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Some ideas about "flipping."
veddertown
Scotland Posts: 5,260
Just a few ideas that hail from observations here about people's complaints. Feel free to chip in.
°Tenclub announce the release of any limited editions by email and early, at least on Wednesday or Thursday.
°They do the presale simultaneously on a Saturday or Sunday when less people are at work and in 3 different announced timezones, 12:00 hrs Pacific, 20:00 hrs Europe and 09:00 Australasia.
°Stop making the releases quite so limited, 5000 is still limited and will still sell effortlessly.
°Stop doing deals with stores which go against your supposed anti-flipping policy, limited to 5 per member etc...
°Make a 3 month amnesty on Lost Dogs for selling new items, it creates animosity with fans who missed out when they see a $35 poster for $200+
°Tenclub announce the release of any limited editions by email and early, at least on Wednesday or Thursday.
°They do the presale simultaneously on a Saturday or Sunday when less people are at work and in 3 different announced timezones, 12:00 hrs Pacific, 20:00 hrs Europe and 09:00 Australasia.
°Stop making the releases quite so limited, 5000 is still limited and will still sell effortlessly.
°Stop doing deals with stores which go against your supposed anti-flipping policy, limited to 5 per member etc...
°Make a 3 month amnesty on Lost Dogs for selling new items, it creates animosity with fans who missed out when they see a $35 poster for $200+
Like a book among the many on a shelf...
Dublin 02 Arena - 22/6/10. Belfast Odyssey Arena - 23/6/10. London Hyde Park - 25/6/10. Berlin Wuhlheide - 30/6/10.
Manchester MEN - 20/06/12. Manchester MEN - 21/06/12
Dublin 02 Arena - 22/6/10. Belfast Odyssey Arena - 23/6/10. London Hyde Park - 25/6/10. Berlin Wuhlheide - 30/6/10.
Manchester MEN - 20/06/12. Manchester MEN - 21/06/12
Post edited by veddertown on
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I miss plenty of stuff. Is it really all that important? Weekends work for you. It doesn't work for others. It also doesn't work for the folks that have to "man the controls" (ie work the weekend for your convenience). Give it up. You like a band from another country, you have the time zone issue, not the band or it's club.
Dublin 02 Arena - 22/6/10. Belfast Odyssey Arena - 23/6/10. London Hyde Park - 25/6/10. Berlin Wuhlheide - 30/6/10.
Manchester MEN - 20/06/12. Manchester MEN - 21/06/12
=D>
I see a lot less complaining (which is amazing given that there is a lot here) about Vault 3. In the end, it's still pretty limited, but almost everyone who wanted one got it. So it's probably the only reasonable solution. That being said, it's not always the most practice for some releases.
Dublin 02 Arena - 22/6/10. Belfast Odyssey Arena - 23/6/10. London Hyde Park - 25/6/10. Berlin Wuhlheide - 30/6/10.
Manchester MEN - 20/06/12. Manchester MEN - 21/06/12
If people get that butt hurt on lost dogs that sucks but that's the way the trading game goes. If it gets canned from Lost Dogs then it will just go direct to ebay and none of the "good people" on here will be able to trade their stuff for the possibility of getting one.
Are people really bitching about how limited a limited edition is?
Does anyone think coke ten would have been released without Newbury Comics? Would it have ever been a thought?
The ordering system won't handle that many people trying to make a limited edition order when everyone knows about it.There will still be people missing out on limited edition.
I know some people feel slighted but if I was 10C, after hearing all this bitching, I wouldn't bother putting anything like this out again.
Wind this thing up.
I don't think a pretimed presale is going to make a different. All it means is a slightly different 2000 people get the record. It doesn't solve flipping at all, it just changes it from people who were on the board at the right time, to people who survive the website crashing.
When there's only 2000, lots of people still miss out. It's like the ticket lotto, when there's not enough tickets people get left high n' dry, and it doesn't matter how they get allocated, people miss out. There is no system possible (short of increasing supply) that makes more people happy.
Members get their items. Flippers can flip to non-members. Everyone is happy...lol. Except the non-members. Non-members don't like it? Join.
Then there are no excuses/complaints. Done.
Wrong - If you buy something (or 5 of something) with the intent to go and sell it right away (or trade it right away) for profit. My definition of flipping.
Ify - If you buy 1 of something you want then see it's worth a lot, well I don't know. Best scenario you trade it to another fan who missed out and you're both happy with the outcome. No way do I blame someone who does this. Hopefully they wait until after the initial rush, but whatever, do what you want with your stuff. (Ex. should I trade my coke 10 for a LO2L vinyl? I already have 4 other 10's on vinyl?)
How long till I can sell trade my item and it isn't considered flipping? - apparently the next day in lost dogs and the mods are ok with it. Mods could catch a lot of "if this item is resold you will lost your membership" ppl over there easily. (But they want you to continue your membership).
Added note, I always love the "this won't be worth anything in a few months" - from ppl who didn't score one. And the "Will this is the next Benny" from ppl that did.
Also not a fan of the ppl who buy 5 for others who missed out on the initial sale. Why should ppl beg you for it??? I understand it's going to "real fans" (supposedly) but some of those other real fans probably missed out because of you, and they were there at the time (or almost) the time of the sale.
The reason a pre order won't work is because some people will still miss out but the flippers won't.
this is the same reason they don't announce (for the most part) when new items are in the shop. They figure the forum junkies are on the board all the time and the lucky few that see the item pop up in the shop will get it rather than telling the flippers when they will be available.
I'm very happy and lucky that I can access the Pearl Jam site all day while I am at work.
The pre-order at least makes as many people happy as possible at that given time and is better than any other option short of keeping something in print always. Sure maybe 5 years down the road someone may be unhappy thing to track something down, but it's difficult to keep everything in print all of the time. Especially given the constraints of today's vinyl marketplace (fewer production facilities, and ultimately the small demand for vinyl vs the larger marketplace).
Flippers will always exist, but the goal should to produce enough to minimize after market markup, and for more exclusive items, the pre-order works best.
Wind this thing up.
Wind this thing up.
The presale maximizes the amount of people wanting one getting one and minimizes bitching about not being able to get something.
PJ could make unlimited made to order everything, and people would complain about that. There are a lot of limited edition posters in the shop right now that have not sold. Some things have demand, some things don't.
If everyone keeps bitching PJ may decide why let others make that much off of them and will jack their rates which only screws over those that want it for the actual music and now have to pay double what they were last time.
Fuckus rules all
Rob
Seattle
Do I condone "flipping"....no. But I realize it's part of the society I live in and I don't get worked up about it. if I want something bad enough I'll pony up the cash on the 2ndary market. If I want something bad enough but can't afford it..well, I just don't buy it. And it's not the end of the world. Whether or not I own a limited piece of PJ memorobilia doesn't define me. Not owning something PJ doesn't make me less of a fan....or less of a person.
Sorry for babbling....
- Uncle Snuffy
Oakland-Alameda County Coliseum Stadium - Nov 14, 1997,
Oakland-Alameda County Coliseum Stadium - Nov 15, 1997, Alpine Valley Music Theatre - Jun 26, 1998, Alpine Valley Music Theatre - Jun 27, 1998, United Center - Jun 29, 1998, Riverport Amphitheatre - Jul 02, 1998, Allstate Arena - Oct 09, 2000, Assembly Hall - Apr 23, 2003
United Center - Jun 18, 2003, Fox Theatre - Oct 05, 2004, United Center - May 16, 2006, United Center - May 17, 2006, United Center - Aug 23, 2009, United Center - Aug 24, 2009, Sprint Center - May 03, 2010, Scottrade Center - May 04, 2010, Alpine Valley Music Theatre - Sep 03, 2011, Alpine Valley Music Theatre - Sep 04, 2011
Flipping is pretty crappy. But I've always pretty much resided to purchasing the things I love on the secondary market (and not just PJ). I just find it to be a lot less stressful that way! I purchase and collect urban art, and its the same deal in those circles. Worse in fact.
What I've noticed is, these forums really do escalate the problem, creating a feverish rush to buy the next thing - whether people really like it, or want it or not! It just become a 'desire'. But give it a week and you'll see them off loading it. Same story, every time. I just try and stay away from the fever. Do that, and I promise, you'll be a lot happier for it.