tell me, what are they doing.

    Because IMO they're poisoning the minds of so many young people. Music has such an impact on people, why is there so much violence, people aren't shooting people in clubs while Nothingman's on, girls get treated like crap these days, but..well they are treated like shit in rap songs too.

    I honestly think that rap plays such a huge role in many of today's problems (mainstream crap) (just specifying for you this time D-Lo). Somebody like Eminem or 50 Cent, that has a huge impact on kids and like it or not is a role model, could send a positive message through his lyrics, but no, lets talk (because that is what they're doing ...talking) about shootings, and "hoes" and all that other garbage.
    "I Miss You Already!!!!!"

    "Sorry is the fool who trades his love for high-rise rent, Seems the more you make equals the loneliness you get"

    .NJD.
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    Rock & Roll takes talent (real rock & roll)

    These rapper's are not talented!!! i don't understand how people can't see this.

    Every fuckin song is about the same thing, and it is all shit!!!!!!!!There is probably 3, maybe 4 different categories a rapper can sing a song about:

    Having Sex.....good one...does there have to be a "club" mentioned in every song???

    Drugs
    Their cars, money and houses (jewelry too...can't forget that)
    Or maybe i dunno trying to act tough in their lyrics while they're sitting up in their huge house and shit...

    I'm sorry but i think that rap is the absolute lowest form of music, and that these mindless, untalented (artists??...ya right) people flaunt that because they have no real perception on what music is all about. They do it for the fame and money and crap, and i mean sure if that comes along with it, and an honest rock band can make a living than great. But to get into it for that reason is wrong.


    please see KRS-1...talib kweli...common...outkast...kanye west for the better side of rap
  • my2hands wrote:
    please see KRS-1...talib kweli...common...outkast...kanye west for the better side of rap

    I will look into this :)
    "I Miss You Already!!!!!"

    "Sorry is the fool who trades his love for high-rise rent, Seems the more you make equals the loneliness you get"

    .NJD.
  • Rap doesn't suck. A lot does but not all.
    Check out Outkast.

    They are still making beats and songs...
    They are also one of the musical groups ever IMO..including rock
  • EchoesEchoes Posts: 1,279
    StuffnJunk wrote:
    mind you, i am 29 and all i listen to is PEARL JAM, so i really don't know dick all about any of these artists, it is just a broad generalization


    And there you have it folks.
    printf("shiver in eternal darkness\n");
  • I honestly think that rap plays such a huge role in many of today's problems (mainstream crap) (just specifying for you this time D-Lo). Somebody like Eminem or 50 Cent, that has a huge impact on kids and like it or not is a role model, could send a positive message through his lyrics, but no, lets talk (because that is what they're doing ...talking) about shootings, and "hoes" and all that other garbage.

    i happen to disagree. i don't think 50 cent owns anything to anyone, including sending a positive message to the kids. guys like him grew up in an environment where all they knew was shootings and "all that garbage." wasn't he himself shot like 10 times? he simply talks about what he knows and people seem to buying his records. just because he's made into the mainstream does not automatically mean he must become a positive role model for the children. he does what he does, makes money off it, why should he change because he's a bad role model for kids???

    similarily, his record company would probably object if 50 cent turned Bono-esque preaching about third world debt, the aids crisis africa. like it or not, this gimmick works, and lots of people--not just 50 cent--are making impressive sums of money. kids living in secure middle class neighbourhoods are drawn this rebellion, angst, and thugness they hear in rap music. it is enticing for them to get caught up into aura of violence but at the end of the day have a meal on the table, a comfortable bed to climb into, and so 50 cent becomes a sort of mystical character and a fantasy world for these kids. it's like what early rock n' roll was kids back in the 50s and 60s; a denegerate
    form of "music" that parents were all in arms about. today, those artists are in the rock n' roll hall of fame and deemed as the voice of their generation.
    Have you ideas on how this life ends?

    Toronto 10-05-2000 / Toronto 06-28-2003 / Kitchener 09-11-2005 / Hamilton 09-13-2005 / Ottawa 09-16-2005 / Toronto 09-19-2005 / Toronto 05-09-2006 / Toronto 05-10-2006 / Toronto 08-21-2009 / Montreal 09-07-2011 / Toronto 09-11-2011 / Toronto 09-12-2011 / Ottawa 09-14-2011 / London 07/16/2013 / Ottawa 05-08-2016 / Toronto 05-12-2016
  • i actually like a lot of what 50 and 'the game' have been doing in rap recently. it's not the greatest rap music but it's not the worst either

    the bottom line here is that rap is ridiculously similar to rock music currently in many ways because you have your true artists and the ones who suck ass. i completely agree that the majority of rap on mtv is all about flaunting bling and talking about bitches. does that mean that all rap is bad? no. just like there are underground or "indie" rock artists, there are also underground rap artists as well, rapping about social issues, etc. if you're going strictly off of what's played on mtv, i could make a strong argument that all rock music sucks right now too, and we all know that that's not entirely true.
  • StuffnJunk wrote:
    it is just a broad generalization i found interesting (and that i knew would spark at least 3 pages of heated responses)

    and THERE you have it folks
    "I'll tell you what: If all I had was Pearl Jam, and I didn't have another band in the world, I would not be worried. Because in there is the essence of making great music. You don't have to use it all at once, but it's there." - Neil Young
  • I agree with the original poster, indeed music is commercialized and wealth and how big your house is and how expensive your car is are popular.

    However, I think hip hop gets negatively stereotyped.

    I agree 50 cent and p diddy and nelly are all crap. They arent saying anything productive or socially conscious and arent speaking out on behalf of millions of poor blacks who listen. They could serve as spokesmen but refuse to. P diddy's making the band show on mtv is a disgrace. harriet Tubman went back after she escaped and help others to escape. P diddy could care less. Mainstream rap is crap.

    However so is mainstream rock. You seem to suggest rock music right now is political and positive and powerful and sincere. Its none of that.
    Nickelback, 3 doors down etc... all are crap.

    There is no positive social message, no political content, no great message at all. You think the rock on mtv right now is great? You must be kidding.

    Mainstream rap is crap. But the underground has powerful rhymes and political messages. They speak more about whats actually going on in harlem and south central than how much bling they got.

    Same with rock or country for that matter. Turn on mtv or CMT, is this music that serves a positive purpose?

    I miss the early 90's.

    All true music is found in the underground. You aint going to find great music on your local radio station.

    When I want to buy a cd of a band in the underground, I have to search it out. Yet I go to a cd store and I have no trouble seeing where the Justin Timberlake and Britney Spears cd;s are. It should be the other way around.

    I would get the story straight. The commericialism and crap in rap has nothing to do with race. Its about money.
  • You seem to suggest rock music right now is political and positive and powerful and sincere. Its none of that.
    Nickelback, 3 doors down etc... all are crap.

    There is no positive social message, no political content, no great message at all. You think the rock on mtv right now is great? You must be kidding.
    my main point was basically rap stars dress fancy, and rock stars dress shitty, and neither would be caught dead doing the opposite............i never said anything about talent or quality of music

    trust me, i know nickelback sucks
    "I'll tell you what: If all I had was Pearl Jam, and I didn't have another band in the world, I would not be worried. Because in there is the essence of making great music. You don't have to use it all at once, but it's there." - Neil Young
  • Echoes wrote:
    Hahah I love watching people who know dick all about rap talk shit about it.

    Same here!
  • I'm gunna bump this up because i told you guys that i would try and find some positve, non-mainstream crap.

    I found a song called See You When You Get There by Coolio

    It's awesome, it has a real positive message and i just think it's a well written song, so there...lol...i really did enjoy this song and i thought, wow, now here's how rap should be :)
    "I Miss You Already!!!!!"

    "Sorry is the fool who trades his love for high-rise rent, Seems the more you make equals the loneliness you get"

    .NJD.
  • El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    this is only true of mainstream rap...to compare the whole genre to it is like comparing all of rock to creed.

    there are plenty of rap artists that talk about things other than money, drugs, sex...but these artists also have integrity so they don't sell out for marketablitly so you never really hear or see them.
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
  • El_Kabong wrote:
    this is only true of mainstream rap...to compare the whole genre to it is like comparing all of rock to creed.

    there are plenty of rap artists that talk about things other than money, drugs, sex...but these artists also have integrity so they don't sell out for marketablitly so you never really hear or see them.

    Very well said
    "I Miss You Already!!!!!"

    "Sorry is the fool who trades his love for high-rise rent, Seems the more you make equals the loneliness you get"

    .NJD.
  • El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    I'm gunna bump this up because i told you guys that i would try and find some positve, non-mainstream crap.

    I found a song called See You When You Get There by Coolio

    It's awesome, it has a real positive message and i just think it's a well written song, so there...lol...i really did enjoy this song and i thought, wow, now here's how rap should be :)


    check out Aesop Rock, especially his 2nd album 'Labor Days' His first one is good, too, but the writing is not as focused, imo

    and to quote ani difranco "hip hop is tied up in the backroom w/ a logo stuffed in it's mouth'
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
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