The Concept of God

amethgr8

Just about got it down to God, Jesus, Moses, Noah and some others were extraterrestrials, and some of the events thereof.

goldrush

HughFreakingDillon said:

RYME said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

FoxyRedLa said:

I'm not even certain the site is reputable. Just thought I'd share.

I've been taking everyone's opinion/thoughts/views into consideration and have been thinking a lot. Been thinking about my kids. As usual.

yeah. I had never seen that site before, so i was wary of the content as well. my comment wasn't directed at you, more the content of the article. if an atheist doesn't believe in god, why would they take this book as confirmation that jesus didn't get crucified? and yet, he went to heaven while still alive. how the hell does that work?

The Trinity isn't that complicated.
The Father, The Son (Jesus) & The Holy Spirit.  Yes they are all one and the same. It's like ice, steam, and water.  It's all H2O just in different formes.

actually, it is complicated. or rather, nonsensical. if they are all one, why do they each talk to each other as if they were separate? and if god is jesus and jesus is god, how does jesus' existence shield god from the sins of man, if the shield IS god?

why did god have to have a son when he previously just spoke directly to humans, like he did with moses and noah? all of a sudden he's too busy so he gets a subordinate to represent him? I would think a voice from the clouds would be more convincing than just some everyday dude in a robe and sandals preaching this new fan-dangled doctrine that pissed off the locals. 

and then he "sacrificed his only begotten son"? if he's him, he's not his son, he's him. and he didn't sacrifice anything if Jesus is in heaven with him. 

it's really a ludicrous premise in my mind. 

I had to read that a few times, it made me dizzy!
Which goes to show how nonsensical it all is.

RYME

I don't know where in the Bible God is talking to Jesus or vice versa or Himself.  Never seen it.  Jesus is God In the Flesh (Emmanuel God With Us) (Yashua-YHVH's Savior, our Messiah.)
And Jesus did not die on the cross for Himself or for God, He is God.  He did it for you!! Not for Himself. He paid the price for the whole worlds sins all at once on Himself.  And He paid an awesome price. Trying to make it easy for us. Whereby if we accept this gift from Him & repent, we get everlasting life with Him in heaven after this flesh life that we are in.  Hence, John 3:16

HughFreakingDillon

RYME said:

I don't know where in the Bible God is talking to Jesus or vice versa or Himself.  Never seen it.  Jesus is God In the Flesh (Emmanuel God With Us) (Yashua-YHVH's Savior, our Messiah.)
And Jesus did not die on the cross for Himself or for God, He is God.  He did it for you!! Not for Himself. He paid the price for the whole worlds sins all at once on Himself.  And He paid an awesome price. Trying to make it easy for us. Whereby if we accept this gift from Him & repent, we get everlasting life with Him in heaven after this flesh life that we are in.  Hence, John 3:16

but jesus refers to god as a different entity. he calls him his father, not another version of himself. 

but why did he need to die to protect us from himself?

brianlux

Jesus is the Son, God is the Father, Jesus is God, The Holy Spirit is God...  I think there is only one way to explain this conundrum:

Shyner

It's like the rain falls and you don't question with word but in spirit something unseen is happening. 

                                 The mountain structure and the rivers that were dammed should be proof of something bigger going on and i speak to the non believers of gods spirit within us not to convince but to console even though there's an argument not needed itself. For we don't want to be consoled we want to be free to think our own way. 
            The concept of god is great for humanity and with death at every intersection of life It's comforting to rise up spiritually and accept the gift within us that we are perfect as gods creation just the way wer meant to be. We are all jesus spirit. 
   Go now and love your dog cat chicken etc for peace is coming soon. 

Annafalk

I'm not normally a preacher but I think these words are beautiful;

…All things have been entrusted to Me by My Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him. 28Come toMe, all you who are weary andburdened, and I will give you rest.29Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me; for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.

rgambs

RYME said:

I don't know where in the Bible God is talking to Jesus or vice versa or Himself.  Never seen it.  Jesus is God In the Flesh (Emmanuel God With Us) (Yashua-YHVH's Savior, our Messiah.)
And Jesus did not die on the cross for Himself or for God, He is God.  He did it for you!! Not for Himself. He paid the price for the whole worlds sins all at once on Himself.  And He paid an awesome price. Trying to make it easy for us. Whereby if we accept this gift from Him & repent, we get everlasting life with Him in heaven after this flesh life that we are in.  Hence, John 3:16

I think you must be lying.
You've shown a pretty thorough grasp on the Bible, but now, all of a sudden, you don't recall the Garden of Gethsemane or his doubt on the cross?

jeffbr

rgambs said:

RYME said:

I don't know where in the Bible God is talking to Jesus or vice versa or Himself.  Never seen it.  Jesus is God In the Flesh (Emmanuel God With Us) (Yashua-YHVH's Savior, our Messiah.)
And Jesus did not die on the cross for Himself or for God, He is God.  He did it for you!! Not for Himself. He paid the price for the whole worlds sins all at once on Himself.  And He paid an awesome price. Trying to make it easy for us. Whereby if we accept this gift from Him & repent, we get everlasting life with Him in heaven after this flesh life that we are in.  Hence, John 3:16

I think you must be lying.
You've shown a pretty thorough grasp on the Bible, but now, all of a sudden, you don't recall the Garden of Gethsemane or his doubt on the cross?

Exactly. I don't understand. John 3:16 was quoted by RYME, but in that it is say "For God so loved the world that he sent his only begotten Son..." So did he send a separate entity (his son?) or did he send himself? And why in Matthew 27:46 did Jesus say "My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Was Jesus talking to God, the father? Or was he talking to himself? Did he forsake himself? And back to John, in John 14:6 why does it say "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."? It sounds like Christ is the intermediary between us and God, but I thought some of you were claiming that they're one in the same. How does that work?

PJ_Soul

The Holy Trinity is not in the Bible - that word is never mentioned. It was a concept formalized a few Centuries after the last books in the Bible were written. That is why the Holy Trinity is so hard - impossible, in fact - to explain. Those who came up with it were attempting to reconcile what seemed to them the different faces of God... and they did a poor job of it. That never stopped them from teaching the doctrine though, especially since it is what largely distinguished the Roman Catholic Church from other sects of Christianity - this was an important factor in building its control over the population and identifying those outside of it.

RYME

jeffbr said:

rgambs said:

RYME said:

I don't know where in the Bible God is talking to Jesus or vice versa or Himself.  Never seen it.  Jesus is God In the Flesh (Emmanuel God With Us) (Yashua-YHVH's Savior, our Messiah.)
And Jesus did not die on the cross for Himself or for God, He is God.  He did it for you!! Not for Himself. He paid the price for the whole worlds sins all at once on Himself.  And He paid an awesome price. Trying to make it easy for us. Whereby if we accept this gift from Him & repent, we get everlasting life with Him in heaven after this flesh life that we are in.  Hence, John 3:16

I think you must be lying.
You've shown a pretty thorough grasp on the Bible, but now, all of a sudden, you don't recall the Garden of Gethsemane or his doubt on the cross?

Exactly. I don't understand. John 3:16 was quoted by RYME, but in that it is say "For God so loved the world that he sent his only begotten Son..." So did he send a separate entity (his son?) or did he send himself? And why in Matthew 27:46 did Jesus say "My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Was Jesus talking to God, the father? Or was he talking to himself? Did he forsake himself? And back to John, in John 14:6 why does it say "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."? It sounds like Christ is the intermediary between us and God, but I thought some of you were claiming that they're one in the same. How does that work?

I do not claim to know it all. I'm constantly trying to learn more. But regarding my God my God why hast Thou forsaken me?  Jesus was quoting David from Psalms 22.  He wasn't crying out to God in agony, or despair. He was showing that his prophecies from Psalms 22 was being fulfilled. David was discouraged at that time crying my God my God why has Thou forsaken me. And as the chapter continues the foretelling of the crucifixion is spelled out. 1000 years before the crucifixion. So by quoting David on the cross He's retelling Psalm 22.  When addressing God Jesus always referred to him as the Father.
Good questions, I enjoy being challenged.  Again I don't claim to know it all and I am not immune from mistakes.https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm+22&version=KJV
So hopefully you will read Psalms 22 here and then reread the Matthew 27 and you'll have more clarity when in the ninth hour Jesus was saying my God my God why hast Thou forsaken me?

Annafalk

Maybe God wanted Jesus to feel how humans feel when they are in agony to get the understanding to feel totally alone and abandoned.

PJPOWER

Oops

Annafalk

PJPOWER said:

Oops

Oops ? Please tell!

HughFreakingDillon

Annafalk said:

PJPOWER said:

Oops

Oops ? Please tell!

he thought Hillary was god. 

Annafalk

HughFreakingDillon said:

Annafalk said:

PJPOWER said:

Oops

Oops ? Please tell!

he thought Hillary was god. 

Lol,

jeffbr

RYME said:

jeffbr said:

rgambs said:

RYME said:

I don't know where in the Bible God is talking to Jesus or vice versa or Himself.  Never seen it.  Jesus is God In the Flesh (Emmanuel God With Us) (Yashua-YHVH's Savior, our Messiah.)
And Jesus did not die on the cross for Himself or for God, He is God.  He did it for you!! Not for Himself. He paid the price for the whole worlds sins all at once on Himself.  And He paid an awesome price. Trying to make it easy for us. Whereby if we accept this gift from Him & repent, we get everlasting life with Him in heaven after this flesh life that we are in.  Hence, John 3:16

I think you must be lying.
You've shown a pretty thorough grasp on the Bible, but now, all of a sudden, you don't recall the Garden of Gethsemane or his doubt on the cross?

Exactly. I don't understand. John 3:16 was quoted by RYME, but in that it is say "For God so loved the world that he sent his only begotten Son..." So did he send a separate entity (his son?) or did he send himself? And why in Matthew 27:46 did Jesus say "My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Was Jesus talking to God, the father? Or was he talking to himself? Did he forsake himself? And back to John, in John 14:6 why does it say "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."? It sounds like Christ is the intermediary between us and God, but I thought some of you were claiming that they're one in the same. How does that work?

I do not claim to know it all. I'm constantly trying to learn more. But regarding my God my God why hast Thou forsaken me?  Jesus was quoting David from Psalms 22.  He wasn't crying out to God in agony, or despair. He was showing that his prophecies from Psalms 22 was being fulfilled. David was discouraged at that time crying my God my God why has Thou forsaken me. And as the chapter continues the foretelling of the crucifixion is spelled out. 1000 years before the crucifixion. So by quoting David on the cross He's retelling Psalm 22.  When addressing God Jesus always referred to him as the Father.
Good questions, I enjoy being challenged.  Again I don't claim to know it all and I am not immune from mistakes.https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm+22&version=KJV

Not trying to be nitpicky, but I think it goes directly to what I was confused about. Can you reconcile your two statements that I bolded? It has caused me further confusion.

RYME

This is good.  Your not nitpicking.  You are looking for legit answers.
I am not a pastor I'm not a preacher. But as you can tell I am a grateful believer. So I try to help people if they want, come to a better understanding. And when I do not have the correct words to say, I look for a place where it is explained very well.
I found this and maybe this will help you.
I hope it helps you or anyone reading this.
https://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-pray-God.html

Smellyman

There is no 'Legit answers' when it is make believe

brianlux

This thread has been around awhile (and believe me, I have nothing against anything that has been around awhile), so every now and then I like to go back to HFD's original question:

"so basically the point of this thread is not to argue about faith, or try to convince someone else that you are right or they are wrong. just, what do you think god is, if you believe a god exists?"

It's interesting that the discussion keeps going back to talking about the Christian God and Jesus and the Bible.  Can we clarify again, HFD, is that what the topic is?  Or is it literally what you  stated as in, the general concept of "a god"?

True, most who discuss on this forum are westerners and therefor most are more familiar with the Christian concept of God, but (assuming anyone else cares), I wouldn't mind hearing about what people think of the more general concept of "a god". 

For me, the concept of "god" is a bit of a conundrum because I tend to think that if there is a god, that god is undefinable in human terms and encompasses all that we cannot understand which means god (or God) is simply that which we have yet, if ever, to discover and be able to quantify, identify and understand.  It's like looking at a sealed box and wondering if there is something in it and if so, what is it and can we ever understand what it is?

And I should add, I'm very OK with the idea that there may be things we don't can't and never will be understand.  The universe without some mystery would seem a far more coldly academic without a bit of mystery to spice things up.

Smellyman

The concept of god(s) was created by man to explain the unexplained and gives comfort to those who need the explanation.

brianlux

Smellyman said:

The concept of god(s) was created by man to explain the unexplained and gives comfort to those who need the explanation.

Jeez!  Now see?  Why can't I say basically the same thing in 21 words instead of 220?

PJ_Soul

Smellyman said:

The concept of god(s) was created by man to explain the unexplained and gives comfort to those who need the explanation.

Yep.

amethgr8

most religions have a "god", diety that dictates everything or at least establishes a set of "rules" for humanity.  why is christianity any more believable than other religions?  seems they all saw what they saw back then, groups of people wrote their own "book".  it's hard for me to understand how someone can be so sure that their interpretation of "god" is more valid than the other.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Smellyman said:

The concept of god(s) was created by man to explain the unexplained and gives comfort to those who need the explanation.

A lucrative industry as well.

Did a fantastic job of controlling the masses back in the day: toil in the soil and never question... you will be rewarded for doing so with a fantastic next life... now pour me more wine and bring me your daughter.

People are eager to beieve things when they are linked to good fortune. Look how many people give away their money to scam artists promising riches... as ludicrous as the petty scams are. Promising eternal life? Now 'that' is a license to make money.

RYME

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Smellyman said:

The concept of god(s) was created by man to explain the unexplained and gives comfort to those who need the explanation.

A lucrative industry as well.

Did a fantastic job of controlling the masses back in the day: toil in the soil and never question... you will be rewarded for doing so with a fantastic next life... now pour me more wine and bring me your daughter.

People are eager to beieve things when they are linked to good fortune. Look how many people give away their money to scam artists promising riches... as ludicrous as the petty scams are. Promising eternal life? Now 'that' is a license to make money.

Who is getting rich from me believing what I believe?  I'm not paying anyone.  I've already mentioned what I think about churches that pass around the offering plate first thing begging for money.  Christianity is
 a way of life for me.  To each his/her own.  And I throw away all the shit that I get in the mail that telling me that I won a free car with a key even taped to the letter.  Or something telling me that I've been selected for a free cruise ship vacation.
And if you think that I live in the neighborhood of make believe, that there is no God and that it's all made up bs, grasping for what ever comforts, hey I've got some ocean front property in Arizona that I'd like to $ell you.  From the front porch you can $ee the $ea it's fantastic!
Just a little bit of my dry humor, don't take that to seriously.

amethgr8

Again, what makes the "god" of christianity any more real than the "god" of any other given religion?  because it is what one was taught.  If you were brought up with buddhism, that is what you believe.

brianlux

amethgr8 said:

Again, what makes the "god" of christianity any more real than the "god" of any other given religion?  because it is what one was taught.  If you were brought up with buddhism, that is what you believe.

My understanding is that Buddhists don't believe in God and that for them how you practice your faith is more important than what you believe.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

brianlux said:

amethgr8 said:

Again, what makes the "god" of christianity any more real than the "god" of any other given religion?  because it is what one was taught.  If you were brought up with buddhism, that is what you believe.

My understanding is that Buddhists don't believe in God and that for them how you practice your faith is more important than what you believe.

How everything is interrelated and knowing one's place in the universe co-existing with everything else in the universe.

That is what I have come to understand of Buddhists (condensed version... and at the risk of being wrong).

amethgr8

I was just using buddhism as an example.

most of this discussion, whether god exists, is the god that exists in christianity.  lot of belief systems have a diety, like a god.