Why did they boo Eddie?

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  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,024
    mace1229 said:
    They booed because he was talking / lecturing.  It's that simple. If we pay $100 for a music concert we want to here music.  

    We can hear our parents lecture us for free.

    Sing, Sing. Sing
    if you don't know what to expect at an EV/PJ show, then that's your own fault. 
    I know what to expect when I go in for a root canal. 
    Just because they know what to expect doesn't mean they have to be happy about it.

    I agree they have the right to say and do whatever they want. They've also earned it at this point. But I also see the point with ticket prices now approaching $100 each, and many spend 10 times that in travel expenses, they want to hear music and not a speech.
    It doesn't bother me and I don't boo, but I can understand why many would get annoyed or upset.
    The closest I came was during the first solo EV tour. EV wore that Bush mask and a guitar tech or someone came out dressed as the devil to give him a blow job. I personally wasn't offended, but I Just rolled my eyes because I didn't pay that money to watch Eddie act out a blow job. The thing went on long enough to have played another song, so I think it was fair to say I was annoyed. But I remember thinking if people were upset over those other incidents, I was surprised there wasn't a bigger reaction to that one. 

    You did pay to see Ed do whatever he wanted to do. You just created an expectation that didn’t match reality. 

    And you’re comparing a Pearl Jam show to a root canal? Zinger. 

    Oh, these chit chats with the crowd are also planned breaks. Sometimes they’re political, and sometimes they’re a story with a local connection. But MFC is bashing away for hours and the man needs a drink and to sit and chill. 
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,920
    mace1229 said:
    They booed because he was talking / lecturing.  It's that simple. If we pay $100 for a music concert we want to here music.  

    We can hear our parents lecture us for free.

    Sing, Sing. Sing
    if you don't know what to expect at an EV/PJ show, then that's your own fault. 
    I know what to expect when I go in for a root canal. 
    Just because they know what to expect doesn't mean they have to be happy about it.

    I agree they have the right to say and do whatever they want. They've also earned it at this point. But I also see the point with ticket prices now approaching $100 each, and many spend 10 times that in travel expenses, they want to hear music and not a speech.
    It doesn't bother me and I don't boo, but I can understand why many would get annoyed or upset.
    The closest I came was during the first solo EV tour. EV wore that Bush mask and a guitar tech or someone came out dressed as the devil to give him a blow job. I personally wasn't offended, but I Just rolled my eyes because I didn't pay that money to watch Eddie act out a blow job. The thing went on long enough to have played another song, so I think it was fair to say I was annoyed. But I remember thinking if people were upset over those other incidents, I was surprised there wasn't a bigger reaction to that one. 

    You did pay to see Ed do whatever he wanted to do. You just created an expectation that didn’t match reality. 

    And you’re comparing a Pearl Jam show to a root canal? Zinger. 

    Oh, these chit chats with the crowd are also planned breaks. Sometimes they’re political, and sometimes they’re a story with a local connection. But MFC is bashing away for hours and the man needs a drink and to sit and chill. 
    I didn't pay to see Eddie do whatever he wanted to do. I'm pretty sure if he stood there for an hour clipping his toe nails we'd all be entitled to our money back.
    I didn't compare a root canal to a PJ show. I was just saying I don't get how if I know what to expect, that still doesn't mean I can't be disappointed. I can attend 100 shows and know exactly what to expect, that still doesn't mean I can't cross my fingers and hope for no political talk, just as much as I can cross my fingers and hope they won't close with Indifference again. Knowing what to expect and hoping for my perfect show are two unrelated things.
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,024
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    They booed because he was talking / lecturing.  It's that simple. If we pay $100 for a music concert we want to here music.  

    We can hear our parents lecture us for free.

    Sing, Sing. Sing
    if you don't know what to expect at an EV/PJ show, then that's your own fault. 
    I know what to expect when I go in for a root canal. 
    Just because they know what to expect doesn't mean they have to be happy about it.

    I agree they have the right to say and do whatever they want. They've also earned it at this point. But I also see the point with ticket prices now approaching $100 each, and many spend 10 times that in travel expenses, they want to hear music and not a speech.
    It doesn't bother me and I don't boo, but I can understand why many would get annoyed or upset.
    The closest I came was during the first solo EV tour. EV wore that Bush mask and a guitar tech or someone came out dressed as the devil to give him a blow job. I personally wasn't offended, but I Just rolled my eyes because I didn't pay that money to watch Eddie act out a blow job. The thing went on long enough to have played another song, so I think it was fair to say I was annoyed. But I remember thinking if people were upset over those other incidents, I was surprised there wasn't a bigger reaction to that one. 

    You did pay to see Ed do whatever he wanted to do. You just created an expectation that didn’t match reality. 

    And you’re comparing a Pearl Jam show to a root canal? Zinger. 

    Oh, these chit chats with the crowd are also planned breaks. Sometimes they’re political, and sometimes they’re a story with a local connection. But MFC is bashing away for hours and the man needs a drink and to sit and chill. 
    I didn't pay to see Eddie do whatever he wanted to do. I'm pretty sure if he stood there for an hour clipping his toe nails we'd all be entitled to our money back.
    I didn't compare a root canal to a PJ show. I was just saying I don't get how if I know what to expect, that still doesn't mean I can't be disappointed. I can attend 100 shows and know exactly what to expect, that still doesn't mean I can't cross my fingers and hope for no political talk, just as much as I can cross my fingers and hope they won't close with Indifference again. Knowing what to expect and hoping for my perfect show are two unrelated things.
    You should factor in past behavior into your expectations. You know they are probably going to play Do the Evolution, and not play Strangest Tribe. There will be stage banter. This is guaranteed. You can set yourself up for disappointment if you want though.
     
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,582
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 16,652
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,024
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    How do you determine if someone who agrees with Ed is blind vs. able to see?
  • dignindignin Posts: 6,532
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Nah. If the band were not progressive I probably wouldn't be going to their shows because I probably wouldn't like the band that much. My love of PJ is very much tied to their activism.

    Simple fact is the art world tends to be progressive, that means I can be more picky than a conservative when it comes to what I can choose to enjoy. Conservatives don't have much to pick from so they have to settle...or listen to garbage like Ted Nugent and Toby Keith. 
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 43,410
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,920
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    They booed because he was talking / lecturing.  It's that simple. If we pay $100 for a music concert we want to here music.  

    We can hear our parents lecture us for free.

    Sing, Sing. Sing
    if you don't know what to expect at an EV/PJ show, then that's your own fault. 
    I know what to expect when I go in for a root canal. 
    Just because they know what to expect doesn't mean they have to be happy about it.

    I agree they have the right to say and do whatever they want. They've also earned it at this point. But I also see the point with ticket prices now approaching $100 each, and many spend 10 times that in travel expenses, they want to hear music and not a speech.
    It doesn't bother me and I don't boo, but I can understand why many would get annoyed or upset.
    The closest I came was during the first solo EV tour. EV wore that Bush mask and a guitar tech or someone came out dressed as the devil to give him a blow job. I personally wasn't offended, but I Just rolled my eyes because I didn't pay that money to watch Eddie act out a blow job. The thing went on long enough to have played another song, so I think it was fair to say I was annoyed. But I remember thinking if people were upset over those other incidents, I was surprised there wasn't a bigger reaction to that one. 

    You did pay to see Ed do whatever he wanted to do. You just created an expectation that didn’t match reality. 

    And you’re comparing a Pearl Jam show to a root canal? Zinger. 

    Oh, these chit chats with the crowd are also planned breaks. Sometimes they’re political, and sometimes they’re a story with a local connection. But MFC is bashing away for hours and the man needs a drink and to sit and chill. 
    I didn't pay to see Eddie do whatever he wanted to do. I'm pretty sure if he stood there for an hour clipping his toe nails we'd all be entitled to our money back.
    I didn't compare a root canal to a PJ show. I was just saying I don't get how if I know what to expect, that still doesn't mean I can't be disappointed. I can attend 100 shows and know exactly what to expect, that still doesn't mean I can't cross my fingers and hope for no political talk, just as much as I can cross my fingers and hope they won't close with Indifference again. Knowing what to expect and hoping for my perfect show are two unrelated things.
    You should factor in past behavior into your expectations. You know they are probably going to play Do the Evolution, and not play Strangest Tribe. There will be stage banter. This is guaranteed. You can set yourself up for disappointment if you want though.
     
    I agree.
    I just didn't agree with the previous comments that questioned why would you complain about a show when you know how it is going to turn out. Anyone is just as entitled to hope for the best and set themselves up for disappointment and complain about it afterwards as Ed has giving a political talk.
    It doesn't bother me. I Just find it funny that a lot of people jump on those who do complain about it, and complain about their reaction to Ed's speeches. When the same thing can be said about them, why would you come onto the AMT and continue to read threads about people being unhappy with certain aspects of the show and tell them they shouldn't complain about it because you should know what to expect. 
    If people want to be unhappy every minute Ed isn't singing a song, let them be unhappy about it.
  • KC138045KC138045 Columbus, OHPosts: 2,643
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    So your saying their success is tied to their liberal political views?  You think if they were republican they wouldn't be the band they are today? 
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  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 24,974
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    And his name would not be Ed, it wold be Ted.  :wink:
    "Love and only love will break it down"
    -Neil Young
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.





  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,024
    dignin said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Nah. If the band were not progressive I probably wouldn't be going to their shows because I probably wouldn't like the band that much. My love of PJ is very much tied to their activism.

    Simple fact is the art world tends to be progressive, that means I can be more picky than a conservative when it comes to what I can choose to enjoy. Conservatives don't have much to pick from so they have to settle...or listen to garbage like Ted Nugent and Toby Keith. 
    This reminds me of when I shared my theory in the PJ facebook group about the majority of artists and musicians being liberal because they fall higher on the empathy scale. Some conservatives there were super defensive, coming up with all kinds of things like artists just pose as liberals for marketing and show, and that it’s really about a 50/50 conservative liberal split. Also that conservatives make up half of Pearl Jam’s fan base. 
  • dignindignin Posts: 6,532
    KC138045 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    So your saying their success is tied to their liberal political views?  You think if they were republican they wouldn't be the band they are today? 
    Well, they would have to rewrite most of their songs for a start.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,582
    edited January 11
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    my point is that people, in my opinion, aren't complaining about the fact that he does banter, they are complaining about the content of said banter. so it's not "moot". 
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,582
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    How do you determine if someone who agrees with Ed is blind vs. able to see?
    all celebrities have SOME blind followers, and this band is different. mcgruff was not saying that all people who agree with ed are sheep. just some. 
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,582
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    the band wouldn't exist? how can one possibly come to that conclusion?
  • dignindignin Posts: 6,532
    dignin said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Nah. If the band were not progressive I probably wouldn't be going to their shows because I probably wouldn't like the band that much. My love of PJ is very much tied to their activism.

    Simple fact is the art world tends to be progressive, that means I can be more picky than a conservative when it comes to what I can choose to enjoy. Conservatives don't have much to pick from so they have to settle...or listen to garbage like Ted Nugent and Toby Keith. 
    This reminds me of when I shared my theory in the PJ facebook group about the majority of artists and musicians being liberal because they fall higher on the empathy scale. Some conservatives there were super defensive, coming up with all kinds of things like artists just pose as liberals for marketing and show, and that it’s really about a 50/50 conservative liberal split. Also that conservatives make up half of Pearl Jam’s fan base. 
    Those conservatives obviously don't know shit about the art community.
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 16,652
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    How do you determine if someone who agrees with Ed is blind vs. able to see?
    all celebrities have SOME blind followers, and this band is different. mcgruff was not saying that all people who agree with ed are sheep. just some. 
    correct, that was my point.  we definitely have some blind followers on the boards and you can definitely see some at shows.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 43,410
    edited January 11
    KC138045 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    So your saying their success is tied to their liberal political views?  You think if they were republican they wouldn't be the band they are today? 
    Well yeah. I mean, I really said I believe that their success is tied to Eddie's liberal political views, because the rest of the band is also liberal, and I definitely don't think they would have gone along the same path if Eddie wasn't liberal as well. But let's say they were all republican.... there is no way they would have found that success or gone down the same road at all because all their music would have been way different, their vibe would have been way different. I think their fate was built on a very thin and perfect platform, and it could have easily toppled one way or the other if things hadn't gone precisely the way they did ... Think of it in terms of the butterfly effect. Do you really think Ten would have been Ten if all the stars hadn't aligned they way they did and the band didn't have the core beliefs that they happen to have? I don't. And without Ten being Ten, the band would have likely faded into obscurity before it ever got off the ground, if they even found each other in the first place, which they probably wouldn't have. Besides, what massive 90s Seattle grunge bands do you know with a massive rise to fame and huge fan base who were led by Republicans? Lol. It wouldn't have worked. The whole Seattle sound wave was a liberal thing, or anti-establishment, don't you think?
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,024
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    How do you determine if someone who agrees with Ed is blind vs. able to see?
    all celebrities have SOME blind followers, and this band is different. mcgruff was not saying that all people who agree with ed are sheep. just some. 
    correct, that was my point.  we definitely have some blind followers on the boards and you can definitely see some at shows.
    That’s what I’m wondering. How do you decide who is a blind follower and who isn’t?
  • KC138045KC138045 Columbus, OHPosts: 2,643
    PJ_Soul said:
    KC138045 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    So your saying their success is tied to their liberal political views?  You think if they were republican they wouldn't be the band they are today? 
    Well yeah. I mean, I really said I believe that their success is tied to Eddie's liberal political views, because the rest of the band is also liberal, and I definitely don't think they would have gone along the same path if Eddie wasn't liberal as well. But let's say they were all republican.... there is no way they would have found that success or gone down the same road at all because all their music would have been way different, their vibe would have been way different. I think their fate was built on a very thin and perfect platform, and it could have easily toppled one way or the other if things hadn't gone precisely the way they did ... Think of it in terms of the butterfly effect. Do you really think Ten would have been Ten if all the stars hadn't aligned they way they did and the band didn't have the core beliefs that they happen to have? I don't. And without Ten being Ten, the band would have likely faded into obscurity before it ever got off the ground, if they even found each other in the first place, which they probably wouldn't have.
    I guess I've never thought about it like that and you make an interesting point for sure.

    For me I'm a fan of the music first and foremost.  I consider myself a centrist politically but tend to lean more right on a lot of social issues.  Ed and the band being liberal does not bother me and I don't mind his rants as I've come to expect him.  I also don't have an issue with the incident that started this thread.  They played a politically charged song that some in the audience didn't appreciate and Ed let them respond and react to it.  I remember the outcry when this happened and I personally thought it was blown out of proportion then and apparently still is.
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  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,582
    PJ_Soul said:
    KC138045 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    So your saying their success is tied to their liberal political views?  You think if they were republican they wouldn't be the band they are today? 
    Well yeah. I mean, I really said I believe that their success is tied to Eddie's liberal political views, because the rest of the band is also liberal, and I definitely don't think they would have gone along the same path if Eddie wasn't liberal as well. But let's say they were all republican.... there is no way they would have found that success or gone down the same road at all because all their music would have been way different, their vibe would have been way different. I think their fate was built on a very thin and perfect platform, and it could have easily toppled one way or the other if things hadn't gone precisely the way they did ... Think of it in terms of the butterfly effect. Do you really think Ten would have been Ten if all the stars hadn't aligned they way they did and the band didn't have the core beliefs that they happen to have? I don't. And without Ten being Ten, the band would have likely faded into obscurity before it ever got off the ground, if they even found each other in the first place, which they probably wouldn't have. Besides, what massive 90s Seattle grunge bands do you know with a massive rise to fame and huge fan base who were led by Republicans? Lol. It wouldn't have worked. The whole Seattle sound wave was a liberal thing, or anti-establishment, don't you think?
    I didn't think it was liberal. I didn't think it was political at all to begin with. it was anti-establishment, disaffected youth. but that's not the same. punk rock can be left or right. 

    kurt cobain owned a lot of guns and beat his wife. that ain't liberal in my mind. 
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 16,652
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    How do you determine if someone who agrees with Ed is blind vs. able to see?
    all celebrities have SOME blind followers, and this band is different. mcgruff was not saying that all people who agree with ed are sheep. just some. 
    correct, that was my point.  we definitely have some blind followers on the boards and you can definitely see some at shows.
    That’s what I’m wondering. How do you decide who is a blind follower and who isn’t?
    It involves a very complicated algorithm ; it's just too hard to explain on a message board.  It is way easier to discuss over a few beers at a pre-party event before a pj show.  There it will become clear.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,582
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    How do you determine if someone who agrees with Ed is blind vs. able to see?
    all celebrities have SOME blind followers, and this band is different. mcgruff was not saying that all people who agree with ed are sheep. just some. 
    correct, that was my point.  we definitely have some blind followers on the boards and you can definitely see some at shows.
    That’s what I’m wondering. How do you decide who is a blind follower and who isn’t?
    It involves a very complicated algorithm ; it's just too hard to explain on a message board.  It is way easier to discuss over a few beers at a pre-party event before a pj show.  There it will become clear.
    you can see it in their glossed over look in their eyes. LOL
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New JerseyPosts: 16,652
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    How do you determine if someone who agrees with Ed is blind vs. able to see?
    all celebrities have SOME blind followers, and this band is different. mcgruff was not saying that all people who agree with ed are sheep. just some. 
    correct, that was my point.  we definitely have some blind followers on the boards and you can definitely see some at shows.
    That’s what I’m wondering. How do you decide who is a blind follower and who isn’t?
    It involves a very complicated algorithm ; it's just too hard to explain on a message board.  It is way easier to discuss over a few beers at a pre-party event before a pj show.  There it will become clear.
    you can see it in their glossed over look in their eyes. LOL
    You know the look!!! lol
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • riley540riley540 Bellingham WAPosts: 871
    dignin said:
    dignin said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Nah. If the band were not progressive I probably wouldn't be going to their shows because I probably wouldn't like the band that much. My love of PJ is very much tied to their activism.

    Simple fact is the art world tends to be progressive, that means I can be more picky than a conservative when it comes to what I can choose to enjoy. Conservatives don't have much to pick from so they have to settle...or listen to garbage like Ted Nugent and Toby Keith. 
    This reminds me of when I shared my theory in the PJ facebook group about the majority of artists and musicians being liberal because they fall higher on the empathy scale. Some conservatives there were super defensive, coming up with all kinds of things like artists just pose as liberals for marketing and show, and that it’s really about a 50/50 conservative liberal split. Also that conservatives make up half of Pearl Jam’s fan base. 
    Those conservatives obviously don't know shit about the art community.
    I am a person that leans more right, and I am super involved in the arts. I love movies, and movie poster artwork from the 1910s - 1980s, and am an avid art collector. I think the arts are important and will always survive and outlive other industries. I think people on the right can like Pearl Jam because they make killer music and put on great concerts. I love Charlton Heston, and not because of him being a republican, but becasuevthe dude could act!!! Lots of people love the Arts from all walks of life. Gotta talk to more people outside your bubble! 
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,024
    riley540 said:
    dignin said:
    dignin said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Nah. If the band were not progressive I probably wouldn't be going to their shows because I probably wouldn't like the band that much. My love of PJ is very much tied to their activism.

    Simple fact is the art world tends to be progressive, that means I can be more picky than a conservative when it comes to what I can choose to enjoy. Conservatives don't have much to pick from so they have to settle...or listen to garbage like Ted Nugent and Toby Keith. 
    This reminds me of when I shared my theory in the PJ facebook group about the majority of artists and musicians being liberal because they fall higher on the empathy scale. Some conservatives there were super defensive, coming up with all kinds of things like artists just pose as liberals for marketing and show, and that it’s really about a 50/50 conservative liberal split. Also that conservatives make up half of Pearl Jam’s fan base. 
    Those conservatives obviously don't know shit about the art community.
    I am a person that leans more right, and I am super involved in the arts. I love movies, and movie poster artwork from the 1910s - 1980s, and am an avid art collector. I think the arts are important and will always survive and outlive other industries. I think people on the right can like Pearl Jam because they make killer music and put on great concerts. I love Charlton Heston, and not because of him being a republican, but becasuevthe dude could act!!! Lots of people love the Arts from all walks of life. Gotta talk to more people outside your bubble! 
    It’s not a bubble and who likes art and music (which is nearly everyone). It’s about artitsts
    and musicians themselves. They tend to be overwhemingly liberal. 
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 15,582
    riley540 said:
    dignin said:
    dignin said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Nah. If the band were not progressive I probably wouldn't be going to their shows because I probably wouldn't like the band that much. My love of PJ is very much tied to their activism.

    Simple fact is the art world tends to be progressive, that means I can be more picky than a conservative when it comes to what I can choose to enjoy. Conservatives don't have much to pick from so they have to settle...or listen to garbage like Ted Nugent and Toby Keith. 
    This reminds me of when I shared my theory in the PJ facebook group about the majority of artists and musicians being liberal because they fall higher on the empathy scale. Some conservatives there were super defensive, coming up with all kinds of things like artists just pose as liberals for marketing and show, and that it’s really about a 50/50 conservative liberal split. Also that conservatives make up half of Pearl Jam’s fan base. 
    Those conservatives obviously don't know shit about the art community.
    I am a person that leans more right, and I am super involved in the arts. I love movies, and movie poster artwork from the 1910s - 1980s, and am an avid art collector. I think the arts are important and will always survive and outlive other industries. I think people on the right can like Pearl Jam because they make killer music and put on great concerts. I love Charlton Heston, and not because of him being a republican, but becasuevthe dude could act!!! Lots of people love the Arts from all walks of life. Gotta talk to more people outside your bubble! 
    obviously there are right-leaning folks that still love the arts. there is no question about that. he is responding to the conservatives who claim it is a 50/50 split across the board and with PJ's fan base. that is a downright hilarious claim. 
  • RoleModelsinBlood31RoleModelsinBlood31 Austin TXPosts: 4,228
    Awesome thread.  Interesting stuff and a great read.  I loved the band before I ever got into politics and was liberal for a long time before leaning right during Obama’s second term, having voted democrat until this last election even.  The Nassau madness/fan reaction was entirely expected, I feel like someone said above that it wasn’t at all that the playing of bushleaguer was a poor choice or anything like that, it was just the aggressive mask theatrics that pissed people off.  Not the what but the how I guess.  I’m still glad they did it and never have a problem with Ed doing what Ed does politically speaking at the shows, I don’t agree with the content nowadays like I used to, but more power to him to speak his mind.  

    As far as the USA chant stuff, I honestly never thought of it like folks on here are saying!  It was always kind of sarcastic and funny and done at sporting events when you were hammered and having a laugh.  People wearing American flag bathing suits and crap like that at 4th of July pool parties and chanting USA while boozing it up and shooting fireworks was kind of how I always was involved in it. Guess I learned something about how international folks see it though for sure!
    I'm like an opening band for your mom.
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 24,974
    PJ_Soul said:
    KC138045 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    one thing to note......I haven't heard one democrat complain about Ed's banter. If he was pro-Bush or pro-any republican, I'm pretty sure the complainers would be from a different side. 
    Solid point Hugh. And unfortunately you have a hell of a lot of "blind" followers of Eddie.
    I'm not a blind follower of anything... and if Eddie were pro-Bush or republican I don't think the band would even exist, let alone have a huge liberal fan base, so it's a moot point, not a solid one.
    So your saying their success is tied to their liberal political views?  You think if they were republican they wouldn't be the band they are today? 
    Well yeah. I mean, I really said I believe that their success is tied to Eddie's liberal political views, because the rest of the band is also liberal, and I definitely don't think they would have gone along the same path if Eddie wasn't liberal as well. But let's say they were all republican.... there is no way they would have found that success or gone down the same road at all because all their music would have been way different, their vibe would have been way different. I think their fate was built on a very thin and perfect platform, and it could have easily toppled one way or the other if things hadn't gone precisely the way they did ... Think of it in terms of the butterfly effect. Do you really think Ten would have been Ten if all the stars hadn't aligned they way they did and the band didn't have the core beliefs that they happen to have? I don't. And without Ten being Ten, the band would have likely faded into obscurity before it ever got off the ground, if they even found each other in the first place, which they probably wouldn't have. Besides, what massive 90s Seattle grunge bands do you know with a massive rise to fame and huge fan base who were led by Republicans? Lol. It wouldn't have worked. The whole Seattle sound wave was a liberal thing, or anti-establishment, don't you think?
    I didn't think it was liberal. I didn't think it was political at all to begin with. it was anti-establishment, disaffected youth. but that's not the same. punk rock can be left or right. 

    kurt cobain owned a lot of guns and beat his wife. that ain't liberal in my mind. 
    That's what I was thinking as well.  I never saw Ten being political at all.  That early period was more about being wild and crazy, loaded,  bare-chested, and performing with bravado and a certain amount of foolhardiness.  Great stuff when you yourself are young and reckless, but not so impressive (to me) when you mature.  As their albums progressed, political leanings began to show but not strongly until Riot Act. And even then, it's not like the whole album is a musical political platform. Only a couple of songs have an obviously political focus.  And it's not like the live shows were political conventions.   I personally very much like the bits of politics found in RA but that's not at all the sole reason it's one of my very favorite PJ albums.  I just think overall it's one of their more mature albums in terms of writing, execution and commitment to excellence.  

    But Bu$hleaguer?  Yeah, that's a great political performance piece.  Doing that song any other way would make no sense.  I you think about it, getting so pissed off about it as to boo a live performance makes no sense. 
    "Love and only love will break it down"
    -Neil Young
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.





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