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Mirrorball+Merkinball

thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
edited April 2017 in The Porch
I love Neil Young's Merkinball (Pearl Jam is his backing band on this 1995 album for those who don't know). I also love I Got Id (or ID, Shit, etc.) and Long Road which were two songs both cut from Mirrorball, but ended up on Pearl Jam's own Merkinball.

Question 1. Would Mirrorball have been stronger with the inclusion of the two Merkinball tracks with Ed's vocals? (I Got Id and Long Road - Peace and Love also has Ed's vocals)
Question 2. Can we consider Mirrorball a Pearl Jam album in spirit, or strictly a Neil Young album?
ZF0 on SoundCloud

Post edited by thispureamericanriot on
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    Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 28,979
    thispureamericanriot said:

    I love Neil Young's Merkinball (Pearl Jam is his backing band on this 1995 album for those who don't know). I also love I Got Id (or ID, Shit, etc.) and Long Road which were two songs both cut from Mirrorball, but ended up on Pearl Jam's own Merkinball.

    Question 1. Would Mirrorball have been stronger with the inclusion of the two Merkinball tracks with Ed's vocals? (I Got Id and Long Road - Peace and Love also has Ed's vocals)
    Question 2. Can we consider Mirrorball a Pearl Jam album in spirit, or strictly a Neil Young album?

    Q1
    Personally, I think they differ in style to the NY tracks. Maybe with Eddie singing more on the Mirrorball-tracks it would fit more. Was any songs recorded during this sessions that didn't end up on the album or EP?

    Q2
    Collab and/or Neil Young album. I never consider it a PJ album.

    Q3
    Yes, they should record a follow up. And yes, Neil Youngs Living with War from 2006(?) would have been a great follow up project.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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    NewJPageNewJPage Posts: 3,300
    The ed songs were supposed to be on the record, but record company said no. Wouldn't even let the name Pearl Jam be used anywhere on the record.
    6/26/98, 8/17/00, 10/8/00, 12/8/02, 12/9/02, 4/25/03, 5/28/03, 6/1/03, 6/3/03, 6/5/03, 6/6/03, 6/12/03, 6/13/03, 6/15/03, 6/18/03, 6/21/03, 6/22/03, 7/12/03, 7/14/03, 10/3/04, 10/5/04, 9/9/05, 9/11/05, 9/16/05, 5/16/06, 5/17/06, 5/19/06, 6/30/06, 7/23/06, 8/5/07, 6/30/08, 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 5/4/10, 5/7/10, 9/3/11, 9/4/11, 10/11/13, 10/17/14, 8/20/16
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    ZodZod Posts: 10,148
    I feel it's like ToTD. Its Pearl Jam with a different front man. So it's really not PJ.

    It is pretty cool that we have a few albums where completely different people front the same band though :)
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    thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
    NewJPage said:

    The ed songs were supposed to be on the record, but record company said no. Wouldn't even let the name Pearl Jam be used anywhere on the record.

    Any reason given for this? I would reckon the PJ name would have helped in promotions and help to sell more records?
    ZF0 on SoundCloud

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    brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,711
    edited April 2017
    thispureamericanriot said:

    I love Neil Young's Merkinball (Pearl Jam is his backing band on this 1995 album for those who don't know). I also love I Got Id (or ID, Shit, etc.) and Long Road which were two songs both cut from Mirrorball, but ended up on Pearl Jam's own Merkinball.

    Question 1. Would Mirrorball have been stronger with the inclusion of the two Merkinball tracks with Ed's vocals? (I Got Id and Long Road - Peace and Love also has Ed's vocals)
    Question 2. Can we consider Mirrorball a Pearl Jam album in spirit, or strictly a Neil Young album?

    1. I agree with Spiritual_Chaos in that they are different enough in style to be separate. The only think would have (and still would!) do is put Merkinball out on 12" 45 RPM vinyl. My little 7" (the only one I've found at a somewhat reasonable price was used- wish I'd bought it when it came out!) is a bit scratchy- but I love it anyway!

    2. It's great that Pearl Jam got the opportunity to back Neil on Mirrorball (and I imagine they both felt that way) but the songs are Young's, it was his concept, he was giving the band a big boost by giving them the opportunity to work with him, so my belief is that Mirorball stands as it should as a Neil Young album. If it were not for record contract constrictions, I'm sure Young would have given more direct credit for the backing band than he was able to.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
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    Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 28,979
    thispureamericanriot said:

    NewJPage said:

    The ed songs were supposed to be on the record, but record company said no. Wouldn't even let the name Pearl Jam be used anywhere on the record.

    Any reason given for this? I would reckon the PJ name would have helped in promotions and help to sell more records?
    Different record lables I think.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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    thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
    Zod said:

    I feel it's like ToTD. Its Pearl Jam with a different front man. So it's really not PJ.

    It is pretty cool that we have a few albums where completely different people front the same band though :)

    Curious, what are the "few albums" you mention? Who else has PJ backed besides Neil Young?
    ZF0 on SoundCloud

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    KV4053KV4053 Mike's side, crushed up against the stage Posts: 1,455
    I remember the label issues about credit on Mirrorball. I do not ever recall hearing that I Got Shit and Long Road were ever meant to be on Mirrorball. What's the source for that tidbit?
    I know I was born and I know that I'll die. The in between is mine.
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    thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
    KV4053 said:

    I remember the label issues about credit on Mirrorball. I do not ever recall hearing that I Got Shit and Long Road were ever meant to be on Mirrorball. What's the source for that tidbit?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_Ball_(Neil_Young_album)
    ZF0 on SoundCloud

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    thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
    KV4053 said:

    I remember the label issues about credit on Mirrorball. I do not ever recall hearing that I Got Shit and Long Road were ever meant to be on Mirrorball. What's the source for that tidbit?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_Ball_(Neil_Young_album)
    ZF0 on SoundCloud

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    KV4053KV4053 Mike's side, crushed up against the stage Posts: 1,455
    thispureamericanriot said:

    KV4053 said:

    I remember the label issues about credit on Mirrorball. I do not ever recall hearing that I Got Shit and Long Road were ever meant to be on Mirrorball. What's the source for that tidbit?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_Ball_(Neil_Young_album)
    I'm gonna defer to my memory this one time.
    I know I was born and I know that I'll die. The in between is mine.
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    dreamcodedreamcode Posts: 165
    As I recall not all members of PJ is on Merkinball. Is it Jeff who is not playing the bass?
    And he still gives his love,
    he just gives it away...
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    fall by the waysidefall by the wayside Jericho, VT Posts: 753
    dreamcode said:

    As I recall not all members of PJ is on Merkinball. Is it Jeff who is not playing the bass?

    I Got Shit is Ed, Neil, Jack, Brendan
    Long Road is Ed, Neil, Jack, Jeff
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    dreamcodedreamcode Posts: 165
    fall by the wayside said:

    dreamcode said:

    As I recall not all members of PJ is on Merkinball. Is it Jeff who is not playing the bass?

    I Got Shit is Ed, Neil, Jack, Brendan
    Long Road is Ed, Neil, Jack, Jeff
    So from this information you could say that not even Merkinball is a PJ record. But I guess that goes for a lot of the TenClub singles as well then...
    And he still gives his love,
    he just gives it away...
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,001
    I've always wondered why more PJ members didnt record I got id and Long Road. Only thing I remember reading is that they were the only ones recording at the time Ed introduced the songs or something. But still seems weird to be the producer played bass on one of my favorite songs and not Jeff.
    Anyone have more info why?
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    thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
    edited April 2017
    I know Wikipedia is not a reliable source, but here's what they say about it:

    The tracks on Merkin Ball were recorded at the tail end of the Mirror Ball sessions in February 1995. The songs were produced and mixed by Pearl Jam sound engineer Brett Eliason. Pearl Jam vocalist Eddie Vedder was not around much for the Mirror Ball recording sessions due to what he called a "pretty intense stalker problem." Vedder said that "leaving the house wasn't the easiest thing to do." He would refer to the issue in the song "Lukin" from Pearl Jam's 1996 album, No Code.

    Vedder wrote and performed vocals and guitar on the songs "I Got Id" and "Long Road", which were omitted from Mirror Ball. Because of legal complications between Epic Records and Reprise Records, the songs and the band name "Pearl Jam" were not allowed to be included on the full Mirror Ball album, so they were released separately as a Pearl Jam single. Neil Young contributed lead guitar to "I Got Id" and pump organ to "Long Road." Mirror Ball producer Brendan O'Brien plays bass on "I Got Id" while Pearl Jam bassist Jeff Ament plays bass on "Long Road." Pearl Jam drummer Jack Irons plays drums on both tracks.
    Post edited by thispureamericanriot on
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    Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 28,979
    thispureamericanriot said:

    I know Wikipedia is not a reliable source, but here's what they say about it:

    Everything you quoted had footnotes...
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,001
    I've read that before. Still doesn't say why no one was around. I just wonder if Ed shows up with a song and Neil is around, why isnt the rest of the band. Maybe there wasn't a reason at all.
    I guess if I was really curious enough I could read all the resources, so I cant be that curious.
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    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,832
    totally forgot that there was no stone or mike on merkin. weird.
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    2-feign-reluctance2-feign-reluctance TigerTown, USA Posts: 23,143
    Wonder if Neil will do any kind of archives release around Mirrorball. Live show would be awesome.
    www.cluthelee.com
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    brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,711
    2-feign-reluctance said:

    Wonder if Neil will do any kind of archives release around Mirrorball. Live show would be awesome.

    Terrific idea! I would love that.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













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    thispureamericanriotthispureamericanriot California Posts: 514
    Neil Young and Pearl Jam - 1995-08-26 Dublin, Ireland
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8Q7ZNhwOQc
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    goldrushgoldrush everybody knows this is nowhere Posts: 7,277
    brianlux said:

    2-feign-reluctance said:

    Wonder if Neil will do any kind of archives release around Mirrorball. Live show would be awesome.

    Terrific idea! I would love that.
    An Archives release would be amazing! Neil has released Volumes 00, 01, 02, 02.5, 03, 09, 11, and 12 of his live archives so far; I'm hoping that Volume 13 or 14 will be something from the Booker T & The MGs tour, followed by something from the NeilJam Mirrorball tour. They only did 11 shows, and the set lists didn't change that much, but the boots that are out there are pretty good. The Dublin show would be great to have on vinyl.
    “Do not postpone happiness”
    (Jeff Tweedy, Sydney 2007)

    “Put yer good money on the sunrise”
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    mrk2mrk2 Finland Posts: 2,025
    The Dublin show was professionally filmed (but never released) so that's a good contender for an archive release.
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    logan5ivelogan5ive Dallas, TX Posts: 457
    mace1229 said:

    I've always wondered why more PJ members didnt record I got id and Long Road. Only thing I remember reading is that they were the only ones recording at the time Ed introduced the songs or something. But still seems weird to be the producer played bass on one of my favorite songs and not Jeff.
    Anyone have more info why?

    The PJ20 book mentions that Jeff had the flu around that time and missed a couple of the recording dates including the day that "I Got ID" was recorded.
    1993 - Dallas
    1995 - Red Rocks I & II | Austin
    1998 - St Louis | Kansas City | Dallas | Raleigh | Atlanta | Birmingham | Greenville | Knoxville | Virginia Beach
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    2022 - OKC
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    Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 28,979
    mrk2 said:

    The Dublin show was professionally filmed (but never released) so that's a good contender for an archive release.

    By Jim Sheridan no less.

    And Jonathan Demme (no less) who passed today, shot Neil Young and Crazy Horse just after on 35mm with the cinematographer of Silence of the Lambs/Sixth Sense etc. Also not released.

    Neil Young should get on realsing both,
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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    2-feign-reluctance2-feign-reluctance TigerTown, USA Posts: 23,143
    Mirrorball is a classic IMO. A record that really got me excited to learn how to play guitar.
    www.cluthelee.com
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    brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,711
    goldrush said:

    brianlux said:

    2-feign-reluctance said:

    Wonder if Neil will do any kind of archives release around Mirrorball. Live show would be awesome.

    Terrific idea! I would love that.
    An Archives release would be amazing! Neil has released Volumes 00, 01, 02, 02.5, 03, 09, 11, and 12 of his live archives so far; I'm hoping that Volume 13 or 14 will be something from the Booker T & The MGs tour, followed by something from the NeilJam Mirrorball tour. They only did 11 shows, and the set lists didn't change that much, but the boots that are out there are pretty good. The Dublin show would be great to have on vinyl.
    Yes! Neil/ The Booker T live stuff is said to be great. I remember reading about them in one of Jack Rabbid's "Big Takeover" issues and he said the same thing- that this stuff needs to be released!

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













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    goldrushgoldrush everybody knows this is nowhere Posts: 7,277
    brianlux said:

    goldrush said:

    brianlux said:

    2-feign-reluctance said:

    Wonder if Neil will do any kind of archives release around Mirrorball. Live show would be awesome.

    Terrific idea! I would love that.
    An Archives release would be amazing! Neil has released Volumes 00, 01, 02, 02.5, 03, 09, 11, and 12 of his live archives so far; I'm hoping that Volume 13 or 14 will be something from the Booker T & The MGs tour, followed by something from the NeilJam Mirrorball tour. They only did 11 shows, and the set lists didn't change that much, but the boots that are out there are pretty good. The Dublin show would be great to have on vinyl.
    Yes! Neil/ The Booker T live stuff is said to be great. I remember reading about them in one of Jack Rabbid's "Big Takeover" issues and he said the same thing- that this stuff needs to be released!

    My first ever Neil show was with Booker T, July 11th 1993 in Finsbury Park, London. It was also my first PJ show and the first time I saw them jam on RITFW with Neil :).

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    dreamcodedreamcode Posts: 165
    My first live experience with PJ was the Mirrorball concert at Roskilde (HeyDay). First time I witnessed Neil pump organ too
    And he still gives his love,
    he just gives it away...
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