For sure. That's what I'm saying - I don't think the dems really care about the right to choose either - they use it as a tool too. Which is why I hate politics. PERIOD :wave:
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Exactly...they're just being used as tools. Sadly, there are people impacted by them being used in that manner...and it really pisses me off
this is the very nature of politics though. Some of the "tools" that Obama (or whomever you support) has used, I'm sure, have impacted people (possibly in the negative way).
For sure. That's what I'm saying - I don't think the dems really care about the right to choose either - they use it as a tool too. Which is why I hate politics. PERIOD :wave:
I agree with you for the most part... EVERYTHING that politicians do has to do with getting votes and winning. Period. he he he.
Although I would argue that might not be the case for the very religious ones (so for some Republicans against abortion). That their strict religious beliefs so well compliment the official Republican line is rather horrifying.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
this is the very nature of politics though. Some of the "tools" that Obama (or whomever you support) has used, I'm sure, have impacted people (possibly in the negative way).
For sure. That's what I'm saying - I don't think the dems really care about the right to choose either - they use it as a tool too. Which is why I hate politics. PERIOD :wave:
I agree with you for the most part... EVERYTHING that politicians do has to do with getting votes and winning. Period. he he he.
Although I would argue that might not be the case for the very religious ones (so for some Republicans against abortion). That their strict religious beliefs so well compliment the official Republican line is rather horrifying.
I am sure that for some politicians on both sides it is a real issue that matters to them on the personal level...but both sides definitely use it as a tool. I don't like that. Period This is fun :shifty:
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
These guys talk alot about what God intended. What about Satan.
What if the pregnancy was the work of the Devil. Is it OK to get an abortion then.
that is a good question. i never thought of it from that angle. i need to think about that one for a bit. i need to see if satan is capable of creating life before i can answer that.
and aside from that, doesn't god trump satan since god has the power to not only expel satan from heaven, but keep him out of there? and doesn't the power of god compel demons to leave the bodies of people?
this can go a whole lot of different directions...
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
These guys talk alot about what God intended. What about Satan.
What if the pregnancy was the work of the Devil. Is it OK to get an abortion then.
that is a good question. i never thought of it from that angle. i need to think about that one for a bit. i need to see if satan is capable of creating life before i can answer that.
and aside from that, doesn't god trump satan since god has the power to not only expel satan from heaven, but keep him out of there? and doesn't the power of god compel demons to leave the bodies of people?
this can go a whole lot of different directions...
I was as just thinking along the lines that if a guy like this has such unwavering faith in God, Jesus and Heaven then surely they would have to believe in the Devil and Hell. And wouldn't something evil like rape be the work of someone possesed by the Devil.
For the record I think it's all a load of baloney and hope people understand that I'm just twisting and malnipulating the Christian beliefs structure to suit my agenda
These guys talk alot about what God intended. What about Satan.
What if the pregnancy was the work of the Devil. Is it OK to get an abortion then.
great post!!
"...Dimitri...He talks to me...'.."The Ghost of Greece..".
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
After reading some of your discussion I think one thing is clear: It is totally ludicrous for an American federal politician to act as though they think all life is sacred, and like they 100% stick to their guns on that principle. I`m surprised any of them even bring it up, since the hypocrisy is so glaring.
I think it is defending new life the other innocent victim of rape.
These guys talk alot about what God intended. What about Satan.
What if the pregnancy was the work of the Devil. Is it OK to get an abortion then.
Good Point - Rape is evil....
Rape is a choice, from it, as all things we do to each other, we learn
and someday see crystal clear.
It consistently blows my mind that a man could do this to a woman
and not imagine what it does to her. If they can actually grasp that
it is truly an evil choice. It also blows my mind that rape is still apart of
pornography play and fantasy. It's obvious it runs deep and primal.
And the fact that it is so prevalent, still hidden, not punished as it should be,
blamed on the victim tells us still this is a mans world, which is about as evil
as it gets.
These guys talk alot about what God intended. What about Satan.
What if the pregnancy was the work of the Devil. Is it OK to get an abortion then.
that is a good question. i never thought of it from that angle. i need to think about that one for a bit. i need to see if satan is capable of creating life before i can answer that.
and aside from that, doesn't god trump satan since god has the power to not only expel satan from heaven, but keep him out of there? and doesn't the power of god compel demons to leave the bodies of people?
this can go a whole lot of different directions...
I was as just thinking along the lines that if a guy like this has such unwavering faith in God, Jesus and Heaven then surely they would have to believe in the Devil and Hell. And wouldn't something evil like rape be the work of someone possesed by the Devil.
For the record I think it's all a load of baloney and hope people understand that I'm just twisting and malnipulating the Christian beliefs structure to suit my agenda
The guy has a big picture he is working from. Long past this life. He is defending
the innocent child which in many cases, as with my niece, is more than a silver lining
that comes from rape. It is a valuable precious life that will continue on in her own children.
romney is to control the direction of this party. it is his job to rebuke idiots like this guy.
i don't see romney demanding that the ad that he did be pulled...
You think the ad should be pulled?
Why?
because your nominee is on record supporting this guy, and if enough indiana voters see that add they could turn not only on the politician in question, but on romney himself.
this ad could be politically damaging to romney.
Not my nominee yet studying up on Gary Johnson....
now I have three to choose from.
Romney's not worried about it, why would you be,
being in favor of our President?
It's Romney's choice and he still could change his mind
but I think saying he doesn't support the same views, would not with policy,
sends the right message for me.
I also think Romney knows where he is coming from, defending the new life
even in the case of rape.
The other message for me taken to heart is ...
let people share their views, don't judge or abandon them for them,
it's opinions and kind of like a window to their soul at any given moment.
Not my nominee yet studying up on Gary Johnson....
now I have three to choose from.
Romney's not worried about it, why would you be,
being in favor of our President?
It's Romney's choice and he still could change his mind
but I think saying he doesn't support the same views, would not with policy,
sends the right message for me.
I also think Romney knows where he is coming from, defending the new life
even in the case of rape.
The other message for me taken to heart is ...
let people share their views, don't judge or abandon them for them,
it's opinions and kind of like a window to their soul at any given moment.
defending the new life while in the same breath wanting to cut programs to help that kid once it is born.
i'm sorry, but to make a woman carry the child of a rapist is just plain wrong.
funny how you on the right are all about "get government out of my life" and "protecting the rights of the unborn", but what about the rights of the living, out of the womb, mother? why would rights of a fetus trump the rights of the woman carrying it?? this is the very definition of having government in your life.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
Not my nominee yet studying up on Gary Johnson....
now I have three to choose from.
Romney's not worried about it, why would you be,
being in favor of our President?
It's Romney's choice and he still could change his mind
but I think saying he doesn't support the same views, would not with policy,
sends the right message for me.
I also think Romney knows where he is coming from, defending the new life
even in the case of rape.
The other message for me taken to heart is ...
let people share their views, don't judge or abandon them for them,
it's opinions and kind of like a window to their soul at any given moment.
defending the new life while in the same breath wanting to cut programs to help that kid once it is born.
i'm sorry, but to make a woman carry the child of a rapist is just plain wrong.
funny how you on the right are all about "get government out of my life" and "protecting the rights of the unborn", but what about the rights of the living, out of the womb, mother? why would rights of a fetus trump the rights of the woman carrying it?? this is the very definition of having government in your life.
agree... as a male it's hard to imagine but I could imagine that the idea of carrying an unborn baby that was the result of a rape would be the most horrible thing ever.. I would feel for the baby, the mother and everyone involved. Furthermore, the rapist (if not convicted/charged) could seek to get parental rights to this kid!!! I couldn't imagine of a more fucked up situation - having custody of your kid sharing it with the rapist.
it's ridiculous to think ANY of these christian right politicians would appreciate their daughter or wife having a baby if it meant ANY chance that the rapist would have rights to that baby. They need to look at the world and show some empathy for once. God wouldn't have intended the rapist to raise a kid let alone hijack someone's DNA without permission.
I'm just flying around the other side of the world to say I love you
Sha la la la i'm in love with a jersey girl
I love you forever and forever
Adel 03 Melb 1 03 LA 2 06 Santa Barbara 06 Gorge 1 06 Gorge 2 06 Adel 1 06 Adel 2 06 Camden 1 08 Camden 2 08 Washington DC 08 Hartford 08
Not my nominee yet studying up on Gary Johnson....
now I have three to choose from.
Romney's not worried about it, why would you be,
being in favor of our President?
It's Romney's choice and he still could change his mind
but I think saying he doesn't support the same views, would not with policy,
sends the right message for me.
I also think Romney knows where he is coming from, defending the new life
even in the case of rape.
The other message for me taken to heart is ...
let people share their views, don't judge or abandon them for them,
it's opinions and kind of like a window to their soul at any given moment.
defending the new life while in the same breath wanting to cut programs to help that kid once it is born.
i'm sorry, but to make a woman carry the child of a rapist is just plain wrong.
funny how you on the right are all about "get government out of my life" and "protecting the rights of the unborn", but what about the rights of the living, out of the womb, mother? why would rights of a fetus trump the rights of the woman carrying it?? this is the very definition of having government in your life.
This is something I really don't understand. First, how can you force your own moral and religious beliefs about abortion on another person? How are you personally affected if a woman you don't even know has an abortion? Second, if you live by those moral convictions, how can you support the abandonment of children after they are born? If you truly believe that life is sacred, why do we see so many children abandoned and abusend? Neglected and mistreated? Where is the outrage about children in high school that read on a 2nd grade level? It seems far easier to give lip service to the sacredness of life but then conveniently dismiss the child once it actually arrives.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
After reading some of your discussion I think one thing is clear: It is totally ludicrous for an American federal politician to act as though they think all life is sacred, and like they 100% stick to their guns on that principle. I`m surprised any of them even bring it up, since the hypocrisy is so glaring.
I think it is defending new life the other innocent victim of rape.
That's great. Differentiating "new life" and all other life... or the innocence of a fetus vs the innocence of innocent civilians. That makes no sense, and is a totally unjustifiable distinction. I also think that putting the life of a fetus - one that isn't even considered viable in nature until after 3 months, if the rate of miscarriages means anything - before the life of walking, talking human beings with friends and families is sickening beyond measure. Not to mention dictating to women what they have inside their bodies, and it's mostly men trying to push through the laws. It boggles my mind, the nerve of these assholes.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
How are you personally affected if a woman you don't even know has an abortion?
I'm also not personally affected by any of the shootings in school, so by that logic I shouldn't care? That's just weird.
School shootings affect LOTS of people in all kinds of ways. They affect policy, law, the education system, the death of students sends a ripple affect out into communities... such things affect communities as a whole, and therefore DO affect you by extension. Also, you KNOW about school shootings. No one knows a fetus, and no one knows when specific abortions happen. Also school shootings have nothing to do with women deciding what to do with their own bodies as opposed to the government deciding it for them. Totally different, and not at all comparable in this argument.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
How are you personally affected if a woman you don't even know has an abortion?
I'm also not personally affected by any of the shootings in school, so by that logic I shouldn't care? That's just weird.
Care? No, I didn't say you shouldn't care. But why should you get to force your beliefs onto others? That's weird.
If someone thinks murder is ok, why does society force their beliefs?
And why should someone force their beliefs on the unborn child?
Really, it comes down to what is a life and if both are lives which one takes precedence. But this discussion will likely go no where.
IN the event of the situations mentioned" mother's life at risk, Rape, incest - this conversation becomes much more difficult to have and that is why I would not vote to change abortion in those cases. I still think it's a life so rape and incest are some question marks for me, but the pain/suffering/etc that those situations place on the mother of the child make it difficult to distinguish (in my mind) which life takes precedence.
Some good comments on this thread though. It really bothers me when people discount the other sides point of view 100%. It also bothers me that people think if you are against abortion then you must be a religious nutjob.
How are you personally affected if a woman you don't even know has an abortion?
I'm also not personally affected by any of the shootings in school, so by that logic I shouldn't care? That's just weird.
School shootings affect LOTS of people in all kinds of ways. They affect policy, law, the education system, the death of students sends a ripple affect out into communities... such things affect communities as a whole, and therefore DO affect you by extension. Also, you KNOW about school shootings. No one knows a fetus, and no one knows when specific abortions happen. Also school shootings have nothing to do with women deciding what to do with their own bodies as opposed to the government deciding it for them. Totally different, and not at all comparable in this argument.
I know you won't agree, but the systemic killing of unborn babies affects a hell of a lot. And if abortions were publicized it be different to. As school shooting that kilsl 1 kids that you don;t hear about on the news doesn;t affect you at all.
I'm also not personally affected by any of the shootings in school, so by that logic I shouldn't care? That's just weird.
Care? No, I didn't say you shouldn't care. But why should you get to force your beliefs onto others? That's weird.
If someone thinks murder is ok, why does society force their beliefs?
And why should someone force their beliefs on the unborn child?
Really, it comes down to what is a life and if both are lives which one takes precedence. But this discussion will likely go no where.
IN the event of the situations mentioned" mother's life at risk, Rape, incest - this conversation becomes much more difficult to have and that is why I would not vote to change abortion in those cases. I still think it's a life so rape and incest are some question marks for me, but the pain/suffering/etc that those situations place on the mother of the child make it difficult to distinguish (in my mind) which life takes precedence.
Some good comments on this thread though. It really bothers me when people discount the other sides point of view 100%. It also bothers me that people think if you are against abortion then you must be a religious nutjob.
Because the murder of another person does not have anything to do with someone choosing what does and doesn't GROW INSIDE OF THEIR BODY. It's not a difficult concept. The death/murder of people is simply not relateable to abortion. They can't be compared.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I'm also not personally affected by any of the shootings in school, so by that logic I shouldn't care? That's just weird.
School shootings affect LOTS of people in all kinds of ways. They affect policy, law, the education system, the death of students sends a ripple affect out into communities... such things affect communities as a whole, and therefore DO affect you by extension. Also, you KNOW about school shootings. No one knows a fetus, and no one knows when specific abortions happen. Also school shootings have nothing to do with women deciding what to do with their own bodies as opposed to the government deciding it for them. Totally different, and not at all comparable in this argument.
I know you won't agree, but the systemic killing of unborn babies affects a hell of a lot. And if abortions were publicized it be different to. As school shooting that kilsl 1 kids that you don;t hear about on the news doesn;t affect you at all.
Sure it does. It affects policies within school systems, the law enforcement system, it creates fear among parents generally, it becomes addressed within the mental health community, etc etc.
How do you figure that is abortion "systemic", exactly? And how does a woman getting an abortion affect you? I don't understand. If it were publicized... eerrr... :? And even if it did affect you, how does that trump a woman deciding on what is inside her own body?
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Comments
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
I agree with you for the most part... EVERYTHING that politicians do has to do with getting votes and winning. Period. he he he.
Although I would argue that might not be the case for the very religious ones (so for some Republicans against abortion). That their strict religious beliefs so well compliment the official Republican line is rather horrifying.
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
What if the pregnancy was the work of the Devil. Is it OK to get an abortion then.
and aside from that, doesn't god trump satan since god has the power to not only expel satan from heaven, but keep him out of there? and doesn't the power of god compel demons to leave the bodies of people?
this can go a whole lot of different directions...
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
I was as just thinking along the lines that if a guy like this has such unwavering faith in God, Jesus and Heaven then surely they would have to believe in the Devil and Hell. And wouldn't something evil like rape be the work of someone possesed by the Devil.
For the record I think it's all a load of baloney and hope people understand that I'm just twisting and malnipulating the Christian beliefs structure to suit my agenda
Good Point - Rape is evil....
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
and someday see crystal clear.
It consistently blows my mind that a man could do this to a woman
and not imagine what it does to her. If they can actually grasp that
it is truly an evil choice. It also blows my mind that rape is still apart of
pornography play and fantasy. It's obvious it runs deep and primal.
And the fact that it is so prevalent, still hidden, not punished as it should be,
blamed on the victim tells us still this is a mans world, which is about as evil
as it gets.
the innocent child which in many cases, as with my niece, is more than a silver lining
that comes from rape. It is a valuable precious life that will continue on in her own children.
So from an evil act came a blessing.
now I have three to choose from.
Romney's not worried about it, why would you be,
being in favor of our President?
It's Romney's choice and he still could change his mind
but I think saying he doesn't support the same views, would not with policy,
sends the right message for me.
I also think Romney knows where he is coming from, defending the new life
even in the case of rape.
The other message for me taken to heart is ...
let people share their views, don't judge or abandon them for them,
it's opinions and kind of like a window to their soul at any given moment.
i'm sorry, but to make a woman carry the child of a rapist is just plain wrong.
funny how you on the right are all about "get government out of my life" and "protecting the rights of the unborn", but what about the rights of the living, out of the womb, mother? why would rights of a fetus trump the rights of the woman carrying it?? this is the very definition of having government in your life.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Well... HE has spoken....
http://www.theonion.com/articles/god-di ... ght,30087/
Let this be the final word...
agree... as a male it's hard to imagine but I could imagine that the idea of carrying an unborn baby that was the result of a rape would be the most horrible thing ever.. I would feel for the baby, the mother and everyone involved. Furthermore, the rapist (if not convicted/charged) could seek to get parental rights to this kid!!! I couldn't imagine of a more fucked up situation - having custody of your kid sharing it with the rapist.
it's ridiculous to think ANY of these christian right politicians would appreciate their daughter or wife having a baby if it meant ANY chance that the rapist would have rights to that baby. They need to look at the world and show some empathy for once. God wouldn't have intended the rapist to raise a kid let alone hijack someone's DNA without permission.
Sha la la la i'm in love with a jersey girl
I love you forever and forever
Adel 03 Melb 1 03 LA 2 06 Santa Barbara 06 Gorge 1 06 Gorge 2 06 Adel 1 06 Adel 2 06 Camden 1 08 Camden 2 08 Washington DC 08 Hartford 08
This is something I really don't understand. First, how can you force your own moral and religious beliefs about abortion on another person? How are you personally affected if a woman you don't even know has an abortion? Second, if you live by those moral convictions, how can you support the abandonment of children after they are born? If you truly believe that life is sacred, why do we see so many children abandoned and abusend? Neglected and mistreated? Where is the outrage about children in high school that read on a 2nd grade level? It seems far easier to give lip service to the sacredness of life but then conveniently dismiss the child once it actually arrives.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
I'm also not personally affected by any of the shootings in school, so by that logic I shouldn't care? That's just weird.
Care? No, I didn't say you shouldn't care. But why should you get to force your beliefs onto others? That's weird.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
If someone thinks murder is ok, why does society force their beliefs?
And why should someone force their beliefs on the unborn child?
Really, it comes down to what is a life and if both are lives which one takes precedence. But this discussion will likely go no where.
IN the event of the situations mentioned" mother's life at risk, Rape, incest - this conversation becomes much more difficult to have and that is why I would not vote to change abortion in those cases. I still think it's a life so rape and incest are some question marks for me, but the pain/suffering/etc that those situations place on the mother of the child make it difficult to distinguish (in my mind) which life takes precedence.
Some good comments on this thread though. It really bothers me when people discount the other sides point of view 100%. It also bothers me that people think if you are against abortion then you must be a religious nutjob.
I know you won't agree, but the systemic killing of unborn babies affects a hell of a lot. And if abortions were publicized it be different to. As school shooting that kilsl 1 kids that you don;t hear about on the news doesn;t affect you at all.
or that if you are pro-choice you are pro-murder
How do you figure that is abortion "systemic", exactly? And how does a woman getting an abortion affect you? I don't understand. If it were publicized... eerrr... :? And even if it did affect you, how does that trump a woman deciding on what is inside her own body?
Yep, that's true.