Idea on how to fix the "holiday single" problem.

135

Comments

  • HesCalledDyerHesCalledDyer MarylandPosts: 12,297
    edited September 19
    Another way to fix the problem is just do away with it. 
    DYERS GETTIN' IRRATIONAL
    :lol: :wink:
    Just saying, this has been an ongoing issue for so many years now, and by the time the 2016 single was sent out, it was closer to 2019 than it was 2016 and not only did it have the wrong date on it, it had a song performed & recorded in 2017 (how can a 2016 single have a 2017 song on it?).  We still don't have a 2017 physical copy despite being told several months ago that "Can't Deny Me" was it.  2018 is 3/4 of the way over and not even so much as a hint as to when or what might be in the works.  Ten Club simply cannot figure out how to do this in a timely fashion and still can't get it right when they're 2 years late on it.  They've already hid under the skirt of "it's not a Christmas single, it's an annual single" many years ago after several years of not getting it out around Christmas time.  Well, now we don't even get it annually, so it's not an "annual" single either.  And let's not forget how lackluster most of these have been in recent years.  Most of them are live tracks that we have available on bootlegs, or some weird one off performance that most couldn't care less about. We get them, we play them once, we put them on a shelf never to see the light of day ever again.
    Let's face it, these things were fun in the 90s and early 2000's when they were specially made Christmas songs, new studio tracks, or live tracks we didn't have because the official live library was in its infancy.  But now the "fan club single" basically only exists just to keep the tradition & collection going.  I certainly wouldn't be hurt one bit if they stopped them all together.  Ten Club apparently doesn't care to fulfill their promise on time (if at all), so why should I care if they continue to make promises they can't keep?  And while I know that mine is probably an unpopular opinion, I'm just trying to see things practically from both the retailer and consumer standpoints.
  • JammalamboJammalambo Posts: 1,077
    Another way to fix the problem is just do away with it. 
    DYERS GETTIN' IRRATIONAL
    :lol: :wink:
    Just saying, this has been an ongoing issue for so many years now, and by the time the 2016 single was sent out, it was closer to 2019 than it was 2016 and not only did it have the wrong date on it, it had a song performed & recorded in 2017 (how can a 2016 single have a 2017 song on it?).  We still don't have a 2017 physical copy despite being told several months ago that "Can't Deny Me" was it.  2018 is 3/4 of the way over and not even so much as a hint as to when or what might be in the works.  Ten Club simply cannot figure out how to do this in a timely fashion and still can't get it right when they're 2 years late on it.  They've already hid under the skirt of "it's not a Christmas single, it's an annual single" many years ago after several years of not getting it out around Christmas time.  Well, now we don't even get it annually, so it's not an "annual" single either.  And let's not forget how lackluster most of these have been in recent years.  Most of them are live tracks that we have available on bootlegs, or some weird one off performance that most couldn't care less about. We get them, we play them once, we put them on a shelf never to see the light of day ever again.
    Let's face it, these things were fun in the 90s and early 2000's when they were specially made Christmas songs, new studio tracks, or live tracks we didn't have because the official live library was in its infancy.  But now the "fan club single" basically only exists just to keep the tradition & collection going.  I certainly wouldn't be hurt one bit if they stopped them all together.  Ten Club apparently doesn't care to fulfill their promise on time (if at all), so why should I care if they continue to make promises they can't keep?  And while I know that mine is probably an unpopular opinion, I'm just trying to see things practically from both the retailer and consumer standpoints.
    Just a couple things.. the 2016 single was clearly intended to be a 2017 single, cause it does have two songs performed in 2017 (not only one), both related to the RRHOF. So yeah, complete bullshit that it was just only a "mislabel". Also, to be fair, it's not really true that most of these tracks are available on bootlegs (I can only think of the 2000 one and one song from the 1995 one that have also been released on official bootlegs/Vaults), unless you take into accounts unofficial bootlegs too. And, they can still do good singles if they want (the last one gave us a never-heard good cover that we might not have ever heard otherwise), the 2016 single is actually great but the fact it was so late partially ruined its goodness.
    I agree with you on this: stop the "annual" single tradition if you (Pearl Jam) don't want to do it anymore (and they clearly aren't interested anymore) because, at this point, it creates more frustration and negativity around here than it does joy and interest. And that's a fact.
  • Lost In OhioLost In Ohio Posts: 4,683
    edited September 20
    I'm not even sure how they'll fix it. They could go into the archives and send out two rarities to people who were members in 2016 and call that the 2016... It's just foolish to call it the 2016 when it has a song written in 2017.

    Either way, we're missing one...and it should be time for them to press the 2018.

    With that said, the method has usually been to send out a teaser about checking address validity, then a bit later, send out the records. "Make sure your address is up to date by June 18..." Then, someone posts about getting the record and mailboxes are checked...

    They haven't even done the teaser yet.

    We have a "2017 single" released digitally, played live and released to radio. How many 10C singles meet those criteria? I do not believe Can't Deny Me was meant to be the 2018 10C single. Yes, they wanted fans to hear it first, but I think that's all it was meant for.
    https://pearljam.com/ten-club/event/cant-deny-me

    It seems they have a friend in Jack White. Jack owns a recording studio...they could certainly use that to their advantage, right?

    Eddie said that the next time they get together, it'll be in the studio. The good news is that they could always release a song from Eddie's 2017 Euro tour, plus a song from a soundcheck and call that the 2018...but what would they do for that gap?

    It was cute (in a way) when they would arrive in May or July or whatever from about 03-09 or so, but this is insane.

    My 03 single came in April of 04.
    My 06-08 (approx) would come in the middle of the next year. This is sort of when the confusion began and when people would think it was *that year's single* when it was really a half-year late.
    My Betterman/Someday At Christmas came in Jan the next year.

    The first year of analog, mine actually came a month early!

    This...needs help.
    Post edited by Lost In Ohio on
    Presidential Advice from President-Elect Mike McCready: "Are you getting something out of this all encompassing trip?"
  • JammalamboJammalambo Posts: 1,077
    It's just foolish to call it the 2016 when it has a song written in 2017.
    Last time I checked the "2016" single contains a 60+ years old song and an almost 30 years old song.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,929
    Another way to fix the problem is just do away with it. 
    DYERS GETTIN' IRRATIONAL
    :lol: :wink:
    Just saying, this has been an ongoing issue for so many years now, and by the time the 2016 single was sent out, it was closer to 2019 than it was 2016 and not only did it have the wrong date on it, it had a song performed & recorded in 2017 (how can a 2016 single have a 2017 song on it?).  We still don't have a 2017 physical copy despite being told several months ago that "Can't Deny Me" was it.  2018 is 3/4 of the way over and not even so much as a hint as to when or what might be in the works.  Ten Club simply cannot figure out how to do this in a timely fashion and still can't get it right when they're 2 years late on it.  They've already hid under the skirt of "it's not a Christmas single, it's an annual single" many years ago after several years of not getting it out around Christmas time.  Well, now we don't even get it annually, so it's not an "annual" single either.  And let's not forget how lackluster most of these have been in recent years.  Most of them are live tracks that we have available on bootlegs, or some weird one off performance that most couldn't care less about. We get them, we play them once, we put them on a shelf never to see the light of day ever again.
    Let's face it, these things were fun in the 90s and early 2000's when they were specially made Christmas songs, new studio tracks, or live tracks we didn't have because the official live library was in its infancy.  But now the "fan club single" basically only exists just to keep the tradition & collection going.  I certainly wouldn't be hurt one bit if they stopped them all together.  Ten Club apparently doesn't care to fulfill their promise on time (if at all), so why should I care if they continue to make promises they can't keep?  And while I know that mine is probably an unpopular opinion, I'm just trying to see things practically from both the retailer and consumer standpoints.
    I never understood the "Its not a Christmas single, its an annual single" defense.
    So, if that is the case, doesn't that just buy them an extra 6 days to get it out? 
  • PSUS2HPSUS2H Posts: 1,360
    edited September 20

    TMR cranks out four specialty packages a year, 10C can get a single put together in a year, they're probably planning something special.


    I know someone will say, well TMR has their own pressing plant, they didn't always have that plant and still had the consistent output.

    Post edited by PSUS2H on
    Pittsburgh, PA September 28, 2005 // Washington, DC June 22, 2008 // Barstow, VA May 13, 2010 // Seattle, WA August 10, 2018 // Dana Point, CA September 29, 2018 (EV) 
  • pjsteelerfanpjsteelerfan MarylandPosts: 9,209
    PSUS2H said:

    TMR cranks out four specialty packages a year, 10C can get a single put together in a year, they're probably planning something special.


    I know someone will say, well TMR has their own pressing plant, they didn't always have that plant and still had the consistent output.

    I don't think it is that. Positive they could get the single pressed and out on time. Think the problem is more getting the band to agree on what to put out as the annual single. 
    ...got a mind full of questions and a teacher in my soul...
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,649
    PSUS2H said:

    TMR cranks out four specialty packages a year, 10C can get a single put together in a year, they're probably planning something special.


    I know someone will say, well TMR has their own pressing plant, they didn't always have that plant and still had the consistent output.

    I don't think it is that. Positive they could get the single pressed and out on time. Think the problem is more getting the band to agree on what to put out as the annual single. 
    agreed. JW has singular control of his enterprise. makes making decisions pretty easy. 
  • JammalamboJammalambo Posts: 1,077
    Well, to me the major problem is actually getting the band to CARE on what to put out as the annual single. I love this band, but it's their fault, and bad behaviour, here. Not much more needs to be said, really.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,929
    PSUS2H said:

    TMR cranks out four specialty packages a year, 10C can get a single put together in a year, they're probably planning something special.


    I know someone will say, well TMR has their own pressing plant, they didn't always have that plant and still had the consistent output.

    I don't think it is that. Positive they could get the single pressed and out on time. Think the problem is more getting the band to agree on what to put out as the annual single. 
    Yeah, pressing time isn't an issue.
    Reminds me of a friend I worked with in college. After about a month of being 15 minutes every single day, with the same excuse of (in a surfer-stoner voice) "There was a lot of traffic coming down Rosecrans today." Our boss just said "It seems like there's traffic every day. Maybe you should plan on that and leave 15 minutes earlier."
    So if it takes 6 months to press a single, plan ahead!
    But I don;t believe thats even the issue.
  • ZodZod Posts: 5,863
    mace1229 said:

    onsumer standpoints.
    I never understood the "Its not a Christmas single, its an annual single" defense.
    So, if that is the case, doesn't that just buy them an extra 6 days to get it out? 
    That's why I always thought too.   As a Christmas single it came out at the end of the year.   Call it an annual single doesn't help at all, because all you get is a 3 more business days and it's still late...

    I agree about the 2017 single.  I'm not sure the 10c realized they missed 2016 until they got backlash about it.

    Give us the studio Baba and let's call it a day :)
  • HesCalledDyerHesCalledDyer MarylandPosts: 12,297
    Yeah, I mean, since the "2016" single says 2017 on it and includes songs performed in 2017, can we just call it the 2017 single?  Give us all a bootleg code in place of 2016 and call it a day.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,649
    Zod said:
    mace1229 said:

    onsumer standpoints.
    I never understood the "Its not a Christmas single, its an annual single" defense.
    So, if that is the case, doesn't that just buy them an extra 6 days to get it out? 
    That's why I always thought too.   As a Christmas single it came out at the end of the year.   Call it an annual single doesn't help at all, because all you get is a 3 more business days and it's still late...

    I agree about the 2017 single.  I'm not sure the 10c realized they missed 2016 until they got backlash about it.

    Give us the studio Baba and let's call it a day :)
    I've been saying this for YEARS
  • Abe FromanAbe Froman Posts: 3,575
    Another way to fix the problem is just do away with it. 
    I never want them to do away with it.
  • HesCalledDyerHesCalledDyer MarylandPosts: 12,297
    Another way to fix the problem is just do away with it. 
    I never want them to do away with it.
    I mean, they pretty much have already.
  • brewdog123brewdog123 ATLPosts: 270
    edited September 21
    Another way to fix the problem is just do away with it. 
    I never want them to do away with it.
    I mean, they pretty much have already.
    and yet they keep taking our money...
  • FR181798FR181798 Posts: 1,045
    Although it would have made sense after the typo to just call the 2016 single the 2017 not everyone that got it will have been signed up for 2017.

    We've been told that Cant Deny Me is the 2017 single so they need to get their act together and get it made and mailed. Its more likely that Deep is not ready and they have been saving money in recent years by sending them together. They can get all the tour merch manufactured so they can get this made.

    I think everyone also needs to accept that Cant Deny Me is probably the only new song they have.

    Maybe if 10c got 100 emails this weekend from members politely saying their 2017 single hadn't turned up yet and they were thinking about cancelling their membership it might wake them up, as JW says Who's with me?






  • Abe FromanAbe Froman Posts: 3,575
    Another way to fix the problem is just do away with it. 
    I never want them to do away with it.
    I mean, they pretty much have already.
    Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely think they should be able to get us ONE 7” to us ONCE a year. I want them to start getting it out in time not get rid of it as I love vinyl. It’s about the only thing I still buy. 
  • This issue has come up many times.

    They 'could' press a ton of singles and send them to their membership base in timely fashion (ensuring they have enough for new memberships as well); however, that would very likely result in overstock. So fair enough... wait until the year completes itself... and in January, press the number of singles you wish for and follow through on your commitment. Have the tracks, sleeve artwork, plant time, and anything else required to get the job done already arranged.

    There is a very workable solution for them if they were inclined to care about a solution. It's kind of obvious they do not. I am not saying they do not care about their fans when I say this. I'm just saying this issue is small on their priority list. It's obviously a pain in the ass for someone there.

    I'll keep paying for my membership. The single will come at some point- they always do. But I'll never hold my breath waiting for it.  
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • Lost In OhioLost In Ohio Posts: 4,683
    Does anyone else remember when they used to acknowledge it in the Rumor Pit emails?

    "We know it's late. There was an issue in production, but it's coming soon. We haven't forgot you."
    Presidential Advice from President-Elect Mike McCready: "Are you getting something out of this all encompassing trip?"
  • ZodZod Posts: 5,863
    Yeah, I mean, since the "2016" single says 2017 on it and includes songs performed in 2017, can we just call it the 2017 single?  Give us all a bootleg code in place of 2016 and call it a day.
    I'd actually be really choked if they sent us a bootleg code instead.   The whole reason I pay the extra $30 for the Analog membership is the single.   I buy cd's for the shows I go to, so the code doesn't do much for me (and they nickel and dime you for FLAC downloads by making you pay an extra $5). 

    I'm ok if come out and say they're behind and going forward the single are going to stop.  I'd simply downgrade my membership to digital the next time it came around.   I think they should make good on the promises they have already made, and not retroactively substite an analog good for a digital one.  That's why it called the analog membership.

    I would like to start a petition to upgrade the code so it include FLAC for free.   We're Analog.  We like high quality.   Bandwidth isn't that expensive anymore.   The cost of offering flac isn't really that much more than mp3.   Why not allow the code to work on FLAC? :)
  • HesCalledDyerHesCalledDyer MarylandPosts: 12,297
    Zod said:
    Yeah, I mean, since the "2016" single says 2017 on it and includes songs performed in 2017, can we just call it the 2017 single?  Give us all a bootleg code in place of 2016 and call it a day.
    I'd actually be really choked if they sent us a bootleg code instead.   The whole reason I pay the extra $30 for the Analog membership is the single.   I buy cd's for the shows I go to, so the code doesn't do much for me (and they nickel and dime you for FLAC downloads by making you pay an extra $5). 

    I'm ok if come out and say they're behind and going forward the single are going to stop.  I'd simply downgrade my membership to digital the next time it came around.   I think they should make good on the promises they have already made, and not retroactively substite an analog good for a digital one.  That's why it called the analog membership.

    I would like to start a petition to upgrade the code so it include FLAC for free.   We're Analog.  We like high quality.   Bandwidth isn't that expensive anymore.   The cost of offering flac isn't really that much more than mp3.   Why not allow the code to work on FLAC? :)
    Agree with code working on the higher res files.  I'm an Apple guy, so I always download ALAC to go with my iThings.  It sucks to have to pay an extra $5 on top of the membership fee for digital files.  I'm not being provided a tangible item, no need to charge me extra for a bunch of zeroes and ones.  When you order an album from Nine Inch Nails, you pay one price and choose whatever format you like. I know there are other bands that do this as well.
    And I know where you're coming from on the analog vs digital terminology in regards to the bootleg code. It would be weird to give a digital item in place of an analog item, when the membership is called analog.  Maybe give us an additional code since we've waited so long instead of in place of the 7", as sort of a consolation prize in the meantime.
    And that's exactly why I already downgraded to digital. They can't fulfill the analog promise, so I'm not going to continue paying for it.  When they prove they can get their asses in gear and fulfill membership obligations within the year paid for, I'll go back. Until then, they can kiss my extra $20 a year goodbye. Sure, they won't miss my $20 on its own, but if everyone followed suit, maybe they'd take the hint. But too many people are complacent with the behavior and are ok with "I'll get it when I get it" instead of actually taking action about it.  "I'll get it when I get it" is no longer acceptible to me.


  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,649
    This issue has come up many times.

    They 'could' press a ton of singles and send them to their membership base in timely fashion (ensuring they have enough for new memberships as well); however, that would very likely result in overstock. So fair enough... wait until the year completes itself... and in January, press the number of singles you wish for and follow through on your commitment. Have the tracks, sleeve artwork, plant time, and anything else required to get the job done already arranged.

    There is a very workable solution for them if they were inclined to care about a solution. It's kind of obvious they do not. I am not saying they do not care about their fans when I say this. I'm just saying this issue is small on their priority list. It's obviously a pain in the ass for someone there.

    I'll keep paying for my membership. The single will come at some point- they always do. But I'll never hold my breath waiting for it.  
    not in 94. :lol:
  • Obviously they could plan it better if they felt they needed to.

    I believe the Christmas single is something they don't have any creative energy to do anymore, but are stuck with.
    The man they call my enemy. I've seen his eyes, he looks just like me - A mirror...
  • MilestoneMilestone Posts: 1,097
    I believe the Christmas single is something they don't have any creative energy to do anymore, but are stuck with.
    You may be right.  But how much trouble is it to just grab a song done at soundcheck?  Or some rare cover they did?  
    There's a couple of opportunities they could take from the Seattle 2018 shows.  "Let Me Sleep" live. Or perhaps "We're Gonna Be Friends"
    11-2-2000 Portland. 12-8-2002 Seattle. 4-18-2003 Nashville. 5-30-2003 Vancouver. 10-25-2003 Bridge School. 9-2-2005 Vancouver.
    7-6-2006 Las Vegas. 7-20-2006 Portland. 7-22-2006 Gorge. 9-21-2009 Seattle. 9-22-2009 Seattle. 9-26-2009 Ridgefield. 9-25-2011 Vancouver.
    11-29-2013 Portland. 10-16-2014 Detroit. 8-8-2018 Seattle. 8-10-2018 Seattle. 8-13-2018 Missoula.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,649
    Milestone said:
    I believe the Christmas single is something they don't have any creative energy to do anymore, but are stuck with.
    You may be right.  But how much trouble is it to just grab a song done at soundcheck?  Or some rare cover they did?  
    There's a couple of opportunities they could take from the Seattle 2018 shows.  "Let Me Sleep" live. Or perhaps "We're Gonna Be Friends"
    no, the live stuff was great pre-bootleg era. putting out a fan club single with content that is readily available would be about as lazy as it gets. 
  • Vedd HeddVedd Hedd Posts: 2,965
    Its kinda strange how they did vinyls in the 90s.....when vinyl was basically dead. And now that vinyl is back, its harder to get them pressed. Maybe more demand, but it just seems backward.
    Near to death.
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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,929
    Zod said:
    Yeah, I mean, since the "2016" single says 2017 on it and includes songs performed in 2017, can we just call it the 2017 single?  Give us all a bootleg code in place of 2016 and call it a day.
    I'd actually be really choked if they sent us a bootleg code instead.   The whole reason I pay the extra $30 for the Analog membership is the single.   I buy cd's for the shows I go to, so the code doesn't do much for me (and they nickel and dime you for FLAC downloads by making you pay an extra $5). 

    I'm ok if come out and say they're behind and going forward the single are going to stop.  I'd simply downgrade my membership to digital the next time it came around.   I think they should make good on the promises they have already made, and not retroactively substite an analog good for a digital one.  That's why it called the analog membership.

    I would like to start a petition to upgrade the code so it include FLAC for free.   We're Analog.  We like high quality.   Bandwidth isn't that expensive anymore.   The cost of offering flac isn't really that much more than mp3.   Why not allow the code to work on FLAC? :)
    Won't happen. It isn't about bandwidth or cost, its about getting that extra $5 on a download. 10c is a business, a very profitable one, and I don't see them giving out more freebies when people are willing to pay for it.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,929
    Milestone said:
    I believe the Christmas single is something they don't have any creative energy to do anymore, but are stuck with.
    You may be right.  But how much trouble is it to just grab a song done at soundcheck?  Or some rare cover they did?  
    There's a couple of opportunities they could take from the Seattle 2018 shows.  "Let Me Sleep" live. Or perhaps "We're Gonna Be Friends"
    no, the live stuff was great pre-bootleg era. putting out a fan club single with content that is readily available would be about as lazy as it gets. 
    Exactly.
    Except there's plenty of un-released shows they can use for decades.
    I'm sure there's probably licensing issues, but the 2 songs they did at The Who Rock Honors for VH1 would be  amazing (Love Reign O'er Me and The Real Me).
    Or just about anything from Wrigley 2013 and  PJ20
  • MilestoneMilestone Posts: 1,097
    I'm analog, in large part, because I like the hard copy of "Deep" magazine.  I also like the hardcopy 45's. I'm happy to pay the extra charge for an analog membership.  But honestly, I've lost track of what's going on and what I have not been sent.  To confuse things even more, my membership renewal is in December. I've never let it lapse since a 2002 blunder where I suddenly had 2 tenclub numbers.  I've always just sort of trusted that I'm getting sent my items.  I don't necessarily track it. I'm a little lost on it right now.....
    11-2-2000 Portland. 12-8-2002 Seattle. 4-18-2003 Nashville. 5-30-2003 Vancouver. 10-25-2003 Bridge School. 9-2-2005 Vancouver.
    7-6-2006 Las Vegas. 7-20-2006 Portland. 7-22-2006 Gorge. 9-21-2009 Seattle. 9-22-2009 Seattle. 9-26-2009 Ridgefield. 9-25-2011 Vancouver.
    11-29-2013 Portland. 10-16-2014 Detroit. 8-8-2018 Seattle. 8-10-2018 Seattle. 8-13-2018 Missoula.
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