This thread being merged and all is a giant shitshow all because of one drummer. Pearl Jam is who they are now and will be inducted as they are now.
Except that's now how the RRoF claims to induct bands/people. They induct them based on the impact and influence they've had. Pearl Jam had the biggest influence and biggest impact during their first 3 albums. If they started at No Code or started at Binaural they don't get in. They're getting in because of the big impact they had (one of the biggest rock bands of all time.. at least in respect to sales of their first 3 albums) I would think it was a foregone conclusion that PJ would be inducted at 25 years regardless of whether or not Matt picked up the drums for Binaural. They had already cemented an epic enough legacy to get inducted by 1998. A band doesn't have to be together or be alive at 25 years to be inducted. Nirvana got inducted with only two big/impactful albums. Pearl Jam would of gotten inducted whether or not they kept going. They'd done enough by the time Yield came out.
Kiss and Journey have the opposite issues. As per my argument above it's supposed to be about the influence and impact of a band. Something that's usually a result of their biggest and most influential albums. KISS was pissed that it's new members didn't get inducted. Journey isn't happy the new singer didn't get inducted. I agree with the decisions. KISS hasn't made anything influential with the new members (Even though the new members have been in the band for over 10 years). Journey hasn't come anywhere to making something legendary with the new guy. He sounds like the original singer, but he's filling up arenas singing someone elses songs.
At the heart of the argument I agree with the RRoF. Their criteria is to induct the musicians that had an impact. Inducting the ones that come late and didn't perform on the albums that made them influential. As we've seen with these older touring bands it often becomes a rotating crew of replacement musicians. Not everyone should get inducted. Could you imagine if all the replacements in GNR had got inducted.. lol.
I suppose the problem is the RRHOF is a bit inconsistent with implementation. I still agree with the heart of the argument.
Dave A. drummed on two of the three epic PJ albums. The big ones. The ones that were so epic/huge the masses knew who they were. Ask an average joe to name a Pearl Jam song and most of the time it'll be Alive or Even Flow. Sometimes you'll even get a daughter or betterman, but you'll never get a light years.. lol
In short I disagree and I think the heart of how the RRoF usually nominates disagrees. They don't nominate a band based on who they are now. They nominate a band on the impact/influcence they've had. Something I believe Dave A. was a big part of. I think the RRHoF missed the mark on this one. I suppose Dave A. could of stayed quiet and taken his lumps, but he has the right to be vocal about it (Even if he paints himself in a negative light).
People say there was nothing PJ could of done about it, but there is. They could ask, try and change minds. The 90's PJ might have boycotted all together. It was only last year they boycotted an entire state. Maybe they don't have the fight in them for this one, because of the way they let him go in the first place. Not a battle they want to fight.
Dave A needs to stop whining. The guys in PJ can´t change the RnRHOF rules. BTW, if Daves' major goal in life was to get into the RnRHOF then he has been playing music for the wrong reasons all along
Post edited by CharlieP on
Roskilde 2000, Berlin 2006,
Athens 2006, Dusseldorf 2007, Copenhagen 2007, New York NY 1 + 2 2008, Berlin
2009, London 2009, London 2010, Berlin 2010, Manchester 2 2012, Berlin 1 2012,
Stockholm 2012, Oslo 2012, Copenhagen 2012, Amsterdam 1 + 2 (EV solo) 2012,
Amsterdam 1 + 2 2014, Stockholm 2014, Oslo 2014, Leeds 2014, Milton Keynes
2014, Heartland Festival DK (EV solo) 2017, Berlin 2018, Barcelona 2018, Copenhagen 2022, Prague 2022 (Cancelled)
People really overrate Dave as an influence on the two records he drummed on and especially overrate him as a drummer in general. Had Matt been the drummer on the first three albums, the songs would have very likely ended up the same way. The thesis statement above mentions Alive, Daughter, Evenflow and Betterman...all of which would have been a hit no matter who was drumming. No one hears those songs and thinks, "Wow. This drummer makes this song whole". It's the music, melody and lyrics that make them catchy. Sorry Dave. I could have drummed on those (and I'm terrible) and they would have been hit songs. Only difference is, twenty plus years later I wouldn't be bitching about it online like I'm some amazing drummer when I'm a hack who hasn't been able to land a legit gig since my time in Pearl Jam.
Excellent. This is the way you would want a former band member to act.
Very classy of Krusen. Well done.
Really cool interview. Seems like a very humble guy and, as he says himself, it seems as though the other guys played a part in that maturity.
Nothing at all against Krusen, but to be fair, you cant judge a person's class by how they react to receiving an honour. Had he acted like this if he were in Abbruzzesse's shoes, then yes, it would be classy.
Dave A should have simply said "congrats to my former band at being inducted, and although the hall chose to not include me, id like to believe my contributions over the years had some kind of affect on their nomination". After all his whining and foot stomping, I woukdnt be surprised if this soured the other guys from mentioning him at the ceremony.
Dave A:
Returning to the subject of the integrity of Pearl Jam, the drummer further expressed his disappointment, stating, “I am personally at a loss for words for how Stone [Gossard], Mike [McCready], Jeff [Ament], Matt [Cameron], Edward [Vedder] and Kelly Curtis [Pearl Jam’s manager] are accepting of such an injustice
This guy is such a loser, I can't stand it. What a jackass. He's running his mouth when Jack Irons or even Boom Gaspar, or even Brendan O' Brien deserve to be inducted with Pearl Jam over him. He literally makes me angry. Just go away and shut your mouth. I am confident that the guys will do the right thing and not even respond or mention this idiot at all.
Dave A was just in the right place at the right time. Im sure any other decent drummer could of done the same thing with Pearl Jam that he did. Why make a big deal over it anyways? The RnRHOF is kind of a joke. Im just looking forward to watching Pearl Jam perform that night and thats pretty much it.
I could be in pj. Everyone knows that the drummers are worthless anyway. all they do is add background noise that takes away from Eddie's beautiful singing
I'm just going to chime in that the decision has been made which drummers are going to be inducted into the Hall of Fame with Pearl Jam, and I think the two selected are the right ones, period. I feel bad for Dave A, but his public begging has been embarrassing and providing proof as to why he was not selected to be included. He needs to get on with life and be well. His contribution to the band will never be forgotten, but he ain't getting inducted into the RNRHoF.
all i'll say to that is that the band was extremely lucky to get Jack Irons as a replacement. He was able to carry the band into making 5 classic albums in a row. Cameron is great, but never has been able to add that sort of 'tick tock' the band needs in the studio to make their songs shine.
Really? So you don't think anything past Yield shines. Matt drums the shit out of all their albums. Binaural and especially Riot Act and Self Titled shine all around besides a few songs. I'm not a huge fan of Backspacer and Lightning Bolt, but that has nothing to do with the drumming. Matt brings Got Some and MYM to the table.
the first five albums are classics. you have to admit after yield their studio albums definitely went down hill.
Pfffttt Riot Act is their best album lyrically
I don't feel that way. I love No Code and Yield, but Binaural is their masterpiece to me. I know I'm in the minority on that. Both No Code and Yield fizzle out near the end. Everything after Present Tense I could skip. Yield is the same after DTE, except In Hiding and ATY. I'd skip less songs on RA and Self Titled combined.
I'm with you all the way, man. Well, I'd add Low Light onto meaningful Yield songs but Binaural was easily their most creative and diverse recording session. Just think of the album, the Lost Dogs, Drifting and Strangest Tribe, and stuff from Anything In Between. Lyrically it's their best as well. Whatever broke Ed's writers block from those session sure opened the flood gates. Between Binaural, Riot Act and much of Ukulele Songs, 2000-2002 was an awesome time for fans of PJ lyrics.
We should takeover this thread and make it all about the best lyrics (and Angel won't be on anyone's best lyrics list I'm sure)
I was row 8 (very good fan club #) in front of stone at fenway and couldn't believe how few of the "hardcore" fans knew that song. Literally no one was singing it around me.
That's why the "Just A Girl" petition has me baffled. Why waste a song when there are so many better ones that don't get played enough. I understand the nostalgia, but it isn't a good song.
Anyway, I digress. Back to whining about drummers!
just a girl is a terrible song! lol people just want to be able to cross it off their list.
not true.I'm not a "list crosser". I don't go to enough shows for that (5 shows in 25 years). nor is it nostalgia. I didn't know about it until the reissue came out. I just like the tune. If you don't, fine. But I do.
Excellent. This is the way you would want a former band member to act.
Very classy of Krusen. Well done.
Really cool interview. Seems like a very humble guy and, as he says himself, it seems as though the other guys played a part in that maturity.
Nothing at all against Krusen, but to be fair, you cant judge a person's class by how they react to receiving an honour. Had he acted like this if he were in Abbruzzesse's shoes, then yes, it would be classy.
Dave A should have simply said "congrats to my former band at being inducted, and although the hall chose to not include me, id like to believe my contributions over the years had some kind of affect on their nomination". After all his whining and foot stomping, I woukdnt be surprised if this soured the other guys from mentioning him at the ceremony.
Dave A:
Returning to the subject of the integrity of Pearl Jam, the drummer further expressed his disappointment, stating, “I am personally at a loss for words for how Stone [Gossard], Mike [McCready], Jeff [Ament], Matt [Cameron], Edward [Vedder] and Kelly Curtis [Pearl Jam’s manager] are accepting of such an injustice
This guy is such a loser, I can't stand it. What a jackass. He's running his mouth when Jack Irons or even Boom Gaspar, or even Brendan O' Brien deserve to be inducted with Pearl Jam over him. He literally makes me angry. Just go away and shut your mouth. I am confident that the guys will do the right thing and not even respond or mention this idiot at all.
LOL. Boom or BoB? LOL.
Dave A has said a lot of stupid stuff, but that doesn't take away from his contributions to the band when he was in it.
I could be in pj. Everyone knows that the drummers are worthless anyway. all they do is add background noise that takes away from Eddie's beautiful singing
lol.. that might be the only argument I've seen in the 22 pages that might sway me over to the other side. Don't induct any of the drummers because they didn't matter lol.
I could be in pj. Everyone knows that the drummers are worthless anyway. all they do is add background noise that takes away from Eddie's beautiful singing
anyone who makes a comment like this has obviously never picked up an instrument and jammed with anyone. any musician worth a penny knows just how integral a good drummer is to any band.
Dave A. was my favorite PJ Drummer Loved his playing style and thought it meshed so well with Pearl Jam at the time, but I hate what he has done. Quite simply he has forced their hand not to respond. I'm sure they would have said something when the time was right. Jack Irons is the reason the band is together; he is very good friends with the band and the members hadn't mentioned his name yet. The only thing Dave A. has accomplished with his incessant bitching is making it horribly awkward. Quite frankly, if i'm Stone, Eddie, Jeff, Mike, i'd be pissed. They were announced as inductees on 12/20 yet the whining began 2 months prior, then days after being announced he calls them out. Dave should probably focus on his probation as opposed to bitching on Facebook.
To say that anyone could replace a trained and talented musician? If that's true, then anyone can fill in those spreadsheets, or be an account manager, style hair or whatever it is we all do for a living. As someone mentioned they didnt fire Dave A because his drumming sucked. And they didnt hire him because they liked his soul patch. He totally ramped up the studio drumming from Ten when he performed it live. Plus he fit the look: no shirt, the hair, going ape on the kit, cigarette dangling. Just like with Jack Irons, it all came together...until it didnt and he had to go for whatever reason.
I still think every drummer should be inducted and anyone who thinks normal rules matter to the members of Pearl Jam hasn't been paying attention. Just like any other award, the RRHOF is contrived. Somehow it came to be important. Sure, I like it when a less known talent finally gets the credit they deserve, but it's mostly millionaires celebrating each other.
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Out of control, rude. Closed for review. May not reopen. It's possible to have discussions and debates without being abusive.
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Kiss and Journey have the opposite issues. As per my argument above it's supposed to be about the influence and impact of a band. Something that's usually a result of their biggest and most influential albums. KISS was pissed that it's new members didn't get inducted. Journey isn't happy the new singer didn't get inducted. I agree with the decisions. KISS hasn't made anything influential with the new members (Even though the new members have been in the band for over 10 years). Journey hasn't come anywhere to making something legendary with the new guy. He sounds like the original singer, but he's filling up arenas singing someone elses songs.
At the heart of the argument I agree with the RRoF. Their criteria is to induct the musicians that had an impact. Inducting the ones that come late and didn't perform on the albums that made them influential. As we've seen with these older touring bands it often becomes a rotating crew of replacement musicians. Not everyone should get inducted. Could you imagine if all the replacements in GNR had got inducted.. lol.
I suppose the problem is the RRHOF is a bit inconsistent with implementation. I still agree with the heart of the argument.
Dave A. drummed on two of the three epic PJ albums. The big ones. The ones that were so epic/huge the masses knew who they were. Ask an average joe to name a Pearl Jam song and most of the time it'll be Alive or Even Flow. Sometimes you'll even get a daughter or betterman, but you'll never get a light years.. lol
In short I disagree and I think the heart of how the RRoF usually nominates disagrees. They don't nominate a band based on who they are now. They nominate a band on the impact/influcence they've had. Something I believe Dave A. was a big part of. I think the RRHoF missed the mark on this one. I suppose Dave A. could of stayed quiet and taken his lumps, but he has the right to be vocal about it (Even if he paints himself in a negative light).
People say there was nothing PJ could of done about it, but there is. They could ask, try and change minds. The 90's PJ might have boycotted all together. It was only last year they boycotted an entire state. Maybe they don't have the fight in them for this one, because of the way they let him go in the first place. Not a battle they want to fight.
Roskilde 2000, Berlin 2006, Athens 2006, Dusseldorf 2007, Copenhagen 2007, New York NY 1 + 2 2008, Berlin 2009, London 2009, London 2010, Berlin 2010, Manchester 2 2012, Berlin 1 2012, Stockholm 2012, Oslo 2012, Copenhagen 2012, Amsterdam 1 + 2 (EV solo) 2012, Amsterdam 1 + 2 2014, Stockholm 2014, Oslo 2014, Leeds 2014, Milton Keynes 2014, Heartland Festival DK (EV solo) 2017, Berlin 2018, Barcelona 2018, Copenhagen 2022, Prague 2022 (Cancelled)
http://www.reverbnation.com/brianzilm
Returning to the subject of the integrity of Pearl Jam, the drummer further expressed his disappointment, stating, “I am personally at a loss for words for how Stone [Gossard], Mike [McCready], Jeff [Ament], Matt [Cameron], Edward [Vedder] and Kelly Curtis [Pearl Jam’s manager] are accepting of such an injustice
Read More: Dave Abbruzzese Calls Out Pearl Jam Over Rock Hall Snub | http://loudwire.com/dave-abbruzzese-takes-aim-pearl-jam-rock-hall-injustice/?trackback=tsmclip
This guy is such a loser, I can't stand it. What a jackass. He's running his mouth when Jack Irons or even Boom Gaspar, or even Brendan O' Brien deserve to be inducted with Pearl Jam over him. He literally makes me angry. Just go away and shut your mouth. I am confident that the guys will do the right thing and not even respond or mention this idiot at all.
www.headstonesband.com
Dave A has said a lot of stupid stuff, but that doesn't take away from his contributions to the band when he was in it.
www.headstonesband.com
and no, i'm not a drummer.
www.headstonesband.com
Dave sucks.
http://www.reverbnation.com/brianzilm
I still think every drummer should be inducted and anyone who thinks normal rules matter to the members of Pearl Jam hasn't been paying attention. Just like any other award, the RRHOF is contrived. Somehow it came to be important. Sure, I like it when a less known talent finally gets the credit they deserve, but it's mostly millionaires celebrating each other.